The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > The Hide > The Art of the Rifle: Semi-automatics

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old May 12, 2017, 07:24 PM   #1
stagpanther
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 2, 2014
Posts: 11,654
Kaboomed 25 x 45 Lives Again

When we last left my little saga I had finally got my kaboomed AR apart after resorting to invasive surgery. I had also ordered parts to put together yet another build after ordering a 6mm predator barrel from ARP. All the parts came in--but no barrel as of yet so, after a while at staring at all the parts--the left-over sharp's barrel--the parts..yep, they mysteriously flew together into a new 25 x 45 AR.

Due to hard times--and the fact that assembled AR's are actually cheaper at this moment than ones you can build for yourself--I had to skimp somewhat on parts and ordered budget stuff from Delta Team. In particular I wanted to try out the Omega super slim free float rail for about $40--seems interesting for a skeletonized rail. I generally don't hang anything off my rails anyway other than the occasional bipod. Two things that are not mentioned about this handguard--the rail keys not to the gas tube port in the receiver--but to the attachment screw holes in the the barrel nut. First time I've ever seen this ridiculous arrangement. lol Lucky for me I keep a supply of receiver/nut shims handy--the solution is rather simple, screw the rail into the barrel nut and then use a strap-cinch grip on the torque wrench in order to key the rail to match the receiver's rail. Easy if you have the right parts and gear--probably leave you cursing if you don't.



I also bought their panzer muzzle brake--which as far as I can tell besides looking sorta cool all it really seems to do is make the report sound MUCH louder than it normally does--if you ever wanted your 5.56 AR to echo through the woods like a magnum 12 gauge--this is the brake for you.

After assembly I went out for some test firing and had intermittent jamming problems with spent cases being left in the chamber.I though I had done a pretty good job cleaning the barrel--but after all it had been exposed to a massive kaboom so it took it home and gave it a bath in Bore Tech's various cleaner, later using multiple brushes I removed what looked like, for lack of a better description, a greenish sludge.

Back out to the range to try to dial in the rifle--after getting on paper I managed a few shots with left-over factory 2nd's blemished ammo from Sharps that I still had lying around. I think it shows promise and I expect better results once I get back to reloading some home-brews.



Of course, when I got home I found an e-mail from ARP that my new barrel and bolt had shipped.
__________________
"Everyone speaks gun."--Robert O'Neill
I am NOT an expert--I do not have any formal experience or certification in firearms use or testing; use any information I post at your own risk!
stagpanther is offline  
Old May 13, 2017, 03:13 AM   #2
armoredman
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 22, 2007
Location: Arizona
Posts: 5,295
"Greenish sludge?: Your rifle didn't kaboom - you had a leprechaun stuffed down the bore, that's what caused the barrel obstruction!
Very cool on the rebuild, thank you for the update.
armoredman is offline  
Old May 13, 2017, 05:19 AM   #3
stagpanther
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 2, 2014
Posts: 11,654
Quote:
"Greenish sludge?: Your rifle didn't kaboom - you had a leprechaun stuffed down the bore, that's what caused the barrel obstruction!
must have left his beer in their, too.

