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Old January 10, 2020, 02:22 PM   #1
stagpanther
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Arbor press

I've decided to try a new approach to reloading--and ordered a K&M arbor press and some Wilson full chamber seater dies in a few of my more target-only oriented cartridges. Any ideas/comments/experiences with this approach?
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Old January 10, 2020, 02:31 PM   #2
T. O'Heir
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An arbor press is for putting things into holes that are a "press fit". They're not required for reloading. Nothing about reloading should ever need that much force.
The KMH arbor press is exactly that. Made for very heavy metal forming at 1, 2 and 3 tons. Not reloading. Probably make loading .50 BMG a bit easier, except there's no place on the press for a shell holder.
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Old January 10, 2020, 03:08 PM   #3
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Maybe a K&M arbor press
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Old January 10, 2020, 04:22 PM   #4
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Yes--excuse my inaccuracy--I meant K&M, I did not mean to imply I was contemplating 100,000% compressed loads.
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Old January 10, 2020, 05:06 PM   #5
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I use Wilson seater for all my hunting,varmint rifles. Wilson also sell die blank so you can have gunsmith use chamber reamer for seater/neck die. If your shooting VLD might want to get VLD seater stem.

Which one did you get.

https://kmshooting.com/arborpressbuilder.html
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Old January 10, 2020, 06:09 PM   #6
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I use a similar press from Harrell's Precision for a couple of my benchrest rifles. Wilson dies in both cases, with bushings for the sizing dies. (30BR and 6PPC)

Harrell's will also sell you a sizing die made for your rifle if you send them 3 fired cases from your rifle. I think they're around $80 each.
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Old January 10, 2020, 06:11 PM   #7
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you get a lot more feel from a arbor, that was the only difference I noted. I have the Wilson dies for .223, and .260 Rem. Have not bothered for my 6BR or 6CM
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Old January 11, 2020, 02:04 AM   #8
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I got the press and standard force dial indicator. I got the Wilson chamber bullet seaters for 22 nosler, 224 valkyrie, 338 Lapua and 338 federal. Probably should have passed on the 338 federal since I'll never likely gain much considering the limited range of bullets I can use with it. I ordered vld stems as the default for the valk and 338 Lapua--regular ones for the other 2. The harrels dies from fired brass sounds very interesting too. I also have K&M's neck turning gear--though I have to admit I rarely use it except when extensively reforming brass prone to forming donuts.
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Old January 11, 2020, 12:45 PM   #9
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Harrell dies are limited to BR or PPC and threaded.

Neil Jones made Arbor Die

https://www.neiljones.com/

I post Jones Die on anothers site below is what arbor dies look like and you have his bushings.

https://forum.nosler.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=11615
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Old January 12, 2020, 05:03 PM   #10
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My 2 cents

First,I'm not a competition shooter.The bench rest folks are concerned with .010 MOA,and their techniques cross over into the paranormal.

I'm not in that world.

If I notice gain .5 MOA somehow,and it sustains long enough I believe its not a fluke,well,thats a good thing.

I'm convinced that a Dillon 1050 or a Lee Hand press will load ammo that leaves me with no excuses.

We can go to Redding,Sinclair,RCBS,Forster, and throw money at just about any doubt or question we can dream up. Its amazing.

But it was not always the case. Harry Pope made the tools to make ammo for his rifle.

50's and 60's,and maybe into the 70's,a smith crafted a custom rifle,he used the reamers to make loading dies,with the right neck and throat. The whole rifle and the dies migjt have been made on a Le Blond or a Hardinge,or a Monarch...but more likely,the gunsmith's wages bought an Atlas lathe.

The man shooting the rifle might only have 23 select,finely prepped cases.

Not enough for a day's shooting,so loading at the shooting bench was routine.

Pressures weren't high,necks might be turned thin,minimal neck tension was good.

High forces were not required. Dies like the Wilson Straight lines could be used with the heel of the hand for force...usually.

Mallets? Well,who wants to beat on the tools or brass.

A small arbor press can be clamped to the bench and it provide sufficient straigjt line force with sensitive feel.
This little press has nothing to do with a 5 ton Dake.Also, there is a consistent degree of repeatable straightness concentricity,alignment,and positive length stop that all be built into one solid piece of steel,rather than 7/8 -14 threads,a ram,toggles,etc..

It might just be a more satisfying way of doing things for some.

You know,even the Lee Classic reloading set takes a significant step up when the mallet is traded for an arbor press.

Enjoy doing it your way!

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Old January 12, 2020, 07:53 PM   #11
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Like HiBC points out, lot's of good groups shot over the years way before fancy bench equipment was available. Myself I have reverted to a minimalist routine and my favorite press is the humble Lee turret. I have a arbor and a RC gathering dust. Once you get to a point on reloading fancier reloading gear will not do you much good, only lots of practice and better rifle components can get you that next .1 MOA reduction
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Old January 13, 2020, 07:44 AM   #12
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Wilson been around long time making dies started 1927.

https://lewilson.com/about

I'm almost 78 and long as I remember you could have dies made. This is set neck dies for 243. I post this on Nosler forum.

https://forum.nosler.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=11616

The die on right was made from rifle barrel.

When I started BR gunsmith made die from end of barrel. One gunsmith made threaded die for my 223AI from end of barrel.
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Old January 13, 2020, 01:38 PM   #13
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good point Old Roper. I would wager that the arbor press and inline dies were being used long before the linkage style press was developed.

