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Old September 21, 2023, 05:53 PM   #1
marvintm1
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Weird Case Head Marks 9mm Staccato XC

First 1000 rounds through my new XC and finding these marks on EVERY spent case. I cannot figure out where its coming from.

I dont think its the slide picking up the round, since I can slingshot the slide on a dummy round and cannot replicate the mark, even with Dyekem on the brass.

As well, a new round gets picked up from the slide with the round angled UP at the nose, down at the base. The slide breach face at moment of contact with the next round would be rounding over the rim, not the square flat contact seen.

As well, the part of slide that DOES make contact picking up the round reaches almost to the primer pocket, wouldn't make this tiny 1/32" wide mark so close to the edge.

The square face ejector is not a dimensional match either. It contacts at 4 O-Clock and would leave a square corner imprint not a line.

Maybe the round is hitting the ejection port on the way out, but it is CONSISTENTLY marked and on every single round, not random as I would expect. Also there are NO errant brass marks on the black DLC finish (brass abrasions show bright on DLC).

Can anybody verify what their Staccato spent casing heads look like?
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Old September 21, 2023, 07:02 PM   #2
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I can’t say I have noticed the brass from my C2 looking like that. You could always email Staccato.
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Old September 21, 2023, 10:15 PM   #3
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A photo of the slides face would help.

I will guess there is a cut out where the ejector comes thru the slide face and contacts the case head on ejection/firing?
At the time of firing, maximm pressure, action closed, the void in the slide face is allowing brass too flow into it?
Or could be a burr on the opening or soft brass?
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Old September 22, 2023, 07:02 AM   #4
Jim Watson
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Is that the orientation that they were in the gun, the whack mark is at the bottom as fired? If so, I can't visualize a contact in the gun.
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Old September 22, 2023, 07:17 AM   #5
74A95
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See this link, and post #3 by Intel6.

https://forums.brianenos.com/topic/2...ass-head-mark/

P.S. It's no big deal. Ignore it.
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Old September 22, 2023, 11:32 AM   #6
Jim Watson
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Right, it is sometimes called a "J cut". It should have been flat but as that Benos thread says, is actually quite common.

Reason I asked the orientation. The J cut is on the side, not the bottom.
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Old September 22, 2023, 12:39 PM   #7
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Hum...if i'm getting a step on a case, I want it from a stepped chamber and not some unexpected bad tooling.

It might be fine, but I'd ask them to fix since they charge really high prices. From a price point, I would call it not part of the spec, so an out of spec part they should correct.

Might be minority here. I accept it
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Old September 22, 2023, 01:41 PM   #8
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Unless there is a mark on the brass in some way to consistently id the orientation in the chamber when fired, there's no way to know from the fired case you pick up off the ground exactly what position it was in when fired.

I have a SIG that leaves the little "drag mark" from the firing pin on the primer. Visual ID of cases fired in that gun is simple and obvious and the location of the mark is constant, so you can tell the "clock face" position of fired cases from that.

I agree it is most likely a small "ledge" on the breechface that is marking your brass like that. IF it has no effect on function, ignore it.

If it has an effect on your reloading the brass, that would be your problem, as the maker's responsibility is to make a gun that feeds, fires and ejects each round properly, ONCE.

Most guns are fairly reloader friends, but some aren't and there are even some that mangle the fired brass.

Many makers try to set things up so their guns do not overly damage fired brass, realizing that reloaders are customers too, and happy reloaders are happy customers and that is good for business.

Other gun makers simply don't give a rip, their only concern about fired brass is that it ejects clear of the gun. The rest is on you, or me.

To me, if that mark isn't interfering with anything, its cosmetic, and can be ignored.
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Old September 22, 2023, 03:16 PM   #9
wild cat mccane
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I theory, couldn't an imperfect spec breech face affect lock up? or is that too insignificant?

I ask to learn.
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Old September 22, 2023, 03:30 PM   #10
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In theory it could, but it would depend on what was out of spec and how much it was, as to whether or not it actually would.

I'm thinking something that drastically wrong wouldn't get past factory QA/QC inspectors, but (fortunately rarely) sometimes things like that do.
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Old September 23, 2023, 09:44 AM   #11
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Found It - Breech face J-cut

I could not see it until I cleaned the face, then pressed a clean case in there and the brass rubbed a gold mark highlighting the raised land. The J-Cut radius cutter didn't go deep enough to meet the previously machined breech face. Its probably raised by .001.

