Remmie .357/38 primers in factory loads

levrluvr · February 24, 2009, 12:26 AM

I was just thumbing through the '09 Remington sales catalog and noticed that they use a 1 1/2 primer in all of their .38special offerings and 5 1/2 primers in all of their .357mag ammo regardless of bullet grain weight (including the UMC line).
What is the reason that they use a different primer for .357? Do +P .38loadings from other mfg's use a mag primer? I was under the impression that a standard small pistol primer was adequate for .357 and .38 loads. Just curious......

SL1 · February 24, 2009, 07:13 AM

I have no information about why Remmington uses mag primers in all .357 Mag rounds. Maybe they prime the cases before they decide what to load in them. Maybe they always load their .357 Magnums with a powder like WW-296 that does require a magnum primer.

I notice that some old reloading manuals do the same thing, particularly old Speer manuals, but the new ones don't always use magnum primers for the .357. Maybe Remington has just lagged behind in the use of better information.

Anyway, what they do is irrelevant to what we should do. We should follow the data and/or powder manufacturer's advice about what type of primer to use in OUR loads. After all, Remington is not telling you what powder they are using, so the info you have on their cartridges is not proper REloading data.

SL1

levrluvr · February 24, 2009, 09:28 AM

thanks- I just found it odd that they did that across their entire line of ammunition and it differed from what is seen in reloading manuals.

kraigwy · February 24, 2009, 10:13 AM

I think we kind of touched on this a bit yesterday in discussing the shortage of standard small pistol primers.

I like many here have trouble finding small pistol primers. I was able to get 5K small pistol Mag primers but I shoot a heck of a lot of mild 38 target loads (148 grn WCs using 231. I checked with CCI, Rem and Sierra. CCI says their magnum primers are 10% hotter then the standard primers. Sierra says to reduce any load 5% if switching to magnum from standard primers. Remington is as you mentioned above.

So what it amounts to, you can use mag. primers in any pistol combination, IF YOU ADJUST THE POWDER ACCORDING. Remington uses their Mag primers in their 357s where our reloading manuels DONT. But Remington dosnt use the same powder charge we do. They have labs to test pressure & such where we only have brass to check for pressure signs. They can safetly get buy with more then we can.

What I do, is take the 5% sierra mention, (no one else gave me a Number to start with), and reduce my loads according. Get out the crony and work my power charge until I get the same velocity I got with standard primers. I don't load anywhere close to HOT, with my pistols. I'm looking for consistancy. I shot the same 38 loads for years and I like them, (in my Model 52 Smith WC gun for bullseye and practice loads for my 642 pocket pistol). I figure if I can get them to shoot in my 52 with the same accuracy as my non-mag primers I'm happy.

In 357s I do the same thing. For large pistols it dosnt seem to matter because I have lots of the standard primers and there still seem to be some out there.

What really sucks is the small rifle primers, try to find match primers. I go through a lot of them in my high power shooting and practicing for HP.

The only thing we can do is Carefully Make Do, and grab every primer you can find.

WESHOOT2 · February 24, 2009, 10:57 AM

Remington develops their loads with those specific components.
No big deal.

Examine Hodgdon's 2009 357 Magnum data; they developed all their 357 loads using (inarguably the very-'hottest') Winchester's Small Pistol Magnum primer.

crowbeaner · February 24, 2009, 06:44 PM

If you've ever used IMR 4227 in the 38 and 357, you'll notice a bit of unburned powder in the barrel. Evidently RP figures that by using the hotter primer in the 357 loadings, they will eliminate some of the wasted powder and reduce the amount left in the barrel. They DO however have access to powders that you and the rest of us in the reloading world don't have access to. I've used magnum primers with some loads utilizing 4227 and they do seem to burn cleaner than with a standard primer.

February 24, 2009, 12:26 AM	#1
levrluvr Senior Member Join Date: January 7, 2009 Location: no. IL Posts: 276	Remmie .357/38 primers in factory loads I was just thumbing through the '09 Remington sales catalog and noticed that they use a 1 1/2 primer in all of their .38special offerings and 5 1/2 primers in all of their .357mag ammo regardless of bullet grain weight (including the UMC line). What is the reason that they use a different primer for .357? Do +P .38loadings from other mfg's use a mag primer? I was under the impression that a standard small pistol primer was adequate for .357 and .38 loads. Just curious......

