How much $ to start loading? - Page 2

Pathfinder45 · April 18, 2016, 11:48 AM

There are a wide range of replies here across the spectrum of members experiences. I like what Machineguntony had to say; so different from what works for me. His name says it all. My set-up would never work for him. A bench-rest shooter, long-range shooter, hunter, etc., could all go fairly minimalist. But some pursuits simply require a lot of ammo to be consumed, therefore, more progressive and perhaps automated reloading equipment becomes increasingly necessary to keep up with the demand. Most people who take up reloading will want more equipment than what I use. From Pete2's post, I would think that's an excellent place to be for most reloaders. I am at the place where I both save money by reloading, and shoot more than I could otherwise afford. I could use my stuff in a log cabin in the woods with no electricity. Give me a good backpack, a fishing rod, a decent gun or two, and a pick-up truck that will get me to the trailhead and I'm good. I really don't want much more than that; certainly nothing that gets in the way of that. But YOU will want more..............

briandg · April 18, 2016, 01:12 PM

If I can just address the elephant in the room, please avoid lee equipment. You are wanting to make a single time, lifelong investment.

I would recommend nearly any other press, one with an O frame, cast iron (not pot metal).
A four hole turret will be very handy, as switching out dies as you fool around with something can be a lot of time. Get a hand priming press. a scale is mandatory, and I would suggest a digital, I guess. A pair of calipers is mandatory. A kit isn't such a bad idea. a top grade measure such as the rcbs uniflow is mandatory. I'm thinking about my bench, and can't think of much right now.

Get a dozen boxes to fit your ammo, large rifle, medium rifle, pistol fifty count, etc, and an assortment of loading blocks. You can actually use the common .45 acp ammo blocks that wind up on the ground at the range. Pick up about five sets of safety glasses, industrial bulk. Get a magnifying glass, and reading glasses. lens cleaning materials; if you are looking over dirty glasses when that primer blows and throws flaming powder over your face, why bother wearing them?

Im going to recommend the kit, hornady, redding, lyman, rcbs, there are others out there.

Don't waste your time buying cheap equipment! you want to make good ammo, you want it to last, you want it to work. THIS STUFF IS CHEAP! what have you spent on ammo or firearms over the past ten years? is dropping a few hundred on a press and equipment an insane thing to do, compared to the thousands of dollars that you have probably spent in the past decade? maybe you're someone who owns a great truck. Did you cut corners on your vehicle to the point that you're afraid of your tires? paying for middle or high grade equpment only costs 20-40% of what your basic stuff sells for. If you are used to good tools, you will appreciate it. then again, maybe youre the kind of guy who has a hammer in the kithen drawer next to a battery operated screwdriver, and having top drawer products doesnt matter. It's your choice, but a lot of people will agree with this, but there will be a number of people who don't

T. O'Heir · April 18, 2016, 01:14 PM

Okinawa, Japan a temporary location? It'll affect anything you do and how much it'll cost, if it's not. Lot of companies won't ship to Japan(assuming Japan lets it in to start with.) but if they do, it'll be really friggin' expensive.
Anyway, look into one of the Beginner's Kits. Gives you everything you need less dies and shell holder. (The 6.5 Creedmoor, .243 and .308 all use the same shell holder.)
Partial to RCBS kit myself, but the brand really doesn't make much difference, except for the warrantee. RCBS's is on the kit, forever. Anything breaks, they fix or replace it even if you buy used kit(used is ok. Isn't like buying a used car). Not all brands stand behind their stuff as well. Usually one or two years only and not on used stuff.
The kits come with a manual but buy a Lyman book too. More versatile than any bullet or powder maker's book. Lee's is Hodgdon's data. Lee tests nothing themselves. The assorted bullet makers give data for their stuff only. Mind you, you load according to the bullet weight, not who made it or its shape, etc.
"...is VERY slow on a single die press..." Speed with a single stage press is about technique.

Pathfinder45 · April 18, 2016, 02:03 PM

I have never used a Lee press, so I can't comment on that. But it may not be fair to say that everything made by Lee is junk. I consider the Lee Factory Crimp Die to be a must-have for caliber like 30-30. I also like their double-cavity moulds, as well as their cases trimmers.

