The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > The Skunkworks > Handloading, Reloading, and Bullet Casting > Bullet Casting

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old August 2, 2019, 06:44 AM   #1
senecahornet
Member
 
Join Date: December 7, 2014
Location: FINGER LAKES - NEW YORK
Posts: 32
Coated lead bullets

Been told by a few at the gun club i belong to that a lead coated bullet will not lead foul. I have shot over a 1,000 rounds of coated bullets in my 1911 and.......it lead fouls! It may reduce lead in the air of the indoor range. And that’s questionable.
senecahornet is offline  
Old August 2, 2019, 06:54 AM   #2
dahermit
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 28, 2006
Location: South Central Michigan...near
Posts: 5,673
Quote:
Originally Posted by senecahornet View Post
Been told by a few at the gun club i belong to that a lead coated bullet will not lead foul. I have shot over a 1,000 rounds of coated bullets in my 1911 and.......it lead fouls! It may reduce lead in the air of the indoor range. And that’s questionable.
There is "coated", then there is "coated". Coated with "High-Tech", or Powder Coated"? Do you do your own Powder Coating or Powder Coated (or High-Tech) coated bullets from someone else?
I have shot many thousands of my own cast and powder coated bullets and have had not the slightest leading. It is generally held that, just as with cast bullets lubed with something else, correct loads do not lead. You may be using too soft an alloy at too high a speed, or undersize bullets, etc.
dahermit is offline  
Old August 2, 2019, 07:33 AM   #3
David R
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 2, 2015
Location: The swamps of WNY
Posts: 641
Who made the coated bullets?

I chek mine as if it was a plated bullet. You can crimp too much and break the coating. That exposes lead that can foul. I pull a bullet to make sure the crimp it not cutting the coating.

I have shot thousands in each of my guns including 4, 45 acp. 44 special, 38 special, 32-20 @ 1550 fps, 45 colt and even 380. None lead.

I did it becasue my lead levels are high. Those coated bullets and a wet tumbler helped a lot.

Precision bullets used to have a note about if you get severe smoking or leading. They have changed the website. I don't want to watch a bunch of vidios.

David
David R is offline  
Old August 2, 2019, 12:06 PM   #4
Hammerhead
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 31, 2004
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 2,258
Black fouling or silver? Coated can leave a hard to remove carbon fouling in autos.
Hammerhead is offline  
Old August 2, 2019, 12:14 PM   #5
T. O'Heir
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 13, 2002
Location: Canada
Posts: 11,314
Like dahermit says, it depends on what it's coated with. Powder coated is just paint. Plating is metal. Usually copper. There's polymer coating too. Polymer is a type of plastic. And Molybdenum.
"...Coated with "High-Tech"..." That's paint too. Supposedly similar to car paint. High Tech is the brand name. I think.
In any case, leading is caused by driving a cast bullet too fast. Doesn't matter who made 'em. Try to drive 'em too fast and you'll get leading.
__________________
Spelling and grammar count!
T. O'Heir is offline  
Old August 2, 2019, 12:21 PM   #6
Jim Watson
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 25, 2001
Location: Alabama
Posts: 15,728
I don't get leading with real Hi Tek Supercoat on current BBI, Bayou, and Gallant.

Before BBI changed to Hi Tek, their "poly moly" coating fouled badly in 9mm but not in lower velocity .45.

Billy Bullets don't foul the barrel but leave your fingers black.

Blue Bullets have their own coating and a good reputation for it.

People are successfully shooting coated bullets in moderate rifle loads 2000 fps or better.

