Winchester experts needed for info. on a shotgun we've inherited

JacRyan · September 28, 2000, 10:14 AM

After about a year of sitting in my brother-in-laws basement, my wife and I finally have talked him into giving us her late father's shotgun. He had two guns and, given the choice I picked the Marlin 336SC lever action in 35 Rem. -- it was just a matter of time before we got the shotgun as he is not interested in guns.
I would like to use this shotgun as an introductory grouse gun. I'll get the over and under next season if I enjoy it. Any information anyone has as to this firearm would be greatly appreciated. I'd like to know current value (my guess is $50) and whether it is a good "beginner" grouse gun. If there are any modifications you'd suggest, please address whether you'd start modifying an inherited shotgun. My preference is to leave it as is in the condition my father-in-law left it. My guess is it was purchased by him in the mid-1950's, which was when he purchased his Marlin 336SC. Any general opinions on this shotgun would also be helpful (i.e., quality of action good/bad/indifferent, etc.).

The shotgun is inscribed with (not in order):
Winchester, Nickel Steel, Mod. 1912, 12 Gauge Full, 30" barrel including chamber (I wasn't sure how to measure a shotgun barrel), 12" stock, pump action, wood stock and forend, single bead on end of barrel, smooth bore, 50% finish with some rust pits on outside of barrel.

TIA

PS I was referred here from AR15.com after posting there. The link to that original thread is: http://forums.ar15.com/Forum3/HTML/019559.html)

Harley Nolden · September 28, 2000, 12:56 PM

Jacryn:
The model 12 was designed by T.C. Johnson and was the first slide action hammerless shotgun buitl by Winchester. Over 1,900.000 were sikd, It was a high quality well made shotgun that is still in use in the hunting and shooting fields across the country.

All model 12's were of the takedown variety and was dropped from regular product lin in 1963, but a special model was produced in the Custom Shop until 1979. In 1972 Winchester resurrected the model 12 in the regular production line in 12 ga only and ventilate the rib.

This reintroduced model was droppen in 1980. Pre-1964 models have serial numbers below 1968307. There are many combinations of this shotgun from standard grade to pigion grade.

Valus:
STANDARD GRADE=$600.00-$125.00
Featherweight= $500.00-$250.00
Skeet Gun $1,250.00-$350.00
Trap Gun $$800.00-$400.00
Heavy Duck $$750.00-$300.00
Pigeon Grade $1,950.00-$500.00

Bases upon your description I would suggest that you may have a standard grade.

HJN

JacRyan · September 28, 2000, 01:15 PM

The serial number seems low: 767XX. Thought it was bought in the '50's, but may be older. I'll have to send in to Winchester for historical info.

Would this be an appropriate gun for grouse? I've already been told to use only lead shot, which rules out waterfowl? It seems looooong -- at least compared to my preban AR15 carbine!

Dave McC · September 28, 2000, 03:48 PM

Congrats, you'be gotten two great guns. Your Model 12 is one of the best shotguns ever made. However, with that long, tight choked bbl you've not gotten the ideal grouse gun.

DON'T grab a hacksaw. There are some bbls out there that you can obtain and set up for grouse. Most grouse hunters want a short, light open choked shotgun that's fast. Plenty of them go for smaller gauges, I'm assuming this one's a 12.

IMO, you could set up a bbl with a short length, Cylinder choke or with a SKT I tube, and have a fairtomiddlin' grouse gun, combined with a good small shot shell.

A plus, that bbl would be good for home defense also.

johnbt · September 28, 2000, 04:59 PM

767xx = 1914. John

JacRyan · September 28, 2000, 05:38 PM

Wow, my father-in-law certainly got himself some top quality firearms! I've been enjoying the Marlin 336 SC at the range for informal target shooting (I don't hunt deer)and would like to set up the Model 12 for grouse hunting. Another barrel would work out very well because I could still put the gun back in it's original condition.

