10mm vs 40S&W - Page 3

Deaf Smith · October 8, 2017, 08:43 PM

Nice thing is, wither 1250 or 1198 fps, a 180 defiantly puts the .40 into the league of a hot loaded .357 magnum.

Deaf

SA1911 · October 8, 2017, 09:46 PM

For self-defense, go with a standard capacity; e.g., 15 rounds .40 S&W with 180 grain Federal HST Tactical ammo.

dsa1115 · October 8, 2017, 11:37 PM

I was interested in a G20 or a G29 but for me the grip was too large. So I bought a G23 because it fit my hand better, and bought a G32 barrel so I can shoot .357 Sig too. In .40 S&W the Federal 180 grain HST is a great load, and in .357 Sig the Underwood 125 grain bonded HP delivers 604 ft. lbs of energy and more than 1450 fps. Not too shabby. The size of a G23 works better for me.

cslinger · October 9, 2017, 12:23 AM

I am not a 10mm guy but REAL 10mm is basically .40S&W Magnum or super if you will much like .38 special is to .357 Magnum or .38 Super.

Does that matter in SD.......probably not hugely.

Is it more powerful......yep.

Mannlicher · October 15, 2017, 05:42 PM

I have no problem with high energy 10MM loads in my Glock 40 MOS. Easy to get a second shot, recoil is not an issue. It fits my hand, my pocket book, and does what I want it to do. I don't own any .40 S&W chambered pistols. Used to, but the 10MM Auto is a better cartridge from every standpoint.

Kevin Rohrer · October 15, 2017, 06:09 PM

Umm, if you want a Home Defense weapon, why are you not going w/ a long gun?

fourbore · October 17, 2017, 07:30 AM

A person may not want to go to the door with a shogun at the ready just because of some uncertainty about who might be there or why. Hence have both.

I also take the opportunity to say this has been a good education for me regarding the two 40 cal pistols.

Iron bottom · October 18, 2017, 01:03 AM

The 10mm was a little much for some people, so the S&W .40 was introduced. Now the .40 is being dumped for the 9mm. Will everybody be happy when we get back to cap guns?

fourbore · October 18, 2017, 07:18 AM

The 9mm cannot be that bad a choice for the average person and for concealed carry. It is used by what? 90% of the world military and in hardball no less. A fair bit of practice and a large dose of presence of mind and a 9mm should leave a person very well equipped.

You must be pretty young not to remember all the 32 and 380. Even 25 acp. Those are a lot less popular today. Even some military used the 380 or the little Mauser rounds.

For men, not girls, in police and military with open carry. My vote is a double stack 45acp. Seems a waste of time, splitting the difference. Or any law enforcement should be an individual choice. Fortunately, I am not in that position and god bless those who put them selves in harms way

But, I can see the 40's might work for a few where splitting the difference works out just right. Its been an interesting read.

Nanuk · October 18, 2017, 09:44 AM

Quote:

The 9mm cannot be that bad a choice for the average person and for concealed carry. It is used by what? 90% of the world military and in hardball no less.

That is a bad rationalization. The handgun use in the military plays a different role than a civilian carrier in the US. The military context is different.

Quote:

You must be pretty young not to remember all the 32 and 380. Even 25 acp. Those are a lot less popular today. Even some military used the 380 or the little Mauser rounds.

Many of those military's that used mouse gun pistols were more of a badge of office than anything else. Mouse guns had a place 30 years ago, now you can get 9mm's smaller than some of the old 32's.

kmw1954 · October 18, 2017, 10:26 AM

I may be wrong because I've never owned or fired either but my perception is that of comparing the 38Spl and the 357 Mag.

Now I have been contemplating a larger bore pistol then the 9mm's I own just to have something larger. Though my thinking has been more along the lines of either the 40 S&W or the 45acp. as I don't believe I'd need a 10mm version.

otasan · October 18, 2017, 07:43 PM

Go with the 10mm. Ammo hard to find? Online? Get a Dillon 550b reloader.

bamaranger · October 18, 2017, 10:14 PM

Those that want to argue the energy and velocity side of things should indeed watch the Harrel video as mentioned earlier. There is a wide range of differences depending on what maker of ammo you choose in the debate. Loaded up to its potential, (by the factory ) the 10mm is serious medicine. As loaded by some mfg's, it is a weak sister an no more gun than a .40. To boot, some .40 doesn't really make grade either.

Another aspect are the 10mm guns themselves. As a rule, the large frame Glock's are a handful, as in big grips and trigger span. That leaves the 1911 varieties, which are SA guns with manual safeties,not everybody's cup of tea. There are the SIG "P "family, but I've not handled a SIG 10mm, but the big SIGs (P220-226) don't fit everyone either.

