Complete Target 20" AR in 5.56/.223?

baddarryl · January 14, 2019, 09:41 PM

I am looking for a complete rifle solely for target work. I have no time or desire to build one. My goal is accuracy. Recommendations? Thanks.

berettaprofessor · January 14, 2019, 09:47 PM

Stag has its precision uppers on sale right now at an incredible price. Buy a complete lower to go with it and you’re in target territory for under $700

2ndtimer · January 14, 2019, 10:22 PM

This would be a good start. Need to add an optic, and maybe a better trigger.
https://palmettostatearmory.com/psa-...516446246.html

lordmorgul · January 14, 2019, 11:40 PM

Bench Target?

Or High Power Service Rifle?
https://www.whiteoakarmament.com/sho...te-uppers.html
http://bisonarmory.com/national-matc...e-rifle-upper/
https://criterionbarrels.com/product...pper-receiver/
http://www.compasslake.com/index.php...index&cPath=23

Andrew - Lancaster, CA
NRA Life Member, Calguns.net contributor, CGF / SAF / CRPA / FPC / NAGR / NRA-ILA contributor, USCCA member

raimius · January 15, 2019, 12:48 AM

How accurate is enough for you?
What distances? What ammo?

darkgael · January 15, 2019, 06:09 AM

I have used a Colt Match Target, an Hbar, for years. i use it solely for prone shooting at the local ranges. I have always been happy with the way it shoots....sometimes even happy with how I shoot with it. The only changes to the stock gun are that I floated the barrel and added an Elftman trigger and a NM rear sight. The goto load is a Sierra 77 gr. MK. and 24 grains of RL15 in Win. factory primed brass.
The current Colt AR15A4 is similar without the heavy barrel.

Charlie98 · January 15, 2019, 05:27 PM

Without more specifics... any generic H-Bar AR would work. Spend the money on an aftermarket trigger. You didn't mention sight specifics (peeps or optic) so A2 or a flattop, either or. Just about everyone makes one, I have a Colt and it's fine, but I would be perfectly happy with a build from RRA, DD or one of the other better known builders.

baddarryl · January 16, 2019, 09:38 AM

OP here. Sorry to be vague guys. My main purpose in for what is known as Appleseed KD. I am an Appleseed Instructor in Training. KD locally is out to 400 yards and the qualifier is to shoot 4 MOA at that with a service rifle, and service ammunition standing, sitting, and prone while using a USGI sling only. I already have a Del Ton carbine AR, so I want to upgrade and concentrate on tightening those groups. Eventually I will work out to 600 and beyond, but probably not into High Power competition. Basically I just need an excuse for another rifle and want a quality target AR without breaking the bank. I do need optics and have those covered because I can't focus on the front sight of a Carbine length AR anymore.

COSteve · January 16, 2019, 11:30 AM

A great platform, especially if you want to shoot CMP matches is the irons only RRA National Match A2; HERE. If you want the same capability but also the ability to remove the rear sight and handle and add a scope, RRA's National Match A4 is a great choice; HERE.

Both come setup for target shooting with 20-inch, Air Gauged, Wylde Chambered, Heavy Match Stainless Steel, Cryogenically Treated, 1:8 Twist, free floated barrels as well as a National Match ½" x ½" hooded rear sight in a detachable National Match carrry handle, National Match 0.050" front sight post, National Match tuned trigger, and a host of other features to make for an excellent target rifle.

RRA guarantees ¾" at 100yds with match ammo which is great 'out of the box' accuracy. I've had my 2 RRA ARs, an Elite CAR A4 Mid-length carbine and Standard A4 rifle since 2004 and both are excellent ARs with terrific accuracy. With a 12x scope, I use my RRA Standard A4 rifle, along with my target 68grn handloads, to shoot medium sized apples at 400yrds.

Charlie98 · January 16, 2019, 11:30 AM

I shot Rifleman with my Colt H-Bar... given the spirit of the Appleseed, any generic AR rifle should work.

baddarryl · January 16, 2019, 12:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by COSteve

A great platform, especially if you want to shoot CMP matches is the irons only RRA National Match A2; HERE. If you want the same capability but also the ability to remove the rear sight and handle and add a scope, RRA's National Match A4 is a great choice; HERE.

Both come setup for target shooting with 20-inch, Air Gauged, Wylde Chambered, Heavy Match Stainless Steel, Cryogenically Treated, 1:8 Twist, free floated barrels as well as a National Match ½" x ½" hooded rear sight in a detachable National Match carrry handle, National Match 0.050" front sight post, National Match tuned trigger, and a host of other features to make for an excellent target rifle.