Anyone know where I could get a replacement barrel appropriate for grouse hunting? I want to jump on this in the next few weeks. And what length should I be looking for (remember, I come to you from AR15.com and think in 20, 16 and 14.5 inch increments

)?

Thank you all, you've been a great help!!

Steven Mace · September 28, 2000, 10:32 PM

JacRyan, based on the serial number you've posted, your Model 12 was made in 1938. Hope this helps!

Steve Mace

------------------
After today, its all historical

Dave McC · September 29, 2000, 05:19 AM

Jac,a bbl of 18-24 inches will work. Shotgun News and Gun Week may show sources of Model 12 bbls, but I'd call around to the local gun shops first.

johnbt · September 29, 2000, 07:01 AM

Steven - Made me look. He posted a 5-digit number. 1938 in Fjestad's Blue Book is a 6-digit number. John

Steven Mace · September 29, 2000, 07:39 AM

johnbt, you're right. My mistake! JacRyan, if your Model 12 does have a 5 digit serial number as you've indicated it would have been made in 1914. Sorry for the previous misinformation.

Steve Mace

------------------
After today, its all historical

jbc · December 14, 2008, 09:58 PM

I have a M 59 with a serial number 84714. Can anyone tell me the year it was made? I'm curious if this gun is pigeon grade.

hollywood marine · December 16, 2008, 12:45 AM

jac: You might try gunbroker.com/shotgun parts for your barrel. They usually hace several at auction. Note: You will nees several other parts besides the barrel to make them interchangesable, and the new barrel must be fitted by a competant gunsmith, Best of luck with your project. Let us know how it comes out.

September 28, 2000, 10:14 AM	#1
JacRyan Member Join Date: February 4, 2000 Posts: 20	After about a year of sitting in my brother-in-laws basement, my wife and I finally have talked him into giving us her late father's shotgun. He had two guns and, given the choice I picked the Marlin 336SC lever action in 35 Rem. -- it was just a matter of time before we got the shotgun as he is not interested in guns. I would like to use this shotgun as an introductory grouse gun. I'll get the over and under next season if I enjoy it. Any information anyone has as to this firearm would be greatly appreciated. I'd like to know current value (my guess is $50) and whether it is a good "beginner" grouse gun. If there are any modifications you'd suggest, please address whether you'd start modifying an inherited shotgun. My preference is to leave it as is in the condition my father-in-law left it. My guess is it was purchased by him in the mid-1950's, which was when he purchased his Marlin 336SC. Any general opinions on this shotgun would also be helpful (i.e., quality of action good/bad/indifferent, etc.). The shotgun is inscribed with (not in order): Winchester, Nickel Steel, Mod. 1912, 12 Gauge Full, 30" barrel including chamber (I wasn't sure how to measure a shotgun barrel), 12" stock, pump action, wood stock and forend, single bead on end of barrel, smooth bore, 50% finish with some rust pits on outside of barrel. TIA PS I was referred here from AR15.com after posting there. The link to that original thread is: http://forums.ar15.com/Forum3/HTML/019559.html)

September 28, 2000, 12:56 PM	#2
Harley Nolden Staff In Memoriam Join Date: January 8, 1999 Location: Brunswick,GA USA Posts: 1,884	Jacryn: The model 12 was designed by T.C. Johnson and was the first slide action hammerless shotgun buitl by Winchester. Over 1,900.000 were sikd, It was a high quality well made shotgun that is still in use in the hunting and shooting fields across the country. All model 12's were of the takedown variety and was dropped from regular product lin in 1963, but a special model was produced in the Custom Shop until 1979. In 1972 Winchester resurrected the model 12 in the regular production line in 12 ga only and ventilate the rib. This reintroduced model was droppen in 1980. Pre-1964 models have serial numbers below 1968307. There are many combinations of this shotgun from standard grade to pigion grade. Valus: STANDARD GRADE=$600.00-$125.00 Featherweight= $500.00-$250.00 Skeet Gun $1,250.00-$350.00 Trap Gun $$800.00-$400.00 Heavy Duck $$750.00-$300.00 Pigeon Grade $1,950.00-$500.00 Bases upon your description I would suggest that you may have a standard grade. HJN

September 28, 2000, 01:15 PM	#3
JacRyan Member Join Date: February 4, 2000 Posts: 20	The serial number seems low: 767XX. Thought it was bought in the '50's, but may be older. I'll have to send in to Winchester for historical info. Would this be an appropriate gun for grouse? I've already been told to use only lead shot, which rules out waterfowl? It seems looooong -- at least compared to my preban AR15 carbine!

