The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > The Skunkworks > Handloading, Reloading, and Bullet Casting

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old May 16, 2018, 07:53 AM   #1
AKolomiets
Member
 
Join Date: May 13, 2018
Posts: 22
Seating .224 TMK

Hey guys, i’m trying to load some .223 Rem loads with Sierra 55g Blitzking and 77g TMKs. I’m using Hornady dies... looks like the seating stem that comes with them isn’t “deep” enough to clear the polymer tips. Hornady’s ELD seating stems have worked great on other caliber dies, even with Nosler RDF and Berger VLD bullets, but I can’t seem to find an ELD type seating stem that drops in to a .223 die. Anyone have similar issues/solutions?
AKolomiets is offline  
Old May 16, 2018, 03:30 PM   #2
T. O'Heir
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 13, 2002
Location: Canada
Posts: 10,140
Don't worry about the point. Only the base matters. The seating stem won't hurt the plastic point anyway.
__________________
Spelling and grammar count!
T. O'Heir is offline  
Old May 16, 2018, 03:43 PM   #3
Unclenick
Staff
 
Join Date: March 4, 2005
Location: Ohio
Posts: 14,998
AKolomiets,

Welcome to the forum.

It's not true that only the base matters. It just matters a good deal more than the nose. If the seater is changing the tip profile, that can affect ballistic coefficient for long range work, and BC is what you buy the TMK for.

You can call Hornady and ask if they will make you an appropriate seating stem. However, if you are getting into accuracy loading, I will remind you that secant ogive bullets like the TMK's are much touchier about the finished round having low runout to get the bullet to go straight into the throat of your barrel. I highly recommend, despite the cost (and it is pricey), investing in a Redding Competition Seating Die for the reasons discussed here. My own measurements have confirmed what Mr. Salazar found. Redding makes VLD stems for the die (see this chart; part number 55742).
__________________
Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member
CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor
NRA Certified Rifle Instructor
NRA Benefactor Member and Golden Eagle
Unclenick is offline  
Old May 21, 2018, 11:44 AM   #4
AKolomiets
Member
 
Join Date: May 13, 2018
Posts: 22
Thanks Unclenick! Do the Redding dies thread in to LNL bushings just like Hornady dies? I was checking compatibility with my press but couldn’t find any thread measurement details for these two
AKolomiets is offline  
Old May 21, 2018, 11:57 AM   #5
T. O'Heir
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 13, 2002
Location: Canada
Posts: 10,140
Bullet points have no affect on accuracy whatsoever.
__________________
Spelling and grammar count!
T. O'Heir is offline  
Old May 21, 2018, 02:38 PM   #6
Unclenick
Staff
 
Join Date: March 4, 2005
Location: Ohio
Posts: 14,998
T. O'Heir,

There are two effects:

First effect: in his book, Rifle Accuracy Facts, Harold Vaughn, former Head Aeroballistician for Sandia National Laboratories in the U.S., filed 2° slants on the bases of some .270 Winchester bullets and showed they were responsible for about 0.8" of radius of dispersion at 100 yards (a 1.6" average diameter group). He found slanting soft points at 45° on the same size bullets causes a radius of dispersion of 0.135", or a 0.27" group diameter. So it's not zero effect, it's just too small for most people to notice their average group opening up. Unless you were shooting bugholes from the bench, you wouldn't see it, because group size contributions don't add linearly. To add linearly, all sources of error would have to be in the same direction at the same time for every shot, but they aren't. Sometimes they subtract from the direction another source of error is going, and mostly they are off at an angle between those two extremes. This causes error sources to add the way standard deviations do: as the square root of the sum of their squares.

So, if you have a .270 Winchester shooting Vaughn's bullets into 1" at 100 yards, then you let the feed ramp start hammering the soft points so they get a 45° flat across them, the resulting combined error source group size in inches will be: √(1²+0.27²)=1.038". That's so much less than the variation most people get in their groups at that range that they may be excused for thinking the slant on the nose has no measurable effect. It actually can be measured, but only with very precise bughole benchrest guns.

Second effect: (This is the reason meplat uniforming trimmers and Whidden pointing dies sell, and why Nosler has just introduced a match bullet with the smallest meplat diameter made.) Smashing that blunt slant into the nose of the bullet reduces its ballistic coefficient by giving it a more blunt, less aerodynamic tip shape. The average shooter firing with hunting accuracy at 300 yards or less doesn't normally notice the effect of this, but long-range target shooters see the change in bullet drop. Even with undeformed noses, hollow point match bullets have enough tip variation to cause several inches difference in drop at 1000 yards. Bryan Litz has information on this at his site, IIRC, and in his books for certain.
__________________
Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member
CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor
NRA Certified Rifle Instructor
NRA Benefactor Member and Golden Eagle
Unclenick is offline  
Old May 21, 2018, 06:25 PM   #7
243winxb
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 26, 2011
Location: USA
Posts: 1,687
Quote:
(With) the use of a drill press. Secure the seating plug under a 3/32" bit and drill further into it. The distance should never be increased more than 1/4"


http://leeprecision.net/support/inde...-seating-plugs

Fron Lee, using there dies.
243winxb is offline  
Old May 22, 2018, 04:24 PM   #8
Unclenick
Staff
 
Join Date: March 4, 2005
Location: Ohio
Posts: 14,998
Quote:
Originally Posted by AKolomiets
Do the Redding dies thread in to LNL bushings just like Hornady dies? I was checking compatibility with my press but couldn’t find any thread measurement details for these two
Sorry, I got distracted and failed to answer this. All standard reloading dies have threads that are 7/8"-14 TPI. The three exceptions are the special Dillon dies for their Square Deal press, the big 1¼-12 and 1½-12 dies for 50 BMG and other mammoth cartridges, and some antique hand tool dies. So, yes, they will fit.
__________________
Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member
CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor
NRA Certified Rifle Instructor
NRA Benefactor Member and Golden Eagle
Unclenick is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:45 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2018 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.05534 seconds with 9 queries