RRA guarantees ¾" at 100yds with match ammo which is great 'out of the box' accuracy. I've had my 2 RRA ARs, an Elite CAR A4 Mid-length carbine and Standard A4 rifle since 2004 and both are excellent ARs with terrific accuracy. With a 12x scope, I use my RRA Standard A4 rifle, along with my target 68grn handloads, to shoot medium sized apples at 400yrds.

That is very much what I am thinking. I wonder what the iron sight radius is. I can still focus on my Garand's front sight, but not a carbine length AR. The last time I shot KD I had to leave in the middle to go get a scope! I would love to be able to do it with irons. There are CMP matches not far from here as well.

baddarryl · January 16, 2019, 12:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Charlie_98

I shot Rifleman with my Colt H-Bar... given the spirit of the Appleseed, any generic AR rifle should work.

Very True!

rebs · January 16, 2019, 03:12 PM

darkgael
How much improvement in accuracy did you see when you free floated the barrel ?

2ndtimer · January 16, 2019, 08:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by COSteve

A great platform, especially if you want to shoot CMP matches is the irons only RRA National Match A2; HERE. If you want the same capability but also the ability to remove the rear sight and handle and add a scope, RRA's National Match A4 is a great choice; HERE.

Both come setup for target shooting with 20-inch, Air Gauged, Wylde Chambered, Heavy Match Stainless Steel, Cryogenically Treated, 1:8 Twist, free floated barrels as well as a National Match ½" x ½" hooded rear sight in a detachable National Match carrry handle, National Match 0.050" front sight post, National Match tuned trigger, and a host of other features to make for an excellent target rifle.

RRA guarantees ¾" at 100yds with match ammo which is great 'out of the box' accuracy. I've had my 2 RRA ARs, an Elite CAR A4 Mid-length carbine and Standard A4 rifle since 2004 and both are excellent ARs with terrific accuracy. With a 12x scope, I use my RRA Standard A4 rifle, along with my target 68grn handloads, to shoot medium sized apples at 400yrds.

While I am sure either of your recommendations would serve the OP well, they are listed at $500 to $600 OVER his stated budget. My suggestion from PSA would get him in the game below budget with room to add a better trigger.

baddarryl · January 17, 2019, 11:52 AM

OP here: I think I am going to go with one of those RR. I don’t believe I stated a budget as I have budgeted about $1500, but preferably less. I have searched many sites and those seem to be the off-the-shelf ticket. I may get into CMP service rifle so I am I think going to look for a National Match. I am not one to have different rifles for every purpose basically I want a carbine AR and a target AR. So if I’m gonna do it I might as well go full on NM.

jugornot · January 17, 2019, 08:35 PM

My RRA 24" bull barrel has posted a 4" group at 500 yards. It is also a good running gun that never balked at any of my hand loads including Sierra tipped Match Kings in 77 grains. This is its preferred load but I also load SMK 77 grain without the tip. The 500 yard group was tipped MKs. They are both loaded to mag length.

223 shooter · January 17, 2019, 10:06 PM

Quote:

OP here: I think I am going to go with one of those RR.

Really pleased with my Rock River Varmint.

10-96 · January 18, 2019, 03:43 AM

That RRA has pretty much the same pedigree as the Fulton Armory Peerless. I wonder how they stack up against each other? For being so close in price, I think I would personally go with Fulton. But that's just my opinion.

baddarryl · January 19, 2019, 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 10-96

That RRA has pretty much the same pedigree as the Fulton Armory Peerless. I wonder how they stack up against each other? For being so close in price, I think I would personally go with Fulton. But that's just my opinion.

What makes you say the Fulton?

Nathan · January 19, 2019, 04:16 PM

I would look at a Larue. The top accuracy builds are often Larue barrels.

