Home defense shotguns???

asleepinTucson · April 25, 2002, 12:22 PM

I am interested in adding a shotgun to my home defense collection of handguns.

I have searched through previous threads and seen comments regarding the 870 and mossberg 500.

Most of these threads are not too specific as to comparison of reliability and value.

So please once again for an old handgunner new to shotguns...

Comparison of

Mossberg 500/ or 88 for home defense $199
Remington 870 express 12 guage with 18" $290
Winchester 1300 defender 12 guage with 18" $264

Thanx in advance

ReadyOnTheRight · April 25, 2002, 02:14 PM

You can't go wrong with the 870.

I've seen more than one used Mossberg 500 at gun shows that have broken safetys or messed up triggers.

There are folks here with a lot more experience than me, but I've never seen a broken 870. Maybe people just don't sell them as often.

Any of these 3 guns should be fun to own and shoot. The Mossberg has tons of inexpensive add-ons, the 1300 has a lot of faithful owners who swear it's the "fastest pump action" and the 870 is a classic.

Be sure to practice and get to know whatever you buy if you're relying on it for 3am usability. There should be plenty of places to shoot in AZ.

Good luck and enjoy!

P.S. If you want a totally jam-free guarantee, go with a side-by-side.

Correia · April 25, 2002, 02:44 PM

All 3 should have excellent reliability. I have only seen a few pump guns jam, and that was almost always due to operator error.

I am an 870 fan myself, but I don't care for the new Remingtons. I hate the internal key lock safety. And I think their quality isn't nearly as good as it used to be. I would actually skip the new express and purchase an older Wingmaster, Police, or Magnum model. (Often available for very good prices) They never really wear out. My Dad's Wingmaster from the 1950s has been abused as an all purpose farm/hunting/truck gun for decades. It has been detail stripped and cleaned once in 40 years. It still works just fine. I have had my Wingmaster for 15 years, it has had some serious finish wear, dings, scratches, and corrosion, but it still runs great.

m14nut · April 25, 2002, 03:11 PM

I own a Defender in 20ga. All I can say is I like the gun. The action is smooth as glass and it holds 8 shots. For around 250+-... you can't go wrong.
READ THE THREAD on the Defender.

Dave McC · April 25, 2002, 03:16 PM

All of the Big Three are good choices. Mine is the 870. I've put close to 50K rounds through them personally and professionally since around 1958, and had close to zero glitches.

OTOH, I've shot Mossies and Winchesters and had good results with them also. I'd still go with the 870, but....

Like someone already said, get a used one, preferably a police turnin. Spend the money you save on ammo and range fees, maybe a lesson or two with a QUALIFIED instructor.

Then, have fun. ALL of the various shotgun games are fun. Shoot Trap, Skeet, Sporting Clays, practical/tactical matches, or pigeons down at the quarry. After a few cases of ammo, and some elbow grease, you'll be surprised at just how good you've become.

HTH....

Double Naught Spy · April 25, 2002, 03:35 PM

The Rem 870 Marine Magnum was my choice because it comes with the extended magazine and the nickelling on the gun helps assure that even if you fail to lube it or wipe it down every few years, it still should not rust - good for any environment from dry to humid. I have been real happy with mine.

Whatever gun you decide on, determine the greatest potential range within your home and do a pattern board at that range to find out what the spread and pattern shape are at that distance. Do one or two intermediate distances as well. If you think you might need it outside, you might check patterns a longer distances. Do this with the ammo you plan to use as defense ammo. In mine, I patterned Federal 00 Buck Tactical at three distances with three shots at each distance. At 5 yards, the pattern was fist-sized, ~3" diameter and was basically a giant hole after three shots including the shot cups. At 10 yards, the pattern had a roughly 6" diameter circle. At 15 yards, the pattern was approximately 9" across at its greatest diameters, but more square than circular in pattern. In other words, the pattern gained roughly one inch in size for every five feet of distance added.

By knowing how your gun will perform, you can make better use of its capabilities.

If you have slugs, you may wish to check with slugs as well. My gun shoots about 6" high and left at the 1 o'clock position at 50 yards.

ReadyOnTheRight · April 25, 2002, 03:41 PM

Double Naught Spy --

I really like the 870 Marine. Do you have any idea how it would perform with slugs as a deer hunting gun?

(Gotta justify $500 for a pump shotgun somehow

)

Thanks!

Ewok_Guy · April 25, 2002, 04:02 PM

I like Winchester.

C.R.Sam · April 25, 2002, 04:14 PM

Quote:

Be sure to practice and get to know whatever you buy if you're relying on it for 3am usability. There should be plenty of places to shoot in AZ.

THAT IS A BIGGIE !

Lots of good info above.

Sam

Snake Jenkins · April 25, 2002, 05:41 PM

Look for an older Ithaca M37 they are slick as glass.

Snake

wm1300defender · April 25, 2002, 06:11 PM

Dear SleepinginTucson;
You will sleep more soundly, and will wake up more refreshed, from being content that you choose the best of the home defense pump shotguns that are out there on the market.
That being THE WINCHESTER MODEL 1300 DEFENDER.