February 24, 2009, 10:13 AM	#4
kraigwy Senior Member Join Date: June 16, 2008 Location: Wyoming Posts: 11,061	I think we kind of touched on this a bit yesterday in discussing the shortage of standard small pistol primers. I like many here have trouble finding small pistol primers. I was able to get 5K small pistol Mag primers but I shoot a heck of a lot of mild 38 target loads (148 grn WCs using 231. I checked with CCI, Rem and Sierra. CCI says their magnum primers are 10% hotter then the standard primers. Sierra says to reduce any load 5% if switching to magnum from standard primers. Remington is as you mentioned above. So what it amounts to, you can use mag. primers in any pistol combination, IF YOU ADJUST THE POWDER ACCORDING. Remington uses their Mag primers in their 357s where our reloading manuels DONT. But Remington dosnt use the same powder charge we do. They have labs to test pressure & such where we only have brass to check for pressure signs. They can safetly get buy with more then we can. What I do, is take the 5% sierra mention, (no one else gave me a Number to start with), and reduce my loads according. Get out the crony and work my power charge until I get the same velocity I got with standard primers. I don't load anywhere close to HOT, with my pistols. I'm looking for consistancy. I shot the same 38 loads for years and I like them, (in my Model 52 Smith WC gun for bullseye and practice loads for my 642 pocket pistol). I figure if I can get them to shoot in my 52 with the same accuracy as my non-mag primers I'm happy. In 357s I do the same thing. For large pistols it dosnt seem to matter because I have lots of the standard primers and there still seem to be some out there. What really sucks is the small rifle primers, try to find match primers. I go through a lot of them in my high power shooting and practicing for HP. The only thing we can do is Carefully Make Do, and grab every primer you can find. __________________ Kraig Stuart CPT USAR Ret USAMU Sniper School Distinguished Rifle Badge 1071

February 24, 2009, 10:57 AM	#5
WESHOOT2 Senior Member Join Date: February 20, 1999 Location: home on the range; Vermont (Caspian country) Posts: 14,324	why Remington develops their loads with those specific components. No big deal. Examine Hodgdon's 2009 357 Magnum data; they developed all their 357 loads using (inarguably the very-'hottest') Winchester's Small Pistol Magnum primer. __________________ . "all my ammo is mostly retired factory ammo"

February 24, 2009, 06:44 PM	#6
crowbeaner Senior Member Join Date: June 4, 2007 Location: Upstate SC Posts: 1,943	If you've ever used IMR 4227 in the 38 and 357, you'll notice a bit of unburned powder in the barrel. Evidently RP figures that by using the hotter primer in the 357 loadings, they will eliminate some of the wasted powder and reduce the amount left in the barrel. They DO however have access to powders that you and the rest of us in the reloading world don't have access to. I've used magnum primers with some loads utilizing 4227 and they do seem to burn cleaner than with a standard primer. __________________ If you want your children to follow in your footsteps, be careful where you walk. Beware the man that only owns one gun; he probably knows how to use it. I just hope my ship comes in before my dock rots.

February 24, 2009, 07:13 AM	#2
SL1 Senior Member Join Date: November 8, 2007 Posts: 2,001	I have no information about why Remmington uses mag primers in all .357 Mag rounds. Maybe they prime the cases before they decide what to load in them. Maybe they always load their .357 Magnums with a powder like WW-296 that does require a magnum primer. I notice that some old reloading manuals do the same thing, particularly old Speer manuals, but the new ones don't always use magnum primers for the .357. Maybe Remington has just lagged behind in the use of better information. Anyway, what they do is irrelevant to what we should do. We should follow the data and/or powder manufacturer's advice about what type of primer to use in OUR loads. After all, Remington is not telling you what powder they are using, so the info you have on their cartridges is not proper REloading data. SL1

February 24, 2009, 09:28 AM	#3
levrluvr Senior Member Join Date: January 7, 2009 Location: no. IL Posts: 276	thanks- I just found it odd that they did that across their entire line of ammunition and it differed from what is seen in reloading manuals.