The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > Hogan's Alley > Tactics and Training

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old June 3, 2005, 12:49 PM   #26
tanstaafl4y
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 6, 2004
Location: Virginia
Posts: 136
Capt Charlie, Based on you posts I do realize that you are a LEO. As you noticed the quality of my post started to degrade (too close to quitting time).

I am sure that we both agree that much of law enforcement is based on Officer instinct. This come from time on the job, Formal classroom training, the stuff the crusty old FTO taught you, and just plain old gut.

I did not mean to imply "shut up and demand a lawyer". What I meant to say was that if tone of the interview with the police changes from general fact-finding type questioning to suspect interragation-type questioning a lawyer may not be a bad idea. Its hard to convey exactly what I am trying to say by a few lines of text on the internet. But I hope the "jist" of it is clear.
__________________
"There ain't no such thing as a free lunch"
-popularized by Sci-Fi author Robert A Heinlein
tanstaafl4y is offline  
Old June 3, 2005, 02:16 PM   #27
Capt. Charlie
Moderator Emeritus
 
Join Date: March 24, 2005
Location: Steubenville, OH
Posts: 4,446
I understand what you're saying, but even then, not so. If it turns out that the good guy is really the bad guy, we're under no obligation to help him out by suggesting an atty (not the same as Miranda). To the contrary, we're now on opposite sides and helping the BG will only hurt the investigation.

But in this scenario, it's established that the shooting was righteous, and I see no need to further stress out the good guy by suggesting an attorney.
__________________
TFL Members are ambassadors to the world for firearm owners. What kind of ambassador does your post make you?

I train in earnest, to do the things that I pray in earnest, I'll never have to do.

--Capt. Charlie
Capt. Charlie is offline  
Old June 9, 2005, 06:16 AM   #28
dswindle
Member
 
Join Date: January 11, 2005
Posts: 55
I am a retired LEO, and, IMHO and based upon countless conversations with lawyers over the years, I believe that a person in this scenario must really answer the following questions: Did you act reasonably, responsibly with prudence and common sense? Would most God fearing, honest, law-abiding citizens act in a similar fasion? It really boils down to common sense. A person must demonstrate by his/her actions that they took a reasonable response to a situation, and that it was not exploited to use deadly force. I cannot imagine that in any law enforcement jurisdiction (local, state or federal) that a person would not be found innocent in such a situation. Like many of the other posts have said, you might have your weapon confiscated for a brief period of time to thoroughly document the circumstances, but I seriously doubt that you would ever be charged with the violation of any law. In any potential deadly encounter situation, I think the main issue is to not to appear to be or have been a "cowboy." I realize that some people simply do not want to get involved in a situatioin like this for fear of being sued later by the BG's family, etc., but, personally, I could not just stand by and watch someone killed or injured without taking some action. I grew up watching the old westerns and John Wayne, and I guess I believe that if you always do the right thing, things will turn out right. Probably very naive of me, but that is the way I live my life. I don't want to hurt anyone, but I will NEVER be a passive victim. Just my thougts.
dswindle is offline  
Old June 9, 2005, 06:46 AM   #29
GUNSMOKE45441
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 2, 2004
Posts: 129
Great thread, great answers. Thank you all!!!
GUNSMOKE45441 is offline  
Old June 11, 2005, 06:16 PM   #30
Sulaco2
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 5, 2005
Location: Seattle
Posts: 1,247
Civ Shooting Investigation

I go with most of what Capt. Charlie said about the on site investigations, EXCEPT EVERY THING is taken as evidence, including second guns. Can't know the evidence value or ballistics until the lab has had a look. Were I giving non lawyer advise to a Cillyvian I would strongly advise NOT to give any information except "I was here and there was a shooting". Wait for your lawyer to arrive BEFORE giving your side. I have seen to often words spoken and taken down at a scene twisted by lawyers and DA's with an agenda. This advise is what our guild lawyer gives us. I did handle a scene where a civ shot at a guy on his front porch at O-dark 30 but there was no real threat and we took his gun and chewed him a new one. (perp had fled never to be IDed). He got his gun back much later....afte he took classes.

Capt. C; Being one of those Dets. you hand the scene over to Me thinks you owe us alot of us Krispy creams in your karma...
Sulaco2 is offline  
Old June 11, 2005, 08:06 PM   #31
Capt. Charlie
Moderator Emeritus
 
Join Date: March 24, 2005
Location: Steubenville, OH
Posts: 4,446
Geeze Sulaco2, you're probably right! But it's hard to buy you a coffee & a Krispy Creme at 0300 after your done canvasing the area, interviewing witnesses, looking for shell casings, bullet fragments, etc., and measuring bullet flight trajectories, 'cause I've already been asleep for 3 hours.

"Patrol. We do it all, then move on to the next."
__________________
TFL Members are ambassadors to the world for firearm owners. What kind of ambassador does your post make you?

I train in earnest, to do the things that I pray in earnest, I'll never have to do.

--Capt. Charlie
Capt. Charlie is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:20 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2021 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Page generated in 0.04595 seconds with 10 queries