Sleep well ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ

StevieB.

dfaugh · April 26, 2002, 05:23 PM

In order of preference (I'll pay for this!):
Mossberg
Mossberg
Mossberg

Only shotguns ever owned, hunting, clay or otherwise were all 500 variants...Some well used (my first at age 14 for example) when I got 'em....Have NEVER had any type of mechanical failure whatsover....Current HD gun is "Special Purpose" (20" Cylinder barrel, holds 8 rounds (7 in preferred S&B, 15 ball 00buck) modified w/ pistol grip, folding stock...total cost (all new) $250...

Ok, so I've never used any of the others...Why would I need to?

Mannlicher · April 26, 2002, 08:42 PM

A really good choice, is a Browning A-5, 12 ga. mag. With an optional 18 inch barrel, and proper choice of shells, it is simply awesome. Total reliability. Quick reloads, easy to handle.

1911A1 fan · April 30, 2002, 04:01 AM

For me the 1300 just feels better, smooth as glass, good stock weld, it just fits me better. One bit of trouble that I had with mine was the recoil pad. It would snag on loose clothing like jackets and robes(if its a house gun that can be a problem), so I took a disk sander and took down the sharp edges on the top and sides. Now it comes to the shoulder REAL quick!

April 25, 2002, 12:22 PM	#1
asleepinTucson Senior Member Join Date: February 3, 2002 Location: Hampton Roads, VA Posts: 107	Home defense shotguns??? I am interested in adding a shotgun to my home defense collection of handguns. I have searched through previous threads and seen comments regarding the 870 and mossberg 500. Most of these threads are not too specific as to comparison of reliability and value. So please once again for an old handgunner new to shotguns... Comparison of Mossberg 500/ or 88 for home defense $199 Remington 870 express 12 guage with 18" $290 Winchester 1300 defender 12 guage with 18" $264 Thanx in advance

April 25, 2002, 02:14 PM	#2
ReadyOnTheRight Senior Member Join Date: February 16, 2002 Location: Minneapolis, Minnesota Posts: 377	You can't go wrong with the 870. I've seen more than one used Mossberg 500 at gun shows that have broken safetys or messed up triggers. There are folks here with a lot more experience than me, but I've never seen a broken 870. Maybe people just don't sell them as often. Any of these 3 guns should be fun to own and shoot. The Mossberg has tons of inexpensive add-ons, the 1300 has a lot of faithful owners who swear it's the "fastest pump action" and the 870 is a classic. Be sure to practice and get to know whatever you buy if you're relying on it for 3am usability. There should be plenty of places to shoot in AZ. Good luck and enjoy! P.S. If you want a totally jam-free guarantee, go with a side-by-side. __________________ "Personal weapons are what raised mankind out of the mud, and the rifle is the queen of personal weapons. The possession of a good rifle, as well as the skill to use it well, truly makes a man the monarch of all he surveys." -Jeff Cooper, The Art of the Rifle-

April 25, 2002, 03:35 PM	#6
Double Naught Spy Senior Member Join Date: January 8, 2001 Location: Forestburg, Montague Cnty, TX Posts: 12,717	The Rem 870 Marine Magnum was my choice because it comes with the extended magazine and the nickelling on the gun helps assure that even if you fail to lube it or wipe it down every few years, it still should not rust - good for any environment from dry to humid. I have been real happy with mine. Whatever gun you decide on, determine the greatest potential range within your home and do a pattern board at that range to find out what the spread and pattern shape are at that distance. Do one or two intermediate distances as well. If you think you might need it outside, you might check patterns a longer distances. Do this with the ammo you plan to use as defense ammo. In mine, I patterned Federal 00 Buck Tactical at three distances with three shots at each distance. At 5 yards, the pattern was fist-sized, ~3" diameter and was basically a giant hole after three shots including the shot cups. At 10 yards, the pattern had a roughly 6" diameter circle. At 15 yards, the pattern was approximately 9" across at its greatest diameters, but more square than circular in pattern. In other words, the pattern gained roughly one inch in size for every five feet of distance added. By knowing how your gun will perform, you can make better use of its capabilities. If you have slugs, you may wish to check with slugs as well. My gun shoots about 6" high and left at the 1 o'clock position at 50 yards. __________________ "If you look through your scope and see your shoe, aim higher." -- said to me by my 11 year old daughter before going out for hogs 8/13/2011 My Hunting Videos https://www.youtube.com/user/HornHillRange

April 25, 2002, 03:41 PM	#7
ReadyOnTheRight Senior Member Join Date: February 16, 2002 Location: Minneapolis, Minnesota Posts: 377	Double Naught Spy -- I really like the 870 Marine. Do you have any idea how it would perform with slugs as a deer hunting gun? (Gotta justify $500 for a pump shotgun somehow ) Thanks! __________________ "Personal weapons are what raised mankind out of the mud, and the rifle is the queen of personal weapons. The possession of a good rifle, as well as the skill to use it well, truly makes a man the monarch of all he surveys." -Jeff Cooper, The Art of the Rifle-