One nice thing about using cheapo parts (maybe the only thing) I seem to have shaved almost a pound off the overall weight compared to the first incarnation.
__________________
"Everyone speaks gun."--Robert O'Neill
I am NOT an expert--I do not have any formal experience or certification in firearms use or testing; use any information I post at your own risk!
stagpanther is offline  
Old May 13, 2017, 02:33 PM   #4
marine6680
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 24, 2012
Location: Parker, CO
Posts: 4,594
No concerns over the barrel structural integrity?
marine6680 is offline  
Old May 13, 2017, 03:56 PM   #5
stagpanther
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 2, 2014
Posts: 11,654
Quote:
No concerns over the barrel structural integrity?
That's a very good question--to which I honestly don't know the answer except that my guess is that pressure within the chamber itself was likely limited as pressure vented off through the case head failure into the top receiver. Being a heavy 416 SS barrel and extension I'm not that worried--though maybe I should be.
__________________
"Everyone speaks gun."--Robert O'Neill
I am NOT an expert--I do not have any formal experience or certification in firearms use or testing; use any information I post at your own risk!
stagpanther is offline  
Old May 13, 2017, 04:08 PM   #6
stagpanther
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 2, 2014
Posts: 11,654
BTW--a second Jard trigger came in for my 6mm predator build, which I am also using an Andersen lower for. Fortunately this trigger was their curved 2 stage adjustable--but I ran into trouble once again getting the safety selector on after making the sear and over-travel adjustments. Eventually I got the safety in but was forced to make the trigger adjustments after--not before--the safety selector was installed. Since this is two installs in a row that had difficulties with the rear of the trigger clearing the safety, I'm inclined to conclude that there must be a slight difference between Andersen's fire control group well dimensions and that of other manufacturers. My previous experience was with their adjustable xx308 trigger groups which installed easily and worked great, these for the AR15 are just a little more "temperamental" I guess. I will call Jard is see what they have to say.
__________________
"Everyone speaks gun."--Robert O'Neill
I am NOT an expert--I do not have any formal experience or certification in firearms use or testing; use any information I post at your own risk!
stagpanther is offline  
Old May 22, 2017, 06:36 AM   #7
stagpanther
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 2, 2014
Posts: 11,654
Tuned up the trigger and it works fine now; though I still prefer the jard adjustable.

Whipped up up some 90 gr gameking home-brews to see if the gun shoots any better with them

__________________
"Everyone speaks gun."--Robert O'Neill
I am NOT an expert--I do not have any formal experience or certification in firearms use or testing; use any information I post at your own risk!
stagpanther is offline  
Old May 22, 2017, 12:05 PM   #8
stagpanther
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 2, 2014
Posts: 11,654
Tests went very well--in fact it was hard to tell from one group to the next which one was actually shooting better. This was because the gun is shooting ahead of me--meaning I'm not shooting it well enough to get better groups. Part of this is I'm pulling the gun a bit when pulling the trigger--the trigger is breaking somewhere between 3.5 and 4 lbs I'm guessing, and I'm not holding it steady enough all the way through the pull. After getting a few shots very close I also choked on the anticipation of keeping the whole thing together.







__________________
"Everyone speaks gun."--Robert O'Neill
I am NOT an expert--I do not have any formal experience or certification in firearms use or testing; use any information I post at your own risk!
stagpanther is offline  
Old May 22, 2017, 10:09 PM   #9
TnTnTn
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 2, 2013
Location: Middle TN
Posts: 140
What powder are you using? Oh checking our correspondence from when I bought your dies I found the powder.
TnTnTn is offline  
Old May 23, 2017, 06:46 AM   #10
stagpanther
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 2, 2014
Posts: 11,654
In this particular load--Ramshot X-terminator. You can see that it shoots very consistently across quite a range of charges. QL says it's not the most efficient burning one, so top velocities might be a bit less than what you might otherwise get, but in my 18" bhw-made barrel it seems to shoot very well. If it stops raining today I'm going to give it another go and try to do better holding the rifle steady.
__________________
"Everyone speaks gun."--Robert O'Neill
I am NOT an expert--I do not have any formal experience or certification in firearms use or testing; use any information I post at your own risk!
stagpanther is offline  
Old May 23, 2017, 07:08 AM   #11
stagpanther
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 2, 2014
Posts: 11,654
Incidentally, I bought an AR stoner BCG from Midway, seemed like a budget buy and I've had consistent quality results with their other products, though not outstanding. I have a talent for buying "problem" parts it seems. The website says the carrier is made to mil-spec, but I found carrier and bolt dimensions were about .001" or so narrower than every other carrier and bolt I have--meaning I cannot swap bolts out into the stoner carrier--even if they fit, the firing pin cam pin will not properly fit and clear using a different bolt. The first time I tried using it I had cartridges jam in the chamber, and I thought I had a pressure issue or some other problem--turns out the extractor claw had simply snapped off on first use.
__________________
"Everyone speaks gun."--Robert O'Neill
I am NOT an expert--I do not have any formal experience or certification in firearms use or testing; use any information I post at your own risk!
stagpanther is offline  
Old May 23, 2017, 11:30 AM   #12
stagpanther
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 2, 2014
Posts: 11,654
Went out this morning and tried the 27.4 gr loads once again, shot a few 5 shot groups at 100 yds and continued to have problems holding the rifle steady--I could get a few shots really close together, but I could see the reticle drift on the target as I pulled the trigger. I think it's mostly because I'm shooting off a front bag and using a block of wood as a rear rest.

