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February 24, 2016, 08:37 PM | #26 | |
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Your hammer metaphor is skipping over the fact that a heavier buffer allows the gas pressure to drop before the bolt unlocks. This means that the carrier and buffer move rearward with less force to begin with. This is common knowledge in the AR world: On an AR with the proper buffer weight, the buffer will hit the back of the carrier with less force than it will on an AR with a buffer that's too light. Period.
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0331: "Accuracy by volume." Last edited by Theohazard; February 24, 2016 at 09:00 PM. |
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February 24, 2016, 08:45 PM | #27 | |
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February 25, 2016, 08:38 AM | #28 |
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Covering up the problem still isn't a solution. I still disagree that a heavier buffer is the solution if the problem isn't directly related to case rim damage.
The REAL problem is over gassing and the solution is adjusting the amount of gas. Trial and error, guessing, analogies are worthless until the actual amount of change/difference is put on paper. Estimates, personal perceptions, or past experiences MAY work but technically may not be the correct answer. Slow motion cameras are readily available that can be used to determine the exact amount of delay and even give a viable approximation of the bolt speed. Sensors could easily be located in the buffer tube to give exact figures on impact force. Basically, until I see the numbers, I'm going to be skeptical of the answers. I'm done. |
February 25, 2016, 10:26 AM | #29 | |
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February 25, 2016, 06:57 PM | #30 |
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Because Colt buffers are hard to find. Right now every website I can find shows that Colt buffers are out of stock.
I just ordered some buffers from Stagg Arms. This gun is my favorite shooter M16/AR.
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February 26, 2016, 03:33 AM | #31 | ||||
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When the Army developed the M4A1, they had issues with the carrier moving too fast and they also had issues with bolt carrier bounce (since the M4A1 is capable of full-auto, these problems were a lot more noticable than they were on the three-round-burst M4). The Army's solution for this was to switch from an H buffer to a heavier H2 buffer in all M4A1s. Quote:
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0331: "Accuracy by volume." Last edited by Theohazard; February 26, 2016 at 03:43 AM. |
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February 26, 2016, 03:35 AM | #32 | |
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February 26, 2016, 06:43 AM | #33 | |
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So basically, in post #28 you're admitting that a heavier buffer can fix issues of case rim damage due to overgassing. And the reason it fixes that problem is because a heavier buffer slows the carrier down and delays unlocking, allowing the gas pressure to drop before the case is extracted. But you're also claiming that a heavier buffer doesn't fix overgassing issues and doesn't delay the bolt unlocking. So basically, your argument is that a heavier buffer is a solution for overgassing issues but it's not a solution for overgassing issues? That doesn't make any sense at all.
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February 26, 2016, 09:31 AM | #34 |
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"So basically, in post #28 you're admitting that a heavier buffer can fix issues of case rim damage due to overgassing. And the reason it fixes that problem is because a heavier buffer slows the carrier down and delays unlocking, allowing the gas pressure to drop before the case is extracted. But you're also claiming that a heavier buffer doesn't fix overgassing issues and doesn't delay the bolt unlocking. So basically, your argument is that a heavier buffer is a solution for overgassing issues but it's not a solution for overgassing issues? That doesn't make any sense at all."
