.380 Makarov?

[Nine the Ranger]

So being a collector of com-bloc weaponry imagine my surpise when I stumble upon a Makarov in my LGS with a tag of $250.

YES

Then came confusion and intruige when I was told that it chambered in .380 ACP. Strange, I knew there were commercial Maks but never in .380

It seems reliable but I've just never come across anything like this, anyone have any experience with these?

[JohnKSa]

For awhile in the 1990s, someone (can't remember the name of the company--maybe KBI?) was importing commercial Russian Makarovs (branded Baikal) in .380ACP.

In addition, during the same timeframe there was a company selling replacement barrels for Maks in .380ACP along with the press needed to install them.

As far as I know, there's really nothing special about them. A friend of mine has one and hasn't had any problems with it. The two cartridges are pretty similar in practice so I would expect it to behave just like a Mak in the more common chambering.

[Geezerbiker]

I bought one new for my daughter back around 1995. I don't remember who was importing them at the time. She wanted a Glock but at the time the clinton gun ban made Glocks way over priced...

Tony

[PolarFBear]

Bought mine, used, 15 years ago. Still a good .380., no complaints. Paid $150 for mine. Would like to find another one at a "reasonable" price. I no longer carry my Walther. The Makarov is it's replacement. "Disposable".

[railroader]

I had a couple in the past in 380. The first one was a double stack hi cap in the early 90s. That one had a over throated barrel that would bulge cases.

[Forte S+W]

The Baikal IJ-70 is a commercial Makarov PM chambered in .380 ACP which was built specifically for import sales.

Based on what I've read, they're good, inexpensive guns, which are softer shooting than their 9x18 counterparts.
I nearly bought one myself once, but decided that I was better off just being patient and saving up for the Walther PPK/S that I really wanted.

[T. O'Heir]

KBI Importer of Harrisburg, PA. brought 'em in before Clinton got the Russians to agree to stop exporting 'em in 1996.
The .380 was called an IJ-70A and is a Russian copy of the Walther PP(that you can still get. I think.)
$250 isn't a bad price. They run $300 and up on Gunbroker. Mags are running about $30 each.

[Forte S+W]

Unfortunately the Walther PP went out of production in 1999, never to return.
However, it's son, the PPK and grandson, the PPK/S just went back into production after a good 5 year hiatus.

The PPK is essentially a miniaturized PP and the PPK/S is a hybrid between the two which combines the barrel and slide of the PPK with the grip of the PP.

That being said, the PPK(/S) costs around $600 for a new one, whereas a Baikal IJ-70 typically costs less than half that price. (I saw one a few years ago priced as low as $150 without a box.)

The Makarov PM is the Russian answer the the German Walther PP, bulkier, heavier, and more powerful. (Chambered in 9x18 Makarov as opposed to .32 ACP and .380 ACP.)

[lee n. field]

Originally Posted by Nine the Ranger

So being a collector of com-bloc weaponry imagine my surpise when I stumble upon a Makarov in my LGS with a tag of $250.

YES

Then came confusion and intrigue when I was told that it chambered in .380 ACP. Strange, I knew there were commercial Maks but never in .380

It seems reliable but I've just never come across anything like this, anyone have any experience with these?

Some Russian commercial Makarovs were in .380. I have one. Reliable, but (mine at least) has a chamber and feed ramp that leaves quite a belly on fired brass.

Also, some Bulgarian Arsenal Maks were in .380, also for the commercial (not police or military) market. The Arsenal commercial Maks have a squared off trigger guard.

Standard 9x18 Makarov magazines work just fine for .380.

[lee n. field]

Originally Posted by JohnKSa

For awhile in the 1990s, someone (can't remember the name of the company--maybe KBI?) was importing commercial Russian Makarovs (branded Baikal) in .380ACP.

In addition, during the same timeframe there was a company selling replacement barrels for Maks in .380ACP along with the press needed to install them.

As far as I know, there's really nothing special about them. A friend of mine has one and hasn't had any problems with it. The two cartridges are pretty similar in practice so I would expect it to behave just like a Mak in the more common chambering.

KBI, I think, yes, and others.

A now defunct gun parts company, Federal Arms, I think, had .380 barrels. I have one, as well as the barrel press and barrel pin to swap it in. And, alas, my only Mak now is the .380 Baikal.

Yep, not much special about the .380.

[JohnKSa]

A now defunct gun parts company, Federal Arms, I think, had .380 barrels.

Yes! That's it. I had forgotten all about them.