Road_Clam · January 19, 2019, 05:08 PM

My gun club purchased 4 RR match uppers for promoting our junior marksmanship programs, outstanding shooters. About 1 MOA barrels with the typical 69 or 77 gr match ammo shooting benchrest.

https://www.rockriverarms.com/index....ategory_ID=156

darkgael · January 21, 2019, 08:30 AM

Improvement from free floating. The windage clicks became much more consistent.
Before the float, i would shoot a group and the shot would tend left out of the 10 ring and into the 9 and 8 ring. So.....I would correct and click over just two clicks (on a NM sight). the group would move the the other side of the 10 ring. A lot of movement.
That stopped after the barrel float. Groups are much more centered. If there are fliers, it is me not the gun. Fliers, and I do shoot them, are not mostly windage fliers from sling and hand pressure on the barrel.

rebs · January 21, 2019, 10:15 AM

Thank you for the reply, I will be free floating mine. Mine is a Colt match competition HB

sundog · January 21, 2019, 10:18 AM

COSteve in post #9 is spot on.

baddarryl · July 31, 2019, 10:49 AM

OP Here: I have decide to upgrade and limit my parameters to a complete National Match rifle or at least complete NM uppers and lowers. Thanks.

January 14, 2019, 09:41 PM	#1
baddarryl Senior Member Join Date: March 29, 2011 Location: Cape Fear! Posts: 1,683	Complete Target 20" AR in 5.56/.223? I am looking for a complete rifle solely for target work. I have no time or desire to build one. My goal is accuracy. Recommendations? Thanks.

January 14, 2019, 10:22 PM	#3
2ndtimer Senior Member Join Date: October 9, 2004 Location: Kennewick, WA Posts: 293	This would be a good start. Need to add an optic, and maybe a better trigger. https://palmettostatearmory.com/psa-...516446246.html __________________ NRA Endowment Member

January 15, 2019, 06:09 AM	#6
darkgael Senior Member Join Date: February 9, 2006 Location: Homes in Brooklyn, NY and in Pennsylvania. Posts: 5,473	I have used a Colt Match Target, an Hbar, for years. i use it solely for prone shooting at the local ranges. I have always been happy with the way it shoots....sometimes even happy with how I shoot with it. The only changes to the stock gun are that I floated the barrel and added an Elftman trigger and a NM rear sight. The goto load is a Sierra 77 gr. MK. and 24 grains of RL15 in Win. factory primed brass. The current Colt AR15A4 is similar without the heavy barrel. __________________ “Auto racing, bull fighting, and mountain climbing are the only real sports ... all others are games.” Ernest Hemingway ... NRA Life Member Last edited by darkgael; January 15, 2019 at 06:18 AM.

January 15, 2019, 05:27 PM	#7
Charlie98 Senior Member Join Date: September 6, 2006 Location: Great state of Texas Posts: 1,077	Without more specifics... any generic H-Bar AR would work. Spend the money on an aftermarket trigger. You didn't mention sight specifics (peeps or optic) so A2 or a flattop, either or. Just about everyone makes one, I have a Colt and it's fine, but I would be perfectly happy with a build from RRA, DD or one of the other better known builders. __________________ _______________ "I have this pistol pointed at your heart!" "That is my least vulnerable spot."

January 16, 2019, 11:30 AM	#10
Charlie98 Senior Member Join Date: September 6, 2006 Location: Great state of Texas Posts: 1,077	I shot Rifleman with my Colt H-Bar... given the spirit of the Appleseed, any generic AR rifle should work. __________________ _______________ "I have this pistol pointed at your heart!" "That is my least vulnerable spot."

January 14, 2019, 09:47 PM	#2
berettaprofessor Senior Member Join Date: November 23, 2008 Posts: 1,091	Stag has its precision uppers on sale right now at an incredible price. Buy a complete lower to go with it and you’re in target territory for under $700

January 14, 2019, 11:40 PM	#4
lordmorgul Senior Member Join Date: August 18, 2016 Posts: 206	Bench Target? Or High Power Service Rifle? https://www.whiteoakarmament.com/sho...te-uppers.html http://bisonarmory.com/national-matc...e-rifle-upper/ https://criterionbarrels.com/product...pper-receiver/ http://www.compasslake.com/index.php...index&cPath=23 Andrew - Lancaster, CA NRA Life Member, Calguns.net contributor, CGF / SAF / CRPA / FPC / NAGR / NRA-ILA contributor, USCCA member

January 15, 2019, 12:48 AM	#5
raimius Senior Member Join Date: January 27, 2008 Posts: 2,199	How accurate is enough for you? What distances? What ammo?

January 16, 2019, 09:38 AM	#8
baddarryl Senior Member Join Date: March 29, 2011 Location: Cape Fear! Posts: 1,683	OP here. Sorry to be vague guys. My main purpose in for what is known as Appleseed KD. I am an Appleseed Instructor in Training. KD locally is out to 400 yards and the qualifier is to shoot 4 MOA at that with a service rifle, and service ammunition standing, sitting, and prone while using a USGI sling only. I already have a Del Ton carbine AR, so I want to upgrade and concentrate on tightening those groups. Eventually I will work out to 600 and beyond, but probably not into High Power competition. Basically I just need an excuse for another rifle and want a quality target AR without breaking the bank. I do need optics and have those covered because I can't focus on the front sight of a Carbine length AR anymore.

