new forum (don't shoot!)

**tyme** · December 4, 2002, 02:56 AM

In the spirit of asking Rich to consider new forums, how about...
an "incidents" forum dedicated to news articles about armed citizens preventing crime, and possibly armed criminal activity as well.

Right now they end up in L&P and General depending on the phase of the moon. It'd be very low volume compared to the other major forums.

Moderation would be a mixed bag - no danger of debates over most L&P issues. However, as such threads sometimes degenerate, there would be the occassional squabble over JBTs, executing criminals, "vigilante justice," and caliber wars. It would be nice to have all posts on those topics somewhere they could be more easily located.

**Rich Lucibella** · December 4, 2002, 08:05 AM

Let's see what the feedback is on this one before I respond.
Rich

HarryB · December 4, 2002, 09:24 AM

Sounds like a fine idea, especially for those doing research on RKBA. Most postings are done very well with source citations and or links provided. Usually good banter debating the merits and legal aspects of the incident follows. I'm for it!

pax · December 4, 2002, 09:36 AM

I dunno.

It'd be nice to see all the news in one place; on the other paw, some of the news stories threads turn out to be our most active discussions. Maybe putting 'em in their own forum would kill some of the discussion.

It would be nice to have some sort of guidelines as to where news stories belong. As it is now, too often they're duplicated all over the place.

pax

ahenry · December 4, 2002, 11:28 AM

I'm with Pax on this.

sm · December 4, 2002, 11:36 AM

perhaps if a topic in L&P or GD proves to be "hot" it could then be placed under "News Stories", or" Current Events".

This might be easier for searches for particular topic-dunno.

**Rich Lucibella** · December 4, 2002, 02:12 PM

I hate new Forums....they require some dedicated work to set up and delineate.

However, this is an idea worth looking at seriously, since it may help cut down on repeat posts of the same article or news tidbit.

Questions:
- Is this only for news reports of shootings and near shootings?
- Would a story about a bad LE shooting, posted in Legal be moved to the new forum?
- Would a "I just saw on Fox...." thread be moved there?
- Alternatively, would an "In-The-News" forum which cut across subject lines be easier to differentiate?
- Would tyme be willing to Moderate?

Rich

Correia · December 4, 2002, 03:00 PM

I don't think it is a bad idea at all.

But no offense to Tyme, but I think the man to talk to would be Drizzt. He posts more news stories than anybody else on TFL. I honestly don't know where he gets them all, but he has got to post like three or four gun related news stories every day.

**tyme** · December 4, 2002, 03:24 PM

1. Yes, that's what I was imagining - what do you mean by near shootings? Someone takes a handgun out from concealment? Don't those incidents happen 2.5 million times a year?

2. Yes, it would preempt either general or l&p classification (depending on whether it was just an incident with no legal issues or a questionable shooting). Right now both shootings and armed confrontations and confiscations seem to be posted quasi-randomly to either general or l&p.
3. I guess it depends on what you just saw on fox
4. Isn't most of l&p "in the news?"
5. If lack of moderators were the only thing preventing its existence, maybe.

What kinds of news stories would go?

LEO:
- good/bad shoots (yes)
- good/bad gunfire (yes)
- armed incursions (maybe)
- confiscation (maybe)
non-leo:
- good/bad shoots (yes)
- good/bad gunfire (yes)
- brandishings against police/fire/public workers (maybe)
- citizen brandishings to prevent crimes (maybe)
- irresponsible brandishings (maybe)
- court cases (no)

Ideas? If the maybes are out, the division between gendisc/l&p/incidents becomes clear - shots fired vs not. Maybe "incidents" isn't such a good forum name. Or it could include all "armed confrontations." Or it could be an all-inclusive news story forum, but what exactly becomes "news?" A new essay on CATO? A newly released Lott study that provokes a story in the NYT or Washington Post?

**Rich Lucibella** · December 4, 2002, 06:25 PM

Well now you demonstrate the murkiness of the lines. I prefer 'em rather clean.

I see this as going one of two ways:
1) An "In the News" Forum for all articles posted (or linked) from third part sites that would normally fall in General or L&P
or
2) An "Armed Confrontations" Forum that included all shooting or armed confrontation threads.

Any sense there?
Rich

Tamara · December 4, 2002, 06:34 PM

I could get a lot more stoked about #2 than #1.

Of course, that might syphon off some traffic from AF/CQC...

I fear change...

**tyme** · December 4, 2002, 08:08 PM

I'm inclined to say "in the news" is too murky. Better "armed confrontations in the news" or "gunfire in the news" whether the gunfire hits someone or not. (e.g. this would go in either way)

I fear change too. I stick to paper money.

sm · December 4, 2002, 09:34 PM

I too fear change
I like simple

What about leaving things as they are --except
have designated symbol to "flag" thread as news item from 3 rd linked source? Circle around an "H" ? Would this be too much trouble? Or a special symbol(avatar).

