Subsonic Hornet

zeisloft · June 2, 2006, 11:51 AM

Looking for a tried and tested true subsonic load for .22 hornet. Anyone have data? Nothing nefarious, and yes, I realize there is a host of commercially available subsonic .22s in long, short, and lr, but I’d like to push a heavier bullet. Rifle is basically a box stock Ruger 77/22. Any help or direction will be greatly appreciated.
~z

Leftoverdj · June 2, 2006, 12:15 PM

Stick with cast for this. There is a high risk of sticking jacketed bullets in rifle barrels at subsonic velocities. Cast are far less likely to stick and for easier to get out without damaging the barrel.

Can't help you with loads since my experience is with .25-20 Win.

zeisloft · June 2, 2006, 12:24 PM

thanks for the advice, any experience with a moly or waxed jacketed bullet in and around 1050fps?
~z

Rimrod · June 2, 2006, 12:31 PM

I have a load for .22 pellets if your interested, never tried cast bullets in it.

zeisloft · June 2, 2006, 01:28 PM

Thanks, but unless you know where I can get ahold of some 50 gn or heavier pellets, it would purely academic. However, it would be interesting. Post it or PM me if you would prefer.
DJ, I assume there is powder or powders that may be more applicable?
~z

Leftoverdj · June 2, 2006, 03:38 PM

Ask here. http://castboolits.gunloads.com/forumdisplay.php?f=8

Someone will have done what you want to do, and several will have moulds for the heavier .22 bullets.

You'll want to use a fast to medium ball pistol powder. Ball because flake and stick does not meter well in the less than 3 grain charges you'll be using. Two grains of WW 231 under a 50-55 grain cast and up by tenths would be my approach. Your barrel twist will determine what will stabilize, and I'm pretty sure that nothing heavier will. I know that 60 grain Aquila .22 lr will not in my 1-16" rifles.

joneb · June 2, 2006, 08:36 PM

I bought a Romanian trainer M1969 for $69 I hav'nt checked the twist rate but it shoots the Aguila 60gr sss just fine, no key holeing at 100yds . It shoots CCI stingers fine as well . Best 69 bucks I ever spent

918v · June 2, 2006, 11:12 PM

Quote:

Stick with cast for this. There is a high risk of sticking jacketed bullets in rifle barrels at subsonic velocities.

That's why the 300 Whisper is so popular, due to all those lead bullet being shot instead of those super dangerous Sierra Match Kings.

Dave Haven · June 2, 2006, 11:48 PM

Same with those 147 grain 9mm loads. And let's not forget the 230 grain .45ACP ball round.

Leftoverdj · June 3, 2006, 09:10 AM

Apples and oranges, 918v and Dave. Big difference between using known cartridges with proven loading data and striking out on your own from scratch. I'm not saying that a subsonic load for the .22 Hornet could not be developed with jacketed bullets, but it ain't the place to start with rifle length barrels.

918v · June 3, 2006, 10:16 AM

That is why you get a ballistic software program like Quick Load.

zeisloft · June 5, 2006, 05:16 PM

dj are you using a wad of some sort to keep the powder together?
~z

Leftoverdj · June 5, 2006, 07:43 PM

I don't use any kind of filler in cases as small as .25-20 or .22 Hornet. I have done so in larger cases, but see no need in small cases with fast powders. There ain't room for 2-3 grains of powder to hide.

Rimrod · June 5, 2006, 11:27 PM

Zeisloft,
The loads I mentioned from the Lyman cast bullet manual are using 2.0-3.0 grains for starting loads and they don't list a filler for them. They are starting with a velocity of about 1050-1060 using 2gr. of Red Dot or 2gr. 700X with a 45 gr. bullet. Mould no.225415. (this is listed as a 55 gr bullet in their #48 manual but retains the exact same data)

They list other powders but the starting velocity is higher with them.

Leftoverdj is correct in the lead bullet vs. jacketed debate and you will want to avoid using gas checks at extremely low velocities also.

MADISON · June 6, 2006, 09:25 AM

I don't think you can get down to 600 to 700 feet per second without the round tumbling. I have an 1850 [estimated] load for a 45 grain jacketed bullet.
4.1 grains of UNIQUE
You might iinvest in the little "Lee Shooter" program. It lets you take a load down to any velocity you choose, using your normal load powder.

zeisloft · June 6, 2006, 11:38 AM

Madison, I'm looking more in the 1050fps range. I dont know if I'd be comfortable moving a bullet as slow as 6-700fps for my purposes.
~z

June 2, 2006, 11:51 AM	#1
zeisloft Senior Member Join Date: June 7, 2005 Location: Amarillo TX Posts: 419	Subsonic Hornet Looking for a tried and tested true subsonic load for .22 hornet. Anyone have data? Nothing nefarious, and yes, I realize there is a host of commercially available subsonic .22s in long, short, and lr, but I’d like to push a heavier bullet. Rifle is basically a box stock Ruger 77/22. Any help or direction will be greatly appreciated. ~z __________________ A scalpel can be just as effective as a broadsword Obviously, Occam was not a reloader

June 2, 2006, 12:24 PM	#3
zeisloft Senior Member Join Date: June 7, 2005 Location: Amarillo TX Posts: 419	thanks for the advice, any experience with a moly or waxed jacketed bullet in and around 1050fps? ~z __________________ A scalpel can be just as effective as a broadsword Obviously, Occam was not a reloader