Road_Clam · April 18, 2016, 04:28 PM

I started out by buying the RCBS master supreme kit (I believe RCBS has a $50 rebate promo). Spent several years getting experience with the single stage, then about a year ago my wife took interest in handgun so now I needed to speed up pistol ammo loading a bit. I recently purchased the LEE classic turret for 9mm, .40 s&w , 460 s&w mag, and 223. turrets are not as fast as progressives but still a major step past a single. and I bought a complete Lee turret setup used for $150.

RC20 · April 18, 2016, 05:38 PM

The cost problem is you reload may (eventually) cost less but you shoot MORE!

Buy used equipment. to start.

I am also a minimalist but if you get a used RCBS Junior, Rockchucjer or the like you will find out if you like it.

There is always use for a singe stage press on any bench.

Get a low cost electric scale, Hornady makes one, Frankfurt makes one (pm me if you need the right way to use them, once you do it they are fine). I like the Franfurth as it loads better using a trickler and you can still see the display right.

I would skip the balance scale as you get calibrated weights with the electronic to check it.

I know some think its hearsay, but even if you go with a beam eventually, the digital scale has all sorts of sues.

Check a round (powder or no? Easy, put it on the scale, compare it to the rest and (short of a 9mm) the difference will jump out.

Need to check a bullet to see if its 115 gr or 125? Easy as well.

I have two balance scales but only because I had one and was given the other.

Ok to cross check but a pain if you need to find weights, no plans to ever got back.

briandg · April 18, 2016, 08:59 PM

There is something to consider. A progressive press is probably the fastest, but unless you are laying up thousands of rounds every few months, hundreds at a time, I don't k ow if you will find it to be profitable. Constantly changing dies and setting up charges is going to be a pain either. Way, but doing it a few boxes at a time I'm relatively certain that using either a single stage or turret press will probably make you happy.

Something to keep in m I nd, if you intend to load larger rifle rounds, a progressive press isn't what you want for your only press. There is no reason to avoid a good turret press, I own both, but only rarely use the turret. Why don't I use the turret? The only reason I avoid it is that it's at the other end of the bench and I'm too lazy to move my chair.

Two more things, and I'm calling it good.some people swear that you must have the absolute best press to get a accuracy, and that really isn't try. As long as it's properly bored and set up, your ammo will be fine. Dies are more important to processing than setting offer a half grand into a press. After that, components are important, don't expect absolute accuracy without going the extra mile buying and tuning the best components.

This is where your savings come in. Top grade ammo for example, .30-06 will cost two bucks or more, but that same cartridge can be loaded for less than half that price. If you made the mistake of buying a 257 Roberts or .300 h&h, loading your own allows you the chance to load and fire in bulk.

Pathfinder45 · April 18, 2016, 11:06 PM

Good point about the scale, RC20. I just use an inexpensive Dillon/Ohaus balance scale. It works fine for getting your charge weight correct, but for weigh-sorting cases, it's pretty slow to have to constantly slide the weights back and forth on it. Perhaps there is a digital electronic scale in my future after all. Are there any good ones that are made in USA, or at least not made in some country that is not likely to remain one of our friends in the future?

Jeffm004 · April 19, 2016, 05:32 AM

I too have perused the firing line from Okinawa. If you are on base you cannot beat the MWR (or whatever they call it now) tour & activity programs. Be sure you do stuff

You will see it many times here, buy once, cry once.

I have run a 550 for 30 years. I am knee deep in ammo with little effort. At the low end, a 9mm conversion takes 2,000 rounds to break even on a caliber conversion. The 45-70, about 200. I am moving to a 650, keeping the 550.

This link has a lot of info:

http://www.brianenos.com/index.html

I advise those interested, you have to like it. If you do not like it, if it is a drudgery, don't do it. Cus you are not going to do it.

If you are on the Air Force side and ever end up at WPAFB PM me.