January 16, 2019, 11:30 AM	#9
COSteve Senior Member Join Date: September 6, 2009 Posts: 1,344	A great platform, especially if you want to shoot CMP matches is the irons only RRA National Match A2; HERE. If you want the same capability but also the ability to remove the rear sight and handle and add a scope, RRA's National Match A4 is a great choice; HERE. Both come setup for target shooting with 20-inch, Air Gauged, Wylde Chambered, Heavy Match Stainless Steel, Cryogenically Treated, 1:8 Twist, free floated barrels as well as a National Match ½" x ½" hooded rear sight in a detachable National Match carrry handle, National Match 0.050" front sight post, National Match tuned trigger, and a host of other features to make for an excellent target rifle. RRA guarantees ¾" at 100yds with match ammo which is great 'out of the box' accuracy. I've had my 2 RRA ARs, an Elite CAR A4 Mid-length carbine and Standard A4 rifle since 2004 and both are excellent ARs with terrific accuracy. With a 12x scope, I use my RRA Standard A4 rifle, along with my target 68grn handloads, to shoot medium sized apples at 400yrds.

January 16, 2019, 03:12 PM	#13
rebs Senior Member Join Date: January 10, 2012 Posts: 3,881	darkgael How much improvement in accuracy did you see when you free floated the barrel ?

January 17, 2019, 11:52 AM	#15
baddarryl Senior Member Join Date: March 29, 2011 Location: Cape Fear! Posts: 1,683	OP here: I think I am going to go with one of those RR. I don’t believe I stated a budget as I have budgeted about $1500, but preferably less. I have searched many sites and those seem to be the off-the-shelf ticket. I may get into CMP service rifle so I am I think going to look for a National Match. I am not one to have different rifles for every purpose basically I want a carbine AR and a target AR. So if I’m gonna do it I might as well go full on NM.

January 17, 2019, 08:35 PM	#16
jugornot Senior Member Join Date: September 20, 2017 Posts: 197	My RRA 24" bull barrel has posted a 4" group at 500 yards. It is also a good running gun that never balked at any of my hand loads including Sierra tipped Match Kings in 77 grains. This is its preferred load but I also load SMK 77 grain without the tip. The 500 yard group was tipped MKs. They are both loaded to mag length.

January 18, 2019, 03:43 AM	#18
10-96 Senior Member Join Date: October 19, 2005 Location: Tx Panhandle Territory Posts: 4,160	That RRA has pretty much the same pedigree as the Fulton Armory Peerless. I wonder how they stack up against each other? For being so close in price, I think I would personally go with Fulton. But that's just my opinion. __________________ Rednecks... Keeping the woods critter-free since March 2, 1836. (TX Independence Day) I suspect a thing or two... because I've seen a thing or two.

January 19, 2019, 04:16 PM	#20
Nathan Senior Member Join Date: July 1, 2001 Posts: 6,333	I would look at a Larue. The top accuracy builds are often Larue barrels.

January 19, 2019, 05:08 PM	#21
Road_Clam Senior Member Join Date: November 21, 2013 Location: New Hampshire Posts: 1,695	My gun club purchased 4 RR match uppers for promoting our junior marksmanship programs, outstanding shooters. About 1 MOA barrels with the typical 69 or 77 gr match ammo shooting benchrest. https://www.rockriverarms.com/index....ategory_ID=156 __________________ "To be old an wise you must have been young and stupid"

January 21, 2019, 10:15 AM	#23
rebs Senior Member Join Date: January 10, 2012 Posts: 3,881	Thank you for the reply, I will be free floating mine. Mine is a Colt match competition HB

January 21, 2019, 10:18 AM	#24
sundog Senior Member Join Date: November 22, 1999 Location: Green Country, OK Posts: 782	COSteve in post #9 is spot on. __________________ safety first

July 31, 2019, 10:49 AM	#25
baddarryl Senior Member Join Date: March 29, 2011 Location: Cape Fear! Posts: 1,683	OP Here: I have decide to upgrade and limit my parameters to a complete National Match rifle or at least complete NM uppers and lowers. Thanks.