June 2, 2006, 01:28 PM	#5
zeisloft Senior Member Join Date: June 7, 2005 Location: Amarillo TX Posts: 419	Thanks, but unless you know where I can get ahold of some 50 gn or heavier pellets, it would purely academic. However, it would be interesting. Post it or PM me if you would prefer. DJ, I assume there is powder or powders that may be more applicable? ~z __________________ A scalpel can be just as effective as a broadsword Obviously, Occam was not a reloader

June 5, 2006, 05:16 PM	#12
zeisloft Senior Member Join Date: June 7, 2005 Location: Amarillo TX Posts: 419	dj are you using a wad of some sort to keep the powder together? ~z __________________ A scalpel can be just as effective as a broadsword Obviously, Occam was not a reloader

June 5, 2006, 11:27 PM	#14
Rimrod Senior Member Join Date: October 19, 2005 Location: Behind enemy lines Posts: 1,309	Zeisloft, The loads I mentioned from the Lyman cast bullet manual are using 2.0-3.0 grains for starting loads and they don't list a filler for them. They are starting with a velocity of about 1050-1060 using 2gr. of Red Dot or 2gr. 700X with a 45 gr. bullet. Mould no.225415. (this is listed as a 55 gr bullet in their #48 manual but retains the exact same data) They list other powders but the starting velocity is higher with them. Leftoverdj is correct in the lead bullet vs. jacketed debate and you will want to avoid using gas checks at extremely low velocities also. __________________ "... he held his gun as almost every man skilled in such matters preferred to hold one when in action, with a half bent elbow that brought the gun slightly in front of his body at about, or slightly above, the level of the waist." - Wyatt Earp from Wyatt Earp Frontier Marshall by Stuart N. Lake

June 2, 2006, 12:15 PM	#2
Leftoverdj Senior Member Join Date: October 15, 2004 Posts: 934	Stick with cast for this. There is a high risk of sticking jacketed bullets in rifle barrels at subsonic velocities. Cast are far less likely to stick and for easier to get out without damaging the barrel. Can't help you with loads since my experience is with .25-20 Win.

June 2, 2006, 12:31 PM	#4
Rimrod Senior Member Join Date: October 19, 2005 Location: Behind enemy lines Posts: 1,309	I have a load for .22 pellets if your interested, never tried cast bullets in it. __________________ "... he held his gun as almost every man skilled in such matters preferred to hold one when in action, with a half bent elbow that brought the gun slightly in front of his body at about, or slightly above, the level of the waist." - Wyatt Earp from Wyatt Earp Frontier Marshall by Stuart N. Lake

June 2, 2006, 03:38 PM	#6
Leftoverdj Senior Member Join Date: October 15, 2004 Posts: 934	Ask here. http://castboolits.gunloads.com/forumdisplay.php?f=8 Someone will have done what you want to do, and several will have moulds for the heavier .22 bullets. You'll want to use a fast to medium ball pistol powder. Ball because flake and stick does not meter well in the less than 3 grain charges you'll be using. Two grains of WW 231 under a 50-55 grain cast and up by tenths would be my approach. Your barrel twist will determine what will stabilize, and I'm pretty sure that nothing heavier will. I know that 60 grain Aquila .22 lr will not in my 1-16" rifles.

June 2, 2006, 08:36 PM	#7
joneb Senior Member Join Date: December 10, 2005 Location: Central , OR Posts: 1,888	I bought a Romanian trainer M1969 for $69 I hav'nt checked the twist rate but it shoots the Aguila 60gr sss just fine, no key holeing at 100yds . It shoots CCI stingers fine as well . Best 69 bucks I ever spent

June 2, 2006, 11:48 PM	#9
Dave Haven Senior Member Join Date: February 1, 2000 Location: near Flagstaff, AZ Posts: 790	Same with those 147 grain 9mm loads. And let's not forget the 230 grain .45ACP ball round.

June 3, 2006, 09:10 AM	#10
Leftoverdj Senior Member Join Date: October 15, 2004 Posts: 934	Apples and oranges, 918v and Dave. Big difference between using known cartridges with proven loading data and striking out on your own from scratch. I'm not saying that a subsonic load for the .22 Hornet could not be developed with jacketed bullets, but it ain't the place to start with rifle length barrels.

June 3, 2006, 10:16 AM	#11
918v Junior member Join Date: September 25, 2005 Posts: 1,372	That is why you get a ballistic software program like Quick Load.

June 5, 2006, 07:43 PM	#13
Leftoverdj Senior Member Join Date: October 15, 2004 Posts: 934	I don't use any kind of filler in cases as small as .25-20 or .22 Hornet. I have done so in larger cases, but see no need in small cases with fast powders. There ain't room for 2-3 grains of powder to hide.

June 6, 2006, 09:25 AM	#15
MADISON Senior Member Join Date: January 1, 2000 Location: Roanoke, Virginia Posts: 2,678	Subsonic in .22 Hornet I don't think you can get down to 600 to 700 feet per second without the round tumbling. I have an 1850 [estimated] load for a 45 grain jacketed bullet. 4.1 grains of UNIQUE You might iinvest in the little "Lee Shooter" program. It lets you take a load down to any velocity you choose, using your normal load powder.

June 6, 2006, 11:38 AM	#16
zeisloft Senior Member Join Date: June 7, 2005 Location: Amarillo TX Posts: 419	Madison, I'm looking more in the 1050fps range. I dont know if I'd be comfortable moving a bullet as slow as 6-700fps for my purposes. ~z __________________ A scalpel can be just as effective as a broadsword Obviously, Occam was not a reloader