April 18, 2016, 01:12 PM	#27
briandg Senior Member Join Date: May 4, 2010 Posts: 5,468	If I can just address the elephant in the room, please avoid lee equipment. You are wanting to make a single time, lifelong investment. I would recommend nearly any other press, one with an O frame, cast iron (not pot metal). A four hole turret will be very handy, as switching out dies as you fool around with something can be a lot of time. Get a hand priming press. a scale is mandatory, and I would suggest a digital, I guess. A pair of calipers is mandatory. A kit isn't such a bad idea. a top grade measure such as the rcbs uniflow is mandatory. I'm thinking about my bench, and can't think of much right now. Get a dozen boxes to fit your ammo, large rifle, medium rifle, pistol fifty count, etc, and an assortment of loading blocks. You can actually use the common .45 acp ammo blocks that wind up on the ground at the range. Pick up about five sets of safety glasses, industrial bulk. Get a magnifying glass, and reading glasses. lens cleaning materials; if you are looking over dirty glasses when that primer blows and throws flaming powder over your face, why bother wearing them? Im going to recommend the kit, hornady, redding, lyman, rcbs, there are others out there. Don't waste your time buying cheap equipment! you want to make good ammo, you want it to last, you want it to work. THIS STUFF IS CHEAP! what have you spent on ammo or firearms over the past ten years? is dropping a few hundred on a press and equipment an insane thing to do, compared to the thousands of dollars that you have probably spent in the past decade? maybe you're someone who owns a great truck. Did you cut corners on your vehicle to the point that you're afraid of your tires? paying for middle or high grade equpment only costs 20-40% of what your basic stuff sells for. If you are used to good tools, you will appreciate it. then again, maybe youre the kind of guy who has a hammer in the kithen drawer next to a battery operated screwdriver, and having top drawer products doesnt matter. It's your choice, but a lot of people will agree with this, but there will be a number of people who don't __________________ None.

April 18, 2016, 01:14 PM	#28
T. O'Heir Senior Member Join Date: February 13, 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 12,453	Okinawa, Japan a temporary location? It'll affect anything you do and how much it'll cost, if it's not. Lot of companies won't ship to Japan(assuming Japan lets it in to start with.) but if they do, it'll be really friggin' expensive. Anyway, look into one of the Beginner's Kits. Gives you everything you need less dies and shell holder. (The 6.5 Creedmoor, .243 and .308 all use the same shell holder.) Partial to RCBS kit myself, but the brand really doesn't make much difference, except for the warrantee. RCBS's is on the kit, forever. Anything breaks, they fix or replace it even if you buy used kit(used is ok. Isn't like buying a used car). Not all brands stand behind their stuff as well. Usually one or two years only and not on used stuff. The kits come with a manual but buy a Lyman book too. More versatile than any bullet or powder maker's book. Lee's is Hodgdon's data. Lee tests nothing themselves. The assorted bullet makers give data for their stuff only. Mind you, you load according to the bullet weight, not who made it or its shape, etc. "...is VERY slow on a single die press..." Speed with a single stage press is about technique. __________________ Spelling and grammar count!

April 18, 2016, 04:28 PM	#30
Road_Clam Senior Member Join Date: November 21, 2013 Location: New Hampshire Posts: 1,695	I started out by buying the RCBS master supreme kit (I believe RCBS has a $50 rebate promo). Spent several years getting experience with the single stage, then about a year ago my wife took interest in handgun so now I needed to speed up pistol ammo loading a bit. I recently purchased the LEE classic turret for 9mm, .40 s&w , 460 s&w mag, and 223. turrets are not as fast as progressives but still a major step past a single. and I bought a complete Lee turret setup used for $150. __________________ "To be old an wise you must have been young and stupid"

April 18, 2016, 08:59 PM	#32
briandg Senior Member Join Date: May 4, 2010 Posts: 5,468	There is something to consider. A progressive press is probably the fastest, but unless you are laying up thousands of rounds every few months, hundreds at a time, I don't k ow if you will find it to be profitable. Constantly changing dies and setting up charges is going to be a pain either. Way, but doing it a few boxes at a time I'm relatively certain that using either a single stage or turret press will probably make you happy. Something to keep in m I nd, if you intend to load larger rifle rounds, a progressive press isn't what you want for your only press. There is no reason to avoid a good turret press, I own both, but only rarely use the turret. Why don't I use the turret? The only reason I avoid it is that it's at the other end of the bench and I'm too lazy to move my chair. Two more things, and I'm calling it good.some people swear that you must have the absolute best press to get a accuracy, and that really isn't try. As long as it's properly bored and set up, your ammo will be fine. Dies are more important to processing than setting offer a half grand into a press. After that, components are important, don't expect absolute accuracy without going the extra mile buying and tuning the best components. This is where your savings come in. Top grade ammo for example, .30-06 will cost two bucks or more, but that same cartridge can be loaded for less than half that price. If you made the mistake of buying a 257 Roberts or .300 h&h, loading your own allows you the chance to load and fire in bulk. __________________ None.

