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Old December 6, 2008, 08:52 AM   #26
kraven
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Yeah, now we'll be seeing guys growing "tactical" beards and hair. Dyed black of course.

I predict a new wave of ex-seal wannabes popping up with long hair and beards now since they were in "the stan." lol.
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Old December 6, 2008, 09:43 AM   #27
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There's a lot of boys with tactical body odor at the Home Depot on Saturday and Sunday mornings.
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Old December 6, 2008, 10:08 AM   #28
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Tactical Body oder, now thats something I can relate to. We opened two new FOB's while I was in OEF. Do you have any ideal what 90+ days of living in Polypro long johns (the same ones) without showers does for your BO. It felt like it took another 30 days to smell like a normal person again. Oh and my feet
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Old December 6, 2008, 10:34 AM   #29
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you of it all wrong

I disagree with all the ideas put forth here. I believe that the seals grow thief beards to help them fit in and be accepted by the coalition forces with whom they live and fight.
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Old December 6, 2008, 12:00 PM   #30
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I disagree with all the ideas put forth here. I believe that the seals grow thief beards to help them fit in and be accepted by the coalition forces with whom they live and fight.
Well that only applies to a very limited amount of the people doing it. The Army SF guys who are doing the FID mission. However, the MiTTs, ETTs and other types of transitions teams doing the exact same job who don't grow beards and long hair don't seem to have a problem. When I was a MiTT, the Iraqis even tell you, they understand we are Americans and didn't need to grow beards.

Honestly, I think it is more of we can do it so we will sort of thing. A team doing SR or DA has absolutely no need to grow their facial hair out, they live a sequestered life; separate from everyone else and hardly ever deal with locals other than their terps and when on the target.
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Old December 8, 2008, 09:16 AM   #31
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I think the beards apply more to rural Iraq and the majority Afghanistan.
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Old December 14, 2008, 04:34 PM   #32
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Earlier this year I was working with SF guys from all branches, just walking into the chow hall you point out who's who. Beards and skin cancer barbie tans were the seals, beards and some kinda attempt to be in a military uniform were the marines, clean shaven in ABU's were the Air Force PJ's, and clean shaven in ACU's were Army task force. With a couple 3 letter government agency guys thrown in the mix.

No I'm not SF, I just worked with them for 4 months.

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Old December 14, 2008, 06:12 PM   #33
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Today made it a week since I last shaved. I am now sporting my tactical Van Dyke facial hair
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Old December 16, 2008, 02:45 PM   #34
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What it boils down to isn't so much who it is, rather where it is. If your in a very garrison place, your going to see the guys with fresh hair cuts and a proper shave. If its a primitive AO, people let themselves go a bit. For example, I was in Al Asad for a while. If I didnt shave every day you would see me at parade rest getting my ass chewed. Here in camp gannon though where we do number two in a bag, you can walk around in a hoody and have long hair. Its all about the resources.

Now, the SEALs do get away with it in garrison areas, but if you ask me its stupid. I know SEALS are VERY good at their job and operating, but when they're not they're a bunch of toolbags if you ask me. Just my opinion though..
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Old December 16, 2008, 03:59 PM   #35
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Has Gannon reverted? When I was their in 06 it wasn't all that bad.
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Old December 16, 2008, 04:06 PM   #36
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Now, the SEALs do get away with it in garrison areas, but if you ask me its stupid. I know SEALS are VERY good at their job and operating, but when they're not they're a bunch of toolbags if you ask me. Just my opinion though..
As you may know, SEALs may get called from "garrison" assignment to an operation in a matter of hours. They can't necessarily keep things high and tight just to make the other troops happy.
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Old December 16, 2008, 04:49 PM   #37
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STLRN, I'm at gannon II. Its in the process of being built up and albeit it's happening quick, but still pretty basic. When my team got here it was nothing but MREs.

Also I do realize they can be called upon in a matter of hours. I know they do in fact do spec. ops. but like others have said its nothing that requires them to be raggidy. The teams I have seen and dealt with would stick out like a sore thumb, even though they have their hair all grown out. All it comes down to is them trying to be different and stick out because they can as far as garrison areas are concerned.
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Old December 16, 2008, 05:08 PM   #38
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Its so that they blend in more easily with the locals to look like this...