I like the clean and simple TFL system. I log in, I can see special designation symbol whether its through "active threads" or a particular forum. I don't think this designation will get abused as maybe the original idea could get "murkey". No need for additional mod. Just stick it at the end as page(s) are currently shown. i.e.

Legal and Political

Sadam shoots Bin Laden *
*(symbol/avatar here)

normal news, date link here
article here
...at ten paces they turned and Sadam shot first...
Bin Laden fires shot as he falls hitting Sadam...

C.R.Sam · December 7, 2002, 12:56 AM

One site.
24 forums on that site.
Lot of work already....
To moniter from either side of the table.

Sam

December 4, 2002, 09:36 AM	#4
pax Senior Member Join Date: May 16, 2000 Location: In a state of flux Posts: 7,520	I dunno. It'd be nice to see all the news in one place; on the other paw, some of the news stories threads turn out to be our most active discussions. Maybe putting 'em in their own forum would kill some of the discussion. It would be nice to have some sort of guidelines as to where news stories belong. As it is now, too often they're duplicated all over the place. pax __________________ Kathy Jackson My personal website: Cornered Cat

December 4, 2002, 11:36 AM	#6
sm Senior Member Join Date: February 5, 2002 Posts: 1,819	I agree with pax perhaps if a topic in L&P or GD proves to be "hot" it could then be placed under "News Stories", or" Current Events". This might be easier for searches for particular topic-dunno. __________________ Use Enough Gun TFL Alumni

December 4, 2002, 02:12 PM	#7
Rich Lucibella Staff Join Date: October 6, 1998 Location: South Florida Posts: 10,229	I hate new Forums....they require some dedicated work to set up and delineate. However, this is an idea worth looking at seriously, since it may help cut down on repeat posts of the same article or news tidbit. Questions: - Is this only for news reports of shootings and near shootings? - Would a story about a bad LE shooting, posted in Legal be moved to the new forum? - Would a "I just saw on Fox...." thread be moved there? - Alternatively, would an "In-The-News" forum which cut across subject lines be easier to differentiate? - Would tyme be willing to Moderate? Rich __________________ S.W.A.T. Magazine Weapons, Training and Tactics for the Real World Join us at TFL or at AR15.com or on Facebook

December 4, 2002, 03:24 PM	#9
tyme Staff Join Date: October 13, 2001 Posts: 3,355	1. Yes, that's what I was imagining - what do you mean by near shootings? Someone takes a handgun out from concealment? Don't those incidents happen 2.5 million times a year? 2. Yes, it would preempt either general or l&p classification (depending on whether it was just an incident with no legal issues or a questionable shooting). Right now both shootings and armed confrontations and confiscations seem to be posted quasi-randomly to either general or l&p. 3. I guess it depends on what you just saw on fox 4. Isn't most of l&p "in the news?" 5. If lack of moderators were the only thing preventing its existence, maybe. What kinds of news stories would go? LEO: - good/bad shoots (yes) - good/bad gunfire (yes) - armed incursions (maybe) - confiscation (maybe) non-leo: - good/bad shoots (yes) - good/bad gunfire (yes) - brandishings against police/fire/public workers (maybe) - citizen brandishings to prevent crimes (maybe) - irresponsible brandishings (maybe) - court cases (no) Ideas? If the maybes are out, the division between gendisc/l&p/incidents becomes clear - shots fired vs not. Maybe "incidents" isn't such a good forum name. Or it could include all "armed confrontations." Or it could be an all-inclusive news story forum, but what exactly becomes "news?" A new essay on CATO? A newly released Lott study that provokes a story in the NYT or Washington Post? __________________ “The egg hatched...” “...the egg hatched... and a hundred baby spiders came out...” (blade runner) “Who are you?” “A friend. I'm here to prevent you from making a mistake.” “You have no idea what I'm doing here, friend.” “In specific terms, no, but I swore an oath to protect the world...” (continuum) “It's a goal you won't understand until later. Your job is to make sure he doesn't achieve the goal.” (bsg)

December 4, 2002, 06:25 PM	#10
Rich Lucibella Staff Join Date: October 6, 1998 Location: South Florida Posts: 10,229	Well now you demonstrate the murkiness of the lines. I prefer 'em rather clean. I see this as going one of two ways: 1) An "In the News" Forum for all articles posted (or linked) from third part sites that would normally fall in General or L&P or 2) An "Armed Confrontations" Forum that included all shooting or armed confrontation threads. Any sense there? Rich __________________ S.W.A.T. Magazine Weapons, Training and Tactics for the Real World Join us at TFL or at AR15.com or on Facebook