April 18, 2016, 11:48 AM	#26
Pathfinder45 Senior Member Join Date: January 7, 2008 Posts: 3,224	There are a wide range of replies here across the spectrum of members experiences. I like what Machineguntony had to say; so different from what works for me. His name says it all. My set-up would never work for him. A bench-rest shooter, long-range shooter, hunter, etc., could all go fairly minimalist. But some pursuits simply require a lot of ammo to be consumed, therefore, more progressive and perhaps automated reloading equipment becomes increasingly necessary to keep up with the demand. Most people who take up reloading will want more equipment than what I use. From Pete2's post, I would think that's an excellent place to be for most reloaders. I am at the place where I both save money by reloading, and shoot more than I could otherwise afford. I could use my stuff in a log cabin in the woods with no electricity. Give me a good backpack, a fishing rod, a decent gun or two, and a pick-up truck that will get me to the trailhead and I'm good. I really don't want much more than that; certainly nothing that gets in the way of that. But YOU will want more..............

April 18, 2016, 02:03 PM	#29
Pathfinder45 Senior Member Join Date: January 7, 2008 Posts: 3,224	I have never used a Lee press, so I can't comment on that. But it may not be fair to say that everything made by Lee is junk. I consider the Lee Factory Crimp Die to be a must-have for caliber like 30-30. I also like their double-cavity moulds, as well as their cases trimmers.

April 18, 2016, 05:38 PM	#31
RC20 Senior Member Join Date: April 10, 2008 Location: Alaska Posts: 7,014	The cost problem is you reload may (eventually) cost less but you shoot MORE! Buy used equipment. to start. I am also a minimalist but if you get a used RCBS Junior, Rockchucjer or the like you will find out if you like it. There is always use for a singe stage press on any bench. Get a low cost electric scale, Hornady makes one, Frankfurt makes one (pm me if you need the right way to use them, once you do it they are fine). I like the Franfurth as it loads better using a trickler and you can still see the display right. I would skip the balance scale as you get calibrated weights with the electronic to check it. I know some think its hearsay, but even if you go with a beam eventually, the digital scale has all sorts of sues. Check a round (powder or no? Easy, put it on the scale, compare it to the rest and (short of a 9mm) the difference will jump out. Need to check a bullet to see if its 115 gr or 125? Easy as well. I have two balance scales but only because I had one and was given the other. Ok to cross check but a pain if you need to find weights, no plans to ever got back.

April 18, 2016, 11:06 PM	#33
Pathfinder45 Senior Member Join Date: January 7, 2008 Posts: 3,224	Good point about the scale, RC20. I just use an inexpensive Dillon/Ohaus balance scale. It works fine for getting your charge weight correct, but for weigh-sorting cases, it's pretty slow to have to constantly slide the weights back and forth on it. Perhaps there is a digital electronic scale in my future after all. Are there any good ones that are made in USA, or at least not made in some country that is not likely to remain one of our friends in the future?

April 19, 2016, 05:32 AM	#34
Jeffm004 Senior Member Join Date: August 22, 2013 Location: SW Ohio Posts: 255	I too have perused the firing line from Okinawa. If you are on base you cannot beat the MWR (or whatever they call it now) tour & activity programs. Be sure you do stuff You will see it many times here, buy once, cry once. I have run a 550 for 30 years. I am knee deep in ammo with little effort. At the low end, a 9mm conversion takes 2,000 rounds to break even on a caliber conversion. The 45-70, about 200. I am moving to a 650, keeping the 550. This link has a lot of info: http://www.brianenos.com/index.html I advise those interested, you have to like it. If you do not like it, if it is a drudgery, don't do it. Cus you are not going to do it. If you are on the Air Force side and ever end up at WPAFB PM me.