...instead of looking like this:
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Old December 16, 2008, 09:17 PM   #39
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In the real world back home the SEALs still have grooming standards and uniforms. So do Delta. Several Delta guys used to come to a NC IPSC match, you could tell it was on in late 2002 when they showed up with beards and a satellite phone. They left after a call mid-match, didn't see them again for a long time.

Locally in Virginia Beach you can always spot the Seal. Mdoerately fit, talks like a surfer, shorts, flip flops, sunglasses, great tan. If seen at the range they shoot the same Sig with the same deliberate draw stroke. I'm not sure if they issue the off-duty disguise but it sure is universal amongst the young Seals.
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Old December 16, 2008, 11:50 PM   #40
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Its for the same reason all front line British troops in Afghanistan are allowed to grow beards and long hair. It helps them gain a rapport with local tribes were men all have beards. It the mark of a man in that country. Only girls and boys don't have beards. The British military have been trying to get the US forces to allow their male soldiers to grow beards to no avail.
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Old December 17, 2008, 08:52 AM   #41
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Old December 17, 2008, 04:24 PM   #42
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One of the Seals I worked with while in the Navy told me they are amazed by a group of Air Force guys... Para-Jump-rescue.. PJ's. They secure Airfields and get injured pilots outta harms way behind enemy lines.. usually in very small numbers. For a SEAL to say someone is outta their mind ... they have to be hardcore
I always got a chuckle out of the nickname for PJ school: "Superman U."
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Old December 17, 2008, 04:39 PM   #43
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Its for the same reason all front line British troops in Afghanistan are allowed to grow beards and long hair. It helps them gain a rapport with local tribes were men all have beards. It the mark of a man in that country. Only girls and boys don't have beards. The British military have been trying to get the US forces to allow their male soldiers to grow beards to no avail.
I don't think that is accurate, because SEAL and the various JSOC elements don't work with locals. They also work on "Zulu" time meaning, the come out late in the day/early into the night and go to sleep as early in the morning. So the only locals that see them are on the target sight.

The people who generally work directly with the locals, the ETTs and PMTs for most part don't grow beards or have long hear and they do just fine.

Also, having working with the Brits a few weeks ago in AFG, they didn't grow beards. Long hair is a relative thing most is longer than the US troops, but in general the Brits' was not long. The Dutch on the other hand had guys with Dreeds. The only ones I ever saw in the Brit mil who had beards were a few Sikhs.
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Old December 23, 2008, 12:35 PM   #44
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I actually did hear the above - that facial hair helps build rapport with locals - to be true. Integration and interface are two different things. While SEALs might not work closely or integrate with indigenous peoples, their job could still require interfacing, formal or informal communication, with locals in a number of capacities. I understood beards signal a mature man worthy of respect in some middle-eastern cultures - thus, more likely to garner honest and substantial input from members of the community.

The blending element is also pertinent. So facial hair can serve multiple functions, as with non-standard or theater-specific (shemagh) articles of clothing.

Beards are also said to interfere with gas mask seal. I'm not sure if anyone can chime in as to how concerned operators are with gas attacks, but this is part of the reason given for shaving with "regular" servicemen.

I would not attribute beards to nastiness or poor maintenance of hygeine. Guys at hellhole FOBs still manage to keep with the grooming standards. Friend of mine has pictures of when he had to wear trousers caked in human poop for three days straight - like many, he got smelly, but he's not wearing any stubble. I'm not saying appearance standards are enforced everywhere or aggressively on deployment, but it's certainly not like they can't or won't shave.
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Old December 23, 2008, 01:27 PM   #45
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One of the Seals I worked with while in the Navy told me they are amazed by a group of Air Force guys... Para-Jump-rescue.. PJ's. They secure Airfields and get injured pilots outta harms way behind enemy lines.. usually in very small numbers. For a SEAL to say someone is outta their mind ... they have to be hardcore
PJ's are extreme combat medics/personnel recovery specialists, as stated their primary job is downed pilot rescue from wherever they happen to be. They do not secure airfields, that is combat controllers primary job - to secure/set up airfields and conduct air traffic control, getting planes moving in hostile environments. You'll see CCT and TACP's sporting beards and long hair in pics from the sand box, probably not PJ's, they're generally not out there mixing it up with the locals, they're mission is pretty specialized.
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