April 25, 2002, 04:02 PM	#8
Ewok_Guy Senior Member Join Date: April 11, 2001 Location: Endor Posts: 1,664	I like Winchester. __________________ "Death and honor are thought to be the same, but today I have learned that sometimes they are not." --------------------- " I like big fat men like you. When they fall they make more noise! ...and sometimes they never get up." -Tuco Benedicto Pacifico Juan Maria Ramirez

April 25, 2002, 02:44 PM	#3
Correia Senior Member Join Date: December 3, 1998 Location: SLC Utah Posts: 3,740	All 3 should have excellent reliability. I have only seen a few pump guns jam, and that was almost always due to operator error. I am an 870 fan myself, but I don't care for the new Remingtons. I hate the internal key lock safety. And I think their quality isn't nearly as good as it used to be. I would actually skip the new express and purchase an older Wingmaster, Police, or Magnum model. (Often available for very good prices) They never really wear out. My Dad's Wingmaster from the 1950s has been abused as an all purpose farm/hunting/truck gun for decades. It has been detail stripped and cleaned once in 40 years. It still works just fine. I have had my Wingmaster for 15 years, it has had some serious finish wear, dings, scratches, and corrosion, but it still runs great.

April 25, 2002, 03:11 PM	#4
m14nut Senior Member Join Date: January 28, 2002 Location: United States Posts: 375	I own a Defender in 20ga. All I can say is I like the gun. The action is smooth as glass and it holds 8 shots. For around 250+-... you can't go wrong. READ THE THREAD on the Defender.

April 25, 2002, 03:16 PM	#5
Dave McC Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 13, 1999 Location: Columbia, Md, USA Posts: 8,811	All of the Big Three are good choices. Mine is the 870. I've put close to 50K rounds through them personally and professionally since around 1958, and had close to zero glitches. OTOH, I've shot Mossies and Winchesters and had good results with them also. I'd still go with the 870, but.... Like someone already said, get a used one, preferably a police turnin. Spend the money you save on ammo and range fees, maybe a lesson or two with a QUALIFIED instructor. Then, have fun. ALL of the various shotgun games are fun. Shoot Trap, Skeet, Sporting Clays, practical/tactical matches, or pigeons down at the quarry. After a few cases of ammo, and some elbow grease, you'll be surprised at just how good you've become. HTH....

April 25, 2002, 05:41 PM	#10
Snake Jenkins Registration in progress Join Date: April 18, 2002 Posts: 37	Look for an older Ithaca M37 they are slick as glass. Snake

April 25, 2002, 06:11 PM	#11
wm1300defender Junior Member Join Date: March 30, 2002 Location: charlotte,n.c. Posts: 12	Dear sleepinginTucson Dear SleepinginTucson; You will sleep more soundly, and will wake up more refreshed, from being content that you choose the best of the home defense pump shotguns that are out there on the market. That being THE WINCHESTER MODEL 1300 DEFENDER. Sleep well ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ StevieB.

April 26, 2002, 05:23 PM	#12
dfaugh Senior Member Join Date: January 17, 2002 Location: Upstate NY Posts: 1,715	In order of preference (I'll pay for this!): Mossberg Mossberg Mossberg Only shotguns ever owned, hunting, clay or otherwise were all 500 variants...Some well used (my first at age 14 for example) when I got 'em....Have NEVER had any type of mechanical failure whatsover....Current HD gun is "Special Purpose" (20" Cylinder barrel, holds 8 rounds (7 in preferred S&B, 15 ball 00buck) modified w/ pistol grip, folding stock...total cost (all new) $250... Ok, so I've never used any of the others...Why would I need to? __________________ "If you Listen to Fools, the Mob Rules" "No one has the answer, but one thing is true. You'e got to turn on evil, when its coming after you. You've gotta face it down,and when it tries to hide, you've got to go in after it, and never be denied. Time is running out...Let's roll. Let's roll for freedom, let's roll for love. We're going after satan, on the wings of a dove. Let's roll for freedom, let's roll for truth. Let's not let our children grow up fearful in their youth."

April 26, 2002, 08:42 PM	#13
Mannlicher Senior Member Join Date: July 8, 2001 Location: North Central Florida & Miami Posts: 3,209	A really good choice, is a Browning A-5, 12 ga. mag. With an optional 18 inch barrel, and proper choice of shells, it is simply awesome. Total reliability. Quick reloads, easy to handle. __________________ Nemo Me Impune Lacesset "The trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant; it's just that they know so much that isn't so.".........Ronald Reagan

April 30, 2002, 04:01 AM	#14
1911A1 fan Senior Member Join Date: August 26, 2001 Posts: 155	Defender For me the 1300 just feels better, smooth as glass, good stock weld, it just fits me better. One bit of trouble that I had with mine was the recoil pad. It would snag on loose clothing like jackets and robes(if its a house gun that can be a problem), so I took a disk sander and took down the sharp edges on the top and sides. Now it comes to the shoulder REAL quick!