Wont happen on manual round cycling due to headspace clearance. Its marking only during firing when the brass is pushed onto the face under +32,000 psi. I would have seen this had I fired some with the same head stamp positioned the same orientation.

Well Damn.
Staccato will be fixing this minor QC miss.
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File Type: jpg Breech2.jpg (276.3 KB, 55 views)
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Old September 23, 2023, 11:01 AM   #12
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Quote:
Staccato will be fixing this minor QC miss.
Will they??

You've spoken to them and they have said, "send it in" ??

The style, features, pricepoint of the gun and their advertising about it says to me "We are quality (buy our gun), so they should, and they ought to fix the minor QC miss.

But until you deal with them, you never know.

Just playing devil's advocate here, but I don't know anything about the company, other that what I just found on the web, and have no idea about their customer service quality.

There have been a couple of "big name" pistols makers who have had "disagreeable" attitudes towards their customers in the past, so its possible a company I know nothing about might go that route.

If they care about their customers, it will show. If they don't, that will show, too.

Good Luck, and let us know how you get your issue resolved.
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Old September 23, 2023, 01:30 PM   #13
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Resolved it myself - no prob

I used a fine jewelers file and cut it down to the width of the 1/16" offending raised land so as not to effect the remaining face and gently removed the raised land. Used dyekem, small stone, and a loupe to verify when it was flat and even. Finished the face with some fine stone stokes and its clean and flat with a sharp inside corner.

I Doubt Staccato would have done much different.

Thanks for the help all!
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Old September 23, 2023, 01:34 PM   #14
Jim Watson
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Now shoot it and see if your cases are flat.
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Old September 23, 2023, 01:49 PM   #15
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Quote:
Staccato will be fixing this minor QC miss.
I seriously doubt they would have. It is essentially a non-issue. Function isn't affected, it doesn't hurt the brass (I can see a double mark on some of your cases so they apparently reloaded just fine)--it's basically a total non-issue from any possible practical standpoint. It wasn't even detectable on the gun until you knew exactly what to look for and where.

My guess is that they would have told you that it's a non-issue and just to keep shooting the gun.
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Old September 24, 2023, 01:27 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marvintm1 View Post
I used a fine jewelers file and cut it down to the width of the 1/16" offending raised land so as not to effect the remaining face and gently removed the raised land. Used dyekem, small stone, and a loupe to verify when it was flat and even. Finished the face with some fine stone stokes and its clean and flat with a sharp inside corner.

I Doubt Staccato would have done much different.

Thanks for the help all!
Nice job, sometimes just fixing it yourself is the least hassle, provided you have some proper tools and the skills to use them. I would have just lived with it, I don’t think it would have had any negative impact on reusing the brass but kudos to you for a job well done.
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Old September 25, 2023, 10:55 AM   #17
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Quote:
Wont happen on manual round cycling due to headspace clearance. Its marking only during firing when the brass is pushed onto the face under +32,000 psi.
They why do two cases in your first photo have a double impression?

It is happening when the slide closes.
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Old September 25, 2023, 01:00 PM   #18
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Congratulations on having a Staccato.
It's the main gun best-selling author John Sandford has chosen for his character Letty Davenport in his latest series of books. Letty of course uses the gun to good effect in the books. Here's the first two of the series in case you're interested.

The Investigator
https://www.amazon.com/Investigator-...ps%2C86&sr=8-1

Dark Angel
https://www.amazon.com/Dark-Angel-Jo...ps%2C92&sr=8-1

I liked them but then I like everything John Sandford (aka John Camp) writes.
With the latest Letty book, Dark Angel, Sandford is including a lot more gun-talk than he has in previous books which seems to be irritating some of his fans.

Good for you for fixing the problem yourself but it would have been nice to know what Staccato would have done about it since they bill themselves as being a very high end manufacturer.
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Old October 26, 2023, 10:04 PM   #19
marvintm1
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The double marks were from reloading and re-firing the same case.

They would not get marked when dropping the slide. Only during firing do the case heads press into the breach hard enough to get such witness marks.

NO more marking on newly fired brass. Resolved.

Staccato apologized and offered to fix it, but just not worth the hassle of shipping.

Yes I am happy with the XC. Its super accurate, easy to maintain, well finished.
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