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Old January 22, 2020, 08:21 PM   #51
zoo
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Quote:
My decision not to drink is primarily based on the fact that I do carry, though I don't drink much in general anyway. I've only been even moderately "drunk" twice in my life, just doesn't appeal much to me.
Bigbl87,

So you generally only drink at home, you "don't drink much anyway," you have only been "drunk twice in your life," and that is your reasoning for continuing to go heeled in bars?

No offense but your logic strikes me as being somewhat disingenuous, a little arrogant, and a tad self-serving.

I drink booze a lot. Really, I'll probably need a new liver if I would like to live past 80. I've also been drunk far more times than I could ever possibly recall probably due to the death at least in part to many brain cells.

Yet I opt not to go to bars armed even though I am capable and often do refrain from consuming said alcoholic beverages at home or otherwise which actually occurs often these days. (Ain't a young man anymore, don't you know).

Frankly, the wisdom as to whether or not to carry a firearm into a barroom situation is not particularly native to folks who "only drink a little" or have "only been drunk once or twice in their lives." Nor does such reasoning hold a lot of water.

And once again, no offense, but the explanation you provided doesn’t lend itself well to the wisdom in your apparent position that packin in bars makes a lot of sense; even for folks such as yourself and maybe particularly so regarding folks such as yourself.

Last edited by zoo; January 22, 2020 at 08:27 PM.
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Old January 22, 2020, 10:35 PM   #52
davidsog
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None existed beforehand? I'm well aware that the presence of a firearm can elevate the threat and escalate situations that may have been minor. At the same time, at a bar in my state two patrons got into a fist fight outside. One took a blow to the head, fell on the sidewalk the right way, and died from the head trauma he received. The bar subsequently lost its license and was sued for overserving. Lethal outcomes can certainly exist without the presence of a firearm.
Well....

Quote:
I'm well aware that the presence of a firearm can elevate the threat and escalate situations that may have been minor.
Thanks for proving you are the smartest guy in the room and nobody else is aware that:

Quote:
Lethal outcomes can certainly exist without the presence of a firearm.


None of which changes my point of mixing weapons and alcohol:

Quote:
the presence of a firearm can elevate the threat and escalate situations that may have been minor.
Because the topic of the thread is bars and CCW not the myrid of other non-alcohol related lethal outcomes that involve anything else outside of a CCW firearm.

I would direct you the "other lethal" forum but as I am not a member of that forum only this firearm one.....you will have to find it yourself.

Last edited by davidsog; January 22, 2020 at 10:41 PM.
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Old January 23, 2020, 02:46 AM   #53
J.G. Terry
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Avoid high risk situations.

My LEO friends tell me 90% of their calls were alcohol related. That's the old days. It's a no brainer about alcohol and firearms.

Going into a place where the band is behind chicken wire and the bars in the windows are on the inside? How about the pictures screwed to the walls? Be mindful of the environment. Down here, a real dive is where if unarmed a knife and/or a gun is issued. How about being asked by the police, "Exactly what were you doing in the bar with a gun." Avoid high risk situations.

How do police respond when told ,"....I only had two beer's'."
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Old January 23, 2020, 08:24 AM   #54
TunnelRat
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Quote:
Originally Posted by davidsog View Post
Well....







Thanks for proving you are the smartest guy in the room and nobody else is aware that:











None of which changes my point of mixing weapons and alcohol:







Because the topic of the thread is bars and CCW not the myrid of other non-alcohol related lethal outcomes that involve anything else outside of a CCW firearm.



I would direct you the "other lethal" forum but as I am not a member of that forum only this firearm one.....you will have to find it yourself.
I'm not sure how stating what I did is proving I am the smartest guy in the room. Acknowledging something before making another point is pretty common in a discussion.

The example I gave is alcohol related to go with this topic, though this isn't the alcohol forum. This is a tactics subforum. Some tactics apply both when and when not carrying a firearm and to me deescalation is one of those.

There have been comments that if you keep firearms out of the equation when you're around alcohol (not even consuming it but around others that are consuming it) you'll be safer. On the whole I can see that point as I said in the prior post, but I feel like it's worth mentioning it's not a guarantee. Some may consider that obvious but I bring it up for a reason. Alcohol in many localities is served practically everywhere. Unless you're going to avoid the public in its entirety then you're going to run into people intoxicated or people that are just looking for trouble. Yes, mitigation by avoiding concentrations of problem people is a good idea but avoidance isn't always completely possible. My point is having plans for deescalation while carrying a firearm is an important part of carrying a firearm. From the example I gave above it can be an important part of just interacting with people in general as even a fight without firearms can have a lethal outcome.

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Last edited by TunnelRat; January 23, 2020 at 09:20 AM.
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Old January 23, 2020, 09:54 AM   #55
zeke
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In Wi you can carry in a bar, if you don't drink. I don't drink, don't "hang" in bars and very occasionally go to bar for lunch/dinner while carrying. Once a week go to bar for breakfast, while carrying. Have had a alcohol free beer in a bar once, and kept the bottle identifying it as such in front of me. Rethinking this, may not have been a good idea.

IMO even considering having one beer where legal limits exist is playing with uncertainty and very ill advised.
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Old January 23, 2020, 10:30 AM   #56
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When the discussion shifts to arguing about who is the smartest person in the room, there's nothing more to be learned.

Closed.
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Old January 23, 2020, 10:30 AM   #57
davidsog
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Quote:
IMO even considering having one beer where legal limits exist is playing with uncertainty and very ill advised.
Outside of a mass shooting the optics are just horrible. When you start off your self defense story with "I was at this Bar...." and it ends with "then I shot him" it is just not going to brief well to a Jury.
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