[EIGHTYDUECE]

Big Bear was also an importer of commercial Russian Makarovs. In the 1990's 9x18 Makarov ammo could only be found in surplus FMJ. It made a lot of sense to buy a .380 ACP barreled variant for access to a large variety of premium hollow point self defense ammo. The only difference that the .380 version has from the 9x18 is the barrel. The magazines and recoil springs are the same. I have four PM Makarovs. One East German, two Bulgarians, and a very nice Bakail Russian Commercial in .380ACP. I like them all and carry my most worn Bulgarian Makarov most of the time. The 9x18 in its normal loading is very close to a .380+p. In standard loading a .380 95gr. is around 900 FPS and the 9x18 95 gr. is 1000 fps.

$250 is a very good price for a Bakail .380 Makarov. I normally see them go for around $350.

[Ignition Override]

Nine the Ranger: Superb compact .380. I bought mine over three years ago, used approx. 1,000 rds. of only Russian ammo.
Perfect reliability and ruggedness.

Data on muzzle energy state there is very little difference between .380 acp and 9x18.
Why carry a beautiful, Collectible East German Makarov (I owned two) --which will only be tarnished—when a Non-collectible commercial Makarov is just as reliable/rugged?

.....and these commercial Izhevsk etc versions cost Much less. All of my handguns are Russian (.380 Mak.) , German (Sauer 38H, Sig P6, P225 {'87}, M&P .22) and Czech (CZ 75D 'PCR').

[Ibmikey]

My IJ 70 has been fitted with a fixed rear sight that I much prefer to the adjustable unit, the fixed has a much quicker sight picture and is a bit more compact. Having five other Maks I marked two magazines conspicuously noting 380 ACP so the loaded ones do not get mixed with the 9x18 mags.

[JohnKSa]

Having five other Maks I marked two magazines conspicuously noting 380 ACP so the loaded ones do not get mixed with the 9x18 mags.

Are they different? I always assumed that they were identical.

[Kemikos]

Originally Posted by JohnKSa

Are they different? I always assumed that they were identical.

They are. I assume he marked them so that when grabbing a magazine loaded with .380, they didn't accidentally get put into a 9x18 gun, or vice versa.

[Ignition Override]

JohnKSa:

There is only one type of magazine, which is used for Both the 9x18 and .380 acp rounds. I once owned two EGs, two Bulgarians and this .380 Makarov at the same time, and

**all single-stack Makarov mags are Identical, other than the small EG "humps", which reportedly are never a factor. This has no effect on the mag's proper seating or function.**

This was the apparent point of your question. Does this help?

You can verify this at the "Makarov Forum" on the lower main page of "Gunboards" (you might be familiar).

[JohnKSa]

Thanks, that's what I remembered--I was wondering why anyone would go to the trouble of segregating them by caliber when they're all the same.

I can see the point of making sure that they don't get mixed up once they're loaded--I hadn't considered that aspect.

[Ignition Override]

Caution for people who are interested in the fairly rare, Double-Stack commercial Makarovs. Whether they are in .380 or 9x18, possibly both types are available. I have no idea.

Magazine prices for those might command $100, the last time I checked.

[Ibmikey]

I marked the two 380 magazines as they are loaded with .380 ball ammunition and in the same case as many other Makarov magazines loaded with 9x18 ammo as well as sixty or seventy other pistol magazines. Not confusing to me, all Makarov magazines are basically the same unless stuffed with ammo that does not properly function in a 9x18 chambered pistol.

[Sgt127]

I’ve got one. It’s commercial, adjustable sights. .380. I’m going off memory, I want to say mine is marked “Big Bear Arms” or something, Dallas Texas.

[Gas Bag]

I would like to have a Makarov, they are nice guns, but lucky for me, there have been a flood of new American designs.

So, I am just saying, that is what toots my horn now. The Mak has been on my want list, but the Ruger LC380, could take it off.

http://www.armslist.com/posts/102983...ed-ruger-lc380

[Ignition Override]

Gas Bag: my only complaint-which is minor-about the .380 Russian and both Bulgys is the DA trigger. They are certainly much better than my W. German PPK/S and Polish P-64.

But maybe the DA design ensures prolonged reliability etc.
My EG triggers are a little bit better, and are known for this, along with better bluing.

[tallball]

Mine is apparently the same that Sgt127 has. It's a Bakail imported by Big Bear. It's 380acp and has the adjustable sights. I bought brand new around 1990 for $89, also in Dallas. It still shoots just fine. I don't recall it ever malfunctioning in all of these years.

[Ignition Override]

tallball: you probably know that many people have considered the Makarov design as possibly the most reliable semi-auto handgun ever created. My .380 Izvevsk has used 800-1,000 rds. with zero issues.

Even though mine is seldom carried these days, it’s ruggedness and simplicity have kept me from selling it. And it’s Very easy to conceal (vs. my CZ PCR, Sig P225).