DIY powder coating can be good or bad.
Jim Watson is offline  
Old August 2, 2019, 01:21 PM   #7
senecahornet
Member
 
Join Date: December 7, 2014
Location: FINGER LAKES - NEW YORK
Posts: 32
When you look into the barrel after removing it of course, with a 10x jewlers lens you can definitely see the lead fouling, after treating it with a solvent and bronze brush. It comes out black. Mind you that i have already removed all of the powder fouling. I have been using missouri bullets.
senecahornet is offline  
Old August 2, 2019, 02:29 PM   #8
max it
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 15, 2008
Location: SoCal; are we done yet?
Posts: 267
Very interesting. I quit casting as I have a 19 mg/dL lead count.
Now more than ever I am aware that the primers are to blame. Especially indoors.
Hence I tumble outdoors, wear gloves and mask and yes dry media. But changed often. It’s cheap from the bird store.
I’m careful with my crimps too.
Glad to hear that 2,000 fps is good in rifle no lead.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
max it is offline  
Old August 2, 2019, 02:48 PM   #9
BBarn
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 22, 2015
Posts: 778
I have gotten a small amount of leading from coated bullets, including those coated with H-Tek. In my case I attribute it to the occasional bullet that gets some of it's coating scraped off during seating. I regard the coatings as a good low cost bullet that generally lead less than lubed lead bullets.
BBarn is offline  
Old August 2, 2019, 06:27 PM   #10
David R
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 2, 2015
Location: The swamps of WNY
Posts: 641
Maxit, Was as high as almost 50 in 2006. I quit shooting all toghther. Went down to 20 in a couple years. Started shooting rimfire for a couple years, then went back to shooting with coated bullets. Been at 20 since. Doctor wrote on my chart "Chronic"

The wet tumbler was my last attempt. I am sure it helps when I pour that black water down the drain.

Now I shoot only coated. I have no problems with leading.

I have 32 moulds for sale.
David

Sent from my SM-T900 using Tapatalk
David R is offline  
Old August 2, 2019, 07:29 PM   #11
reddog81
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 16, 2014
Location: Iowa
Posts: 1,187
I’ve shot thousands of powder coated bullets and have had problems with exactly one batch that wasn’t cured enough. I put 50 rounds of 460 S&W at 1300 FPS down range a couple hours ago without a hint of leading. That was on top of 100 rounds of 38 Special and 200 rounds of 9mm.
reddog81 is offline  
Old August 2, 2019, 11:00 PM   #12
P Flados
Member
 
Join Date: January 8, 2017
Location: Wilmington NC
Posts: 44
I use powder coat for full power handgun magnum loads (lots of guns) and typically have no trouble working up combinations that produce no leading.

I use a tumble lube (BLL) for milder loads that do not need the powder coat.

For 45 ACP (you said 1911, so I am assuming 45 ACP), the tumble lube worked great with target loads in both 230 RNs and 200 SWCs.

Leading in a 45 ACP with coated bullets either means bad coating (not likely) or "bad fit". If you are leading, the most likely cause is that your bullets are smaller than the barrel bore. The "standard" 45 ACP will be 0.452" and this is what you get with regular mail order bullets. Your reloading operation may also size then down just a little bit (if they are a tight fit in your cases). Your gun may be just a tad bigger than your "as loaded" bullets.

Of course, slugging the barrel is the obvious recommendation at this point. Cast bullets should be just a little bigger than the bore. Many bullet sellers will supply 45 ACP bullets that are bigger than the standard. If your gun is leading with 0.452" bullets, and you do not want to bother slugging the barrel, you could just try some sized to 0.454".

If you neglected to tell us that you 1911 is not 45 ACP, then please fill in the missing info. If you are shooting a 9mm (the all time champ for causing problems with cast), then I have a totally different slant on the same basic problem.

Last edited by P Flados; August 2, 2019 at 11:10 PM.
P Flados is offline  
Old August 3, 2019, 08:35 AM   #13
kmw1954
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 11, 2016
Location: SE Wisconsin
Posts: 1,291
I have just started fooling with cast lead bullets so I am following with intense interest.