As a last resort, I decided to hold the front rail way out--I've learned from experience a few AR carbine configurations seem to shoot better when held this way, and I got this:



It may be a fluke, but as Tom Petty says, even the losers get lucky sometimes. Not bad for a well-used 2 year old barrel that has been kaboomed.
__________________
"Everyone speaks gun."--Robert O'Neill
I am NOT an expert--I do not have any formal experience or certification in firearms use or testing; use any information I post at your own risk!

Last edited by stagpanther; May 24, 2017 at 02:14 PM.
stagpanther is offline  
Old May 24, 2017, 08:04 PM   #13
ed308
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 5, 2016
Location: DFW, TX
Posts: 1,147
Quote:
As a last resort, I decided to hold the front rail way out--I've learned from experience a few AR carbine configurations seem to shoot better when held this way, and I got this:
Wow I'll say. Nice group. What's the technique?
ed308 is offline  
Old May 25, 2017, 02:28 AM   #14
stagpanther
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 2, 2014
Posts: 11,654
Quote:
Wow I'll say. Nice group. What's the technique?
Thanks--Nothing special or "pro" I simply lightly put my left hand atop the rail (the subtle change in holding the gun does change the POI, BTW) to help keep the gun from moving while pulling the trigger. If I had a better rest set-up--and better technique to begin with, I probably wouldn't do this--what I'm saying is that I'm making no claim at all that this would help anyone else shoot better groups--just that it helped me in this case. I read shooters say things like "shoot clover leafs all day"--that only happens to me once or twice a year regardless of whatever type of gun I use.

I'm back to working on my 6mm predator project, that one is a tricky one cause no dies exist for it yet so it's a bit challenging to improvise, as well I'm trying to modify the magazines so I get a cleaner chambering of the round--once I'm done with that I will load some more 25 x 45 cartridges and see if I can get close to repeating the results above.
__________________
"Everyone speaks gun."--Robert O'Neill
I am NOT an expert--I do not have any formal experience or certification in firearms use or testing; use any information I post at your own risk!

Last edited by stagpanther; May 25, 2017 at 02:38 AM.
stagpanther is offline  
Old May 25, 2017, 07:53 AM   #15
ed308
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 5, 2016
Location: DFW, TX
Posts: 1,147
I'll have to try that. Same for me. Can't remember the last time I shot a tight clover leaf. I seem to be stuck at 1/2" groups at 100 yards no matter what I do. I'm hoping to break that barrier with my Savage 10T now that I've swapped out the stock to a MDT stock that has better cheek weld.

ed308 is offline  
Old May 25, 2017, 09:24 AM   #16
stagpanther
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 2, 2014
Posts: 11,654
Quote:
1/2" groups at 100 yards no matter what I do
I'd MUCH rather be stuck there than my "most of the time" .75 - 1 MOA
__________________
"Everyone speaks gun."--Robert O'Neill
I am NOT an expert--I do not have any formal experience or certification in firearms use or testing; use any information I post at your own risk!
stagpanther is offline  
Old May 25, 2017, 11:36 AM   #17
ed308
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 5, 2016
Location: DFW, TX
Posts: 1,147
Well, if I don't skip the coffee on the way to the range then its 1/2+!
ed308 is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:45 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2021 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Page generated in 0.10303 seconds with 8 queries