I'm inclined to suggest the .40, even though I'm not a real fan of the caliber. The guns will fit most anybody that can handle a double stack 9mm, the guns are available in simple to run striker or DAO (as opposed to SA safety) mode, and one has more gun, theoretically, than a 9mm.

mavracer · October 19, 2017, 06:00 AM

Quote:

I may be wrong because I've never owned or fired either but my perception is that of comparing the 38Spl and the 357 Mag.

Not really the 40 and 10mm are much closer in terms of pressure 35K psi for 40 and 37.5K psi for the 10mm, where as even in +p garb the 38 special is only 20K psi vs 35K for the 357.
Much wider gap in performance.

kmw1954 · October 19, 2017, 08:31 AM

mavracer I did not realize that so I learned something new today. Thanks!

otasan · October 19, 2017, 08:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deaf Smith

Nice thing is, wither 1250 or 1198 fps, a 180 defiantly puts the .40 into the league of a hot loaded .357 magnum.

Deaf

No autoloading pistol round will ever equal the .357 Magnum 125gr SJHP, for the .357 round has soft lead in the front of the bullet. The pistol bullets do not, for feeding purposes. The .357 125gr SJHP will always expand well, as we have seen historically.

disseminator · October 19, 2017, 08:12 PM

Quote:

No autoloading pistol round will ever equal the .357 Magnum 125gr SJHP, for the .357 round has soft lead in the front of the bullet. The pistol bullets do not, for feeding purposes. The .357 125gr SJHP will always expand well, as we have seen historically.

There are many bullets that expand every bit as reliably as the 357, some even better.

mavracer · October 20, 2017, 05:50 AM

Quote:

There are many bullets that expand every bit as reliably as the 357, some even better.

It almost seems like otosan has been asleep for about 30 years worth of bullet development.

RickB · October 20, 2017, 11:37 AM

All of the "one shot stop" stuff, if you believe it, had ratings that divided the best performers by tenths of a percent.

It's not like 125gr .357 was 99% and 10mm or .40 JHPs were 50%, there were a dozen or more rounds that were in the high 90s.

I distinctly remember one guy saying that his research showed .45 ACP/230gr Federal Hydra-Shok, when fired from a 5" barrel, had 100% one-shot stops.
I don't know how that could possibly be true, unless that sample size was extremely small, but if there's any truth in one-shot stop "ratings", 95%-99% are essentially the same.

otasan · October 23, 2017, 10:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mavracer

It almost seems like otosan has been asleep for about 30 years worth of bullet development.

I guess so! And it is otasan, not otosan

October 8, 2017, 08:43 PM	#51
Deaf Smith Senior Member Join Date: October 31, 2000 Location: Texican! Posts: 4,453	Nice thing is, wither 1250 or 1198 fps, a 180 defiantly puts the .40 into the league of a hot loaded .357 magnum. Deaf __________________ “To you who call yourselves ‘men of peace,’ I say, you are not safe without men of action by your side” Thucydides

October 9, 2017, 12:23 AM	#54
cslinger Senior Member Join Date: July 14, 2002 Location: Nashville, TN Posts: 2,045	I am not a 10mm guy but REAL 10mm is basically .40S&W Magnum or super if you will much like .38 special is to .357 Magnum or .38 Super. Does that matter in SD.......probably not hugely. Is it more powerful......yep. __________________ "Is there anyway I can write my local gun store off on my taxes as dependents?"

October 15, 2017, 05:42 PM	#55
Mannlicher Senior Member Join Date: July 8, 2001 Location: North Central Florida & Miami Posts: 3,209	I have no problem with high energy 10MM loads in my Glock 40 MOS. Easy to get a second shot, recoil is not an issue. It fits my hand, my pocket book, and does what I want it to do. I don't own any .40 S&W chambered pistols. Used to, but the 10MM Auto is a better cartridge from every standpoint. __________________ Nemo Me Impune Lacesset "The trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant; it's just that they know so much that isn't so.".........Ronald Reagan

October 15, 2017, 06:09 PM	#56
Kevin Rohrer Senior Member Join Date: May 19, 2010 Location: Medina, Ohio Posts: 1,049	Umm, if you want a Home Defense weapon, why are you not going w/ a long gun? __________________ Member: Orange Gunsite Family, NRA--Life, ARTCA, and American Legion. Caveat Emptor: Cavery Grips/AmericanGripz/Prestige Grips/Stealth Grips from Clayton, NC. He is a scammer