Oh and Whidden will still make you custom dies, I believer other manufacturers do also

https://www.whiddengunworks.com/custom-reloading-dies/
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Old January 13, 2020, 01:44 PM   #14
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Sierra Bullets has been shooting 1/4th MOA average 10-shot short range groups using match barrels, commercial full length sizing dies (with honed out necks and no expander ball) on unprepped cases in conventional presses, metered powder charges with 2/10ths grain spread and quality match bullets since the late 1950's. Their quality control reference bullets called "standards" shoot 1/8th MOA average.
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Old January 13, 2020, 03:45 PM   #15
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Bart:
Quote:
I'm convinced that a Dillon 1050 or a Lee Hand press will load ammo that leaves me with no excuses.
Old Roper: I think something about the Korean War inspired my Creation. 1952.

I have no experience with times before that.I'll leave those to my elders!

Quote:
But it was not always the case. Harry Pope made the tools to make ammo for his rifle.

50's and 60's,and maybe into the 70's,a smith crafted a custom rifle,he used the reamers to make loading dies,with the right neck and throat. The whole rifle and the dies migjt have been made on a Le Blond or a Hardinge,or a Monarch...but more likely,the gunsmith's wages bought an Atlas lathe.
I have a copy of the J.M.Pyne Stories. I've done a fair amount of creating what I needed to support some hairbrained idea. Not so many people have an old South Bend,etc to work with.
The common fellow's creative tool is a Mastercard and what is available on line.
Most folks are limited to what they can buy. A few are only limited by what they can imagine,,,and their own motivation.

It is hard to beat the wonderful roducts we can buy...but there is something about making your own tools

Last edited by HiBC; January 13, 2020 at 04:04 PM.
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Old January 13, 2020, 04:25 PM   #16
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hounddawg, Wilson used to make FL arbor sizing dies. You take one of those 1 ton arbor press to size. When I need to size for my 30-06 I use that die.

HIBC, I find it just easier to pay gunsmith to do my work or custom dies and have no desire to become gunsmith. I've been pretty lucky over the years on who's done my work. Good gunsmith make idea's become real.
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Old January 13, 2020, 06:06 PM   #17
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A arbor press is just another method method of applying a downward force. You can take inline dies and use a rubber or wooden mallet and accomplish the same thing. I have been known to buy things just to see how they work, it's just my nature. I have put enough dollars into my home grown Savages to easily buy a nice custom build but I get a kick out of putting my own together. When I get groups like this and outscore the guynext to me shooting his 5K custom it gives me a warm fuzzy, what can I say. 600 yards 15mph + winds.
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Old January 13, 2020, 07:08 PM   #18
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hounddawg, I guess shooting next to someone that can't read wind is big deal for you.
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Old January 13, 2020, 07:22 PM   #19
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hounddawg, I guess shooting next to someone that can't read wind is big deal for you
only if they have been bragging about their $2000 powder scale and $1500 dollar annealer before the match. I shoot with a lot of high masters who whup my tail regularly, they got those cards through years of practice and getting their butts whupped, not fancy bench toys
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Old January 14, 2020, 07:11 PM   #20
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Walnut Hill swage press

I went the Walnut Hill swage press route myself after I broke a rock-chucker swaging jacketed hollow point .40 out of 9mm brass with lead cores. Two benefits of the walnut hill press is it adapts to use all my LEE dies and has a nice long handle to apply the force I need to form the nose on these JHPs. https://thefiringline.com/forums/att...2&d=1556674478
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Old January 15, 2020, 01:31 AM   #21
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I'm mostly just curious. I have 4 other presses of various types, it mostly comes down to ease of repeatability and "feel transmission" for what I like to use--but I too am not a Jedi bench knight, usually if my builds get me in the .3 to .5 MOA at @ 100 I call it a day. I realize the expense is going to be the dies, not the press itself--I'm starting to lose track of all the holders, trimmers, gauges, dies etc that I have.
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Old January 15, 2020, 09:29 AM   #22
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curiosity was pretty much the same reason I bought mine stagpanther. They are fun to mess with, try seating lubed necks and unlubed and you will feel the difference. They shot the same on paper, but the lubed went in much smoother
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Old January 19, 2020, 03:19 AM   #23
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Unfortunately UPS handed off the package to the local post office system (they often do this without my knowing in advance) and they appear to have lost the package. The tracking info says they attempted delivery and left a notice--I never received anything nor a delivery notice.
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Old January 19, 2020, 08:01 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stagpanther View Post
Unfortunately UPS handed off the package to the local post office system (they often do this without my knowing in advance) and they appear to have lost the package. The tracking info says they attempted delivery and left a notice--I never received anything nor a delivery notice.


They do this at the shipper’s request. Many times it’s done when we select free shipping. While it is a pain, go to the post office and make them look for your package in the left notice section. Packages don’t just disappear unless they are stolen off a porch or left at the wrong house. They should also leave a 2nd notice if not picked up. Your carrier’s supervisor needs to have a serious chat with them about their failure to handle it correctly.


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Old January 19, 2020, 08:32 AM   #25
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Quote:
Unfortunately UPS handed off the package to the local post office system (they often do this without my knowing in advance) and they appear to have lost the package.
ouch, I can sympathize. We had the best mail person in the world for 10 years then they switched us out about 2 years ago and deliveries became a crap shoot. Most of the time "free" shipping is the Fedex/USPS Smartpost option. Just me but I pay extra and opt for UPS
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