So far what I have been working with are .356" cast for use in the 380 auto. I have 3 different samples that different members have donated for me to try. So far I like what I'm seeing.
kmw1954 is offline  
Old August 3, 2019, 03:15 PM   #14
Unclenick
Staff
 
Join Date: March 4, 2005
Location: Ohio
Posts: 16,410
I have moved this to Bullet Casting where Beagle333 has a lot of experience with the powder coating process. He may have some insight into the MB coating. My sense is that if you need a 10X loupe to spot the fouling, it's not severe and is a good bit less dramatic than I've seen in some of my own guns in the past. You also have to be sure it is actually lead and not graphite or moly in the coating that you are chasing out. Even a bronze brush leaves enough metal behind to darken a patch a little, so the source of the issue needs to determined to a certainty.
__________________
Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member
CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor
NRA Certified Rifle Instructor
NRA Benefactor Member and Golden Eagle
Unclenick is offline  
Old August 3, 2019, 06:39 PM   #15
USSR
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 14, 2017
Location: Finger Lakes Region of NY
Posts: 807
senecahornet,

Unclenick is right, if you can't see it with the naked eye and need an optic to see it, then it could be anything and personally, I wouldn't worry about it. Where abouts are you located? I'm at the south end of Seneca Lake near Watkins Glen.

Don
__________________
NRA Life Member
NRA Certified Metallic Cartridge Reloading Instructor
USSR is offline  
Old August 24, 2019, 06:08 PM   #16
Wendyj
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 3, 2015
Location: North Georgia
Posts: 1,286
USSR. I’m here in Ga and came by way of TN all my family is in upstate around Corning Bath area. Last living Aunts and cousins live in Watkins Glen now. Been 45 years since I was there but a pretty place. Loved hiking through the Glen.
__________________
God is NOT dead!!!!
Wendyj is offline  
Old August 24, 2019, 07:51 PM   #17
sparkyv
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2, 2015
Location: Texas
Posts: 161
Quote:
Originally Posted by T. O'Heir View Post
Like dahermit says, it depends on what it's coated with. Powder coated is just paint. Plating is metal. Usually copper. There's polymer coating too. Polymer is a type of plastic. And Molybdenum.
"...Coated with "High-Tech"..." That's paint too. Supposedly similar to car paint. High Tech is the brand name. I think.
In any case, leading is caused by driving a cast bullet too fast. Doesn't matter who made 'em. Try to drive 'em too fast and you'll get leading.
^^^This^^^
__________________
μολὼν λαβέ
NRA Life Member
sparkyv is offline  
Old August 24, 2019, 09:03 PM   #18
Dufus
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 10, 2014
Location: Texas
Posts: 1,782
Quote:
Try to drive 'em too fast and you'll get leading.
Not necessarily. Ill fit and/or pore bullet lube is the main cause of leading, not velocity.

Also, most lead in the air is caused by primers, not lead bullets.
Dufus is offline  
Old August 25, 2019, 03:21 PM   #19
dahermit
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 28, 2006
Location: South Central Michigan...near
Posts: 5,673
Quote:
Originally Posted by sparkyv View Post
^^^This^^^
Actually, powder coating is not "just paint", or at least not what most people think paint is. It is more like a plastic coating than it is like paints that are applied as a liquid. See: "Types of powder coatings" https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Powder_coating
dahermit is offline  
Old September 1, 2019, 08:49 PM   #20
dogdoc
Junior Member
 
Join Date: May 24, 2004
Posts: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by senecahornet View Post
Been told by a few at the gun club i belong to that a lead coated bullet will not lead foul. I have shot over a 1,000 rounds of coated bullets in my 1911 and.......it lead fouls! It may reduce lead in the air of the indoor range. And that’s questionable.


My experience as well in many handgun calibers . I have been a bullet caster for 40 years and know all about the fit etc. my home bullets with 50/50 Alox beeswax seldom lead. The coated bullets usually do ok at 800 FPS or so but start going higher and a leaded barrel ensues(some like your 45 at lower velocity). I have loaded many thousands of commercial lead and coated bullets because I lack time to cast my own. The commercial bullets coated or not are bad about leading. One trick I have been doing for many years with them is to tumble lube them with lee liquid Alox . That solves the problem. I just tumbled some tonight and spread them on some wax paper to dry.



Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
dogdoc is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:45 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2018 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.10052 seconds with 9 queries