October 18, 2017, 10:14 PM	#63
bamaranger Senior Member Join Date: October 9, 2009 Location: North Alabama Posts: 8,312	video Those that want to argue the energy and velocity side of things should indeed watch the Harrel video as mentioned earlier. There is a wide range of differences depending on what maker of ammo you choose in the debate. Loaded up to its potential, (by the factory ) the 10mm is serious medicine. As loaded by some mfg's, it is a weak sister an no more gun than a .40. To boot, some .40 doesn't really make grade either. Another aspect are the 10mm guns themselves. As a rule, the large frame Glock's are a handful, as in big grips and trigger span. That leaves the 1911 varieties, which are SA guns with manual safeties,not everybody's cup of tea. There are the SIG "P "family, but I've not handled a SIG 10mm, but the big SIGs (P220-226) don't fit everyone either. I'm inclined to suggest the .40, even though I'm not a real fan of the caliber. The guns will fit most anybody that can handle a double stack 9mm, the guns are available in simple to run striker or DAO (as opposed to SA safety) mode, and one has more gun, theoretically, than a 9mm.

October 8, 2017, 09:46 PM	#52
SA1911 Junior member Join Date: September 6, 2017 Posts: 147	For self-defense, go with a standard capacity; e.g., 15 rounds .40 S&W with 180 grain Federal HST Tactical ammo.

October 8, 2017, 11:37 PM	#53
dsa1115 Senior Member Join Date: March 10, 2010 Location: Illinois Posts: 444	I was interested in a G20 or a G29 but for me the grip was too large. So I bought a G23 because it fit my hand better, and bought a G32 barrel so I can shoot .357 Sig too. In .40 S&W the Federal 180 grain HST is a great load, and in .357 Sig the Underwood 125 grain bonded HP delivers 604 ft. lbs of energy and more than 1450 fps. Not too shabby. The size of a G23 works better for me.

October 17, 2017, 07:30 AM	#57
fourbore Senior Member Join Date: August 22, 2015 Location: new england Posts: 1,159	A person may not want to go to the door with a shogun at the ready just because of some uncertainty about who might be there or why. Hence have both. I also take the opportunity to say this has been a good education for me regarding the two 40 cal pistols.

October 18, 2017, 01:03 AM	#58
Iron bottom Member Join Date: May 26, 2005 Posts: 52	The 10mm was a little much for some people, so the S&W .40 was introduced. Now the .40 is being dumped for the 9mm. Will everybody be happy when we get back to cap guns?

October 18, 2017, 07:18 AM	#59
fourbore Senior Member Join Date: August 22, 2015 Location: new england Posts: 1,159	The 9mm cannot be that bad a choice for the average person and for concealed carry. It is used by what? 90% of the world military and in hardball no less. A fair bit of practice and a large dose of presence of mind and a 9mm should leave a person very well equipped. You must be pretty young not to remember all the 32 and 380. Even 25 acp. Those are a lot less popular today. Even some military used the 380 or the little Mauser rounds. For men, not girls, in police and military with open carry. My vote is a double stack 45acp. Seems a waste of time, splitting the difference. Or any law enforcement should be an individual choice. Fortunately, I am not in that position and god bless those who put them selves in harms way But, I can see the 40's might work for a few where splitting the difference works out just right. Its been an interesting read.

October 18, 2017, 10:26 AM	#61
kmw1954 Senior Member Join Date: June 11, 2016 Location: SE Wisconsin Posts: 1,524	I may be wrong because I've never owned or fired either but my perception is that of comparing the 38Spl and the 357 Mag. Now I have been contemplating a larger bore pistol then the 9mm's I own just to have something larger. Though my thinking has been more along the lines of either the 40 S&W or the 45acp. as I don't believe I'd need a 10mm version.

October 18, 2017, 07:43 PM	#62
otasan Junior member Join Date: April 17, 2005 Location: Hartford, Vermont Posts: 519	Go with the 10mm. Ammo hard to find? Online? Get a Dillon 550b reloader.

October 19, 2017, 08:31 AM	#65
kmw1954 Senior Member Join Date: June 11, 2016 Location: SE Wisconsin Posts: 1,524	mavracer I did not realize that so I learned something new today. Thanks!

October 20, 2017, 11:37 AM	#69
RickB Senior Member Join Date: March 1, 2000 Location: Boise, ID Posts: 8,518	All of the "one shot stop" stuff, if you believe it, had ratings that divided the best performers by tenths of a percent. It's not like 125gr .357 was 99% and 10mm or .40 JHPs were 50%, there were a dozen or more rounds that were in the high 90s. I distinctly remember one guy saying that his research showed .45 ACP/230gr Federal Hydra-Shok, when fired from a 5" barrel, had 100% one-shot stops. I don't know how that could possibly be true, unless that sample size was extremely small, but if there's any truth in one-shot stop "ratings", 95%-99% are essentially the same. __________________ Runs off at the mouth about anything 1911 related on this site and half the time is flat out wrong.