December 4, 2002, 02:56 AM	#1
tyme Staff Join Date: October 13, 2001 Posts: 3,355	new forum (don't shoot!) In the spirit of asking Rich to consider new forums, how about... an "incidents" forum dedicated to news articles about armed citizens preventing crime, and possibly armed criminal activity as well. Right now they end up in L&P and General depending on the phase of the moon. It'd be very low volume compared to the other major forums. Moderation would be a mixed bag - no danger of debates over most L&P issues. However, as such threads sometimes degenerate, there would be the occassional squabble over JBTs, executing criminals, "vigilante justice," and caliber wars. It would be nice to have all posts on those topics somewhere they could be more easily located. __________________ “The egg hatched...” “...the egg hatched... and a hundred baby spiders came out...” (blade runner) “Who are you?” “A friend. I'm here to prevent you from making a mistake.” “You have no idea what I'm doing here, friend.” “In specific terms, no, but I swore an oath to protect the world...” (continuum) “It's a goal you won't understand until later. Your job is to make sure he doesn't achieve the goal.” (bsg)

December 4, 2002, 08:05 AM	#2
Rich Lucibella Staff Join Date: October 6, 1998 Location: South Florida Posts: 10,229	Let's see what the feedback is on this one before I respond. Rich __________________ S.W.A.T. Magazine Weapons, Training and Tactics for the Real World Join us at TFL or at AR15.com or on Facebook

December 4, 2002, 09:24 AM	#3
HarryB Senior Member Join Date: April 4, 1999 Location: Mesa Arizona Posts: 330	Sounds like a fine idea, especially for those doing research on RKBA. Most postings are done very well with source citations and or links provided. Usually good banter debating the merits and legal aspects of the incident follows. I'm for it!

December 4, 2002, 11:28 AM	#5
ahenry Senior Member Join Date: January 25, 2001 Location: Alabama Posts: 1,764	I'm with Pax on this.

December 4, 2002, 03:00 PM	#8
Correia Senior Member Join Date: December 3, 1998 Location: SLC Utah Posts: 3,740	I don't think it is a bad idea at all. But no offense to Tyme, but I think the man to talk to would be Drizzt. He posts more news stories than anybody else on TFL. I honestly don't know where he gets them all, but he has got to post like three or four gun related news stories every day.

December 4, 2002, 06:34 PM	#11
Tamara Moderator Emeritus Join Date: March 11, 2000 Location: Indianapolis, IN Posts: 16,002	I could get a lot more stoked about #2 than #1. Of course, that might syphon off some traffic from AF/CQC... I fear change... __________________ MOLON LABE! 2% Unobtainium, 98% Hypetanium. The Arms Room: An Online Museum.

December 4, 2002, 08:08 PM	#12
tyme Staff Join Date: October 13, 2001 Posts: 3,355	I'm inclined to say "in the news" is too murky. Better "armed confrontations in the news" or "gunfire in the news" whether the gunfire hits someone or not. (e.g. this would go in either way) I fear change too. I stick to paper money. __________________ “The egg hatched...” “...the egg hatched... and a hundred baby spiders came out...” (blade runner) “Who are you?” “A friend. I'm here to prevent you from making a mistake.” “You have no idea what I'm doing here, friend.” “In specific terms, no, but I swore an oath to protect the world...” (continuum) “It's a goal you won't understand until later. Your job is to make sure he doesn't achieve the goal.” (bsg)

December 4, 2002, 09:34 PM	#13
sm Senior Member Join Date: February 5, 2002 Posts: 1,819	I too fear change I like simple What about leaving things as they are --except have designated symbol to "flag" thread as news item from 3 rd linked source? Circle around an "H" ? Would this be too much trouble? Or a special symbol(avatar). I like the clean and simple TFL system. I log in, I can see special designation symbol whether its through "active threads" or a particular forum. I don't think this designation will get abused as maybe the original idea could get "murkey". No need for additional mod. Just stick it at the end as page(s) are currently shown. i.e. Legal and Political Sadam shoots Bin Laden * *(symbol/avatar here) normal news, date link here article here ...at ten paces they turned and Sadam shot first... Bin Laden fires shot as he falls hitting Sadam... __________________ Use Enough Gun TFL Alumni

December 7, 2002, 12:56 AM	#14
C.R.Sam Senior Member Join Date: October 29, 1999 Location: Dewey, AZ Posts: 12,858	One site. 24 forums on that site. Lot of work already.... To moniter from either side of the table. Sam