I said I was DONE but I can't resist this challenge. A heavier buffer IS part of the answer to resolving RIM DAMAGE. A heavier buffer isn't the remedy for overgassing. Are you at all aware of what momentum is? It relates to weight, speed, and applied force. If you read any of the older books about shooting, bullet weight, and ballistics, you'll encounter theories of heavier, slower bullets projecting more force(power/energy) on target than lighter, faster bullets. Silhouette shooters quickly discovered that heavier but slower bullets knocked targets down better than lighter, faster bullets of same caliber. While a lighter buffer accelerates faster at the beginning of the operating cycle, it also decelerates quicker when working against the buffer spring over time. A heavier buffer accelerates slower but retains it's speed(energy) longer while compressing the buffer spring. The momentum of the heavier buffer may increase the force applied at the end of the cycling stroke vs a lighter buffer. The DI system isn't an instant application of force. The gas maintains pressure for an amount of time dependant of gas port size, location, "dwell time", powder type, bullet velocity-basically a LOT of factors. I don't profess to be an AR "guru", I DO have considerable knowledge of physics, mechanics, and such which can be applied to the function of firearms. There is no denying that a heavier buffer slows the cyclic rate due to it's resistance to directional change(inertia) at both ends of the cycle. There's also no denying that this weight increases the impact at both ends of this cycle. It's the laws of physics. Now, I'm REALLY DONE. Thanks all for your patience. |
February 26, 2016, 12:39 PM | #35 | ||
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How many times do I have to explain that a heavier buffer delays the opening of the bolt, allowing the gas pressure to drop? That means that a heavier buffer goes to the rear with less force to begin with. Yet you keep ignoring this when you repeatedly bring up this argument. The ridiculous thing here is that by admitting this delay helps resolve issues with rim damage, you're admitting that this delay takes place to begin with. I honestly don't know what to say to this; I already tried to explain it multiple times. I've provided several links that confirm what I've said. And the internet is full of many more reputable sources that further back up what I've said. And yet you're still claiming I'm wrong even though you've demonstrated that you don't have a very good understanding of how the AR works. Like I said before, there's a point where skepticism becomes denialism, and you seem to have passed it several posts ago.
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0331: "Accuracy by volume." Last edited by Theohazard; February 26, 2016 at 12:55 PM. |
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February 27, 2016, 10:12 AM | #36 |
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Examine fired cases and see if you are getting evidence of the rim of the case being deformed by the extractor.
I had a 16" barrel one and the figured out the gas port in the barrel was too big. I talked to my engineering contacts at Rock Island and they told me the first run or two of the shorty barrels and the same gas port size as normal barrel. They reduced the port size on later issues.
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February 27, 2016, 10:20 AM | #37 |
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M16A1- I read over at AR15.com that my 14.5" carbine had a larger gas port and different location then the smaller port 20" rifle of that vintage. Anyone know if true??
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February 27, 2016, 08:57 PM | #38 | |
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Disclaimer: I don't know where this info came from originally, but I've seen it posted in enough reputable places online that I tend to think it's probably accurate. Also, I think the military specifications for gas post size changed from the M16A1 to the M16A2, but I'm not sure of that. The best way to be sure you get the correct info is to sift through the actual technical specs for each type of rifle, and I don't have the patience for that at the moment .
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0331: "Accuracy by volume." Last edited by Theohazard; February 27, 2016 at 09:03 PM. |
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March 11, 2016, 12:42 AM | #39 |
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For some absurd reason, H2 and H3 buffers are out of stock at many places. There's a ridiculous buffer shortage. I could not find an H3 buffer that was in stock anywhere, so I ordered an H2 buffer that was allegedly in stock from Stagg Arms.
I'm going to call out Stagg Arms on this. I don't think their buffer was in stock because after waiting like two weeks, I finally got my H2 buffer today. Anyways, I took the M16 to the range tonight and tested it. The gun ran beautifully with the new buffer. The rate of fire seemed much slower with the H2 buffer. It was also surprisingly much quieter with the heavier H2 buffer. It was so quiet that the guy a few stalls down thought I was shooting a 300BLK. The 'thud' of the bullets hitting the ballistic mat was the loudest sound component. Very pleasant to shoot. I had no idea what I was missing by not using a heavier buffer! The top gun is an AR with an RDIAS that uses a standard buffer. The bottom gun is the H2 buffered M16. My guess is that they both now have about the same cyclic rate, whereas before, the M16 was crazy fast (there's a video I posted in an above post).
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March 11, 2016, 01:06 AM | #40 |
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Good to hear....
Enjoy em!! |
March 12, 2016, 11:04 AM | #41 |
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Tony, glad to hear. Theohazard, thank you for the chart.
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March 14, 2016, 01:47 AM | #42 |
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Tony, great to hear that the H2 buffer helped your overgassing problem. When you can get one, an H3 buffer might be even better. Let us know which one works better if you get a chance to try both.
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March 14, 2016, 02:04 AM | #43 | ||
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Quote:
https://www.atf.gov/news/pr/new-brit...-firearms-laws Quote:
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