September 28, 2000, 03:48 PM	#4
Dave McC Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 13, 1999 Location: Columbia, Md, USA Posts: 8,811	Congrats, you'be gotten two great guns. Your Model 12 is one of the best shotguns ever made. However, with that long, tight choked bbl you've not gotten the ideal grouse gun. DON'T grab a hacksaw. There are some bbls out there that you can obtain and set up for grouse. Most grouse hunters want a short, light open choked shotgun that's fast. Plenty of them go for smaller gauges, I'm assuming this one's a 12. IMO, you could set up a bbl with a short length, Cylinder choke or with a SKT I tube, and have a fairtomiddlin' grouse gun, combined with a good small shot shell. A plus, that bbl would be good for home defense also.

September 28, 2000, 04:59 PM	#5
johnbt Senior Member Join Date: December 6, 1999 Location: Richmond, Virginia USA Posts: 6,004	767xx = 1914. John

September 28, 2000, 05:38 PM	#6
JacRyan Member Join Date: February 4, 2000 Posts: 20	Wow, my father-in-law certainly got himself some top quality firearms! I've been enjoying the Marlin 336 SC at the range for informal target shooting (I don't hunt deer)and would like to set up the Model 12 for grouse hunting. Another barrel would work out very well because I could still put the gun back in it's original condition. Anyone know where I could get a replacement barrel appropriate for grouse hunting? I want to jump on this in the next few weeks. And what length should I be looking for (remember, I come to you from AR15.com and think in 20, 16 and 14.5 inch increments )? Thank you all, you've been a great help!!

September 28, 2000, 10:32 PM	#7
Steven Mace Senior Member Join Date: November 15, 1999 Location: Clifton, Colorado USA Posts: 724	JacRyan, based on the serial number you've posted, your Model 12 was made in 1938. Hope this helps! Steve Mace ------------------ After today, its all historical

September 29, 2000, 05:19 AM	#8
Dave McC Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 13, 1999 Location: Columbia, Md, USA Posts: 8,811	Jac,a bbl of 18-24 inches will work. Shotgun News and Gun Week may show sources of Model 12 bbls, but I'd call around to the local gun shops first.

September 29, 2000, 07:01 AM	#9
johnbt Senior Member Join Date: December 6, 1999 Location: Richmond, Virginia USA Posts: 6,004	Steven - Made me look. He posted a 5-digit number. 1938 in Fjestad's Blue Book is a 6-digit number. John

September 29, 2000, 07:39 AM	#10
Steven Mace Senior Member Join Date: November 15, 1999 Location: Clifton, Colorado USA Posts: 724	johnbt, you're right. My mistake! JacRyan, if your Model 12 does have a 5 digit serial number as you've indicated it would have been made in 1914. Sorry for the previous misinformation. Steve Mace ------------------ After today, its all historical

December 14, 2008, 09:58 PM	#11
jbc Junior Member Join Date: December 14, 2008 Posts: 1	I have a M 59 with a serial number 84714. Can anyone tell me the year it was made? I'm curious if this gun is pigeon grade.

December 16, 2008, 12:45 AM	#12
hollywood marine Junior Member Join Date: December 16, 2008 Posts: 6	jac: You might try gunbroker.com/shotgun parts for your barrel. They usually hace several at auction. Note: You will nees several other parts besides the barrel to make them interchangesable, and the new barrel must be fitted by a competant gunsmith, Best of luck with your project. Let us know how it comes out.