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August 23, 2017, 08:07 AM | #51 |
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Probably just a personal peramater, but I like to have a tool that is designed and capable of the job to be done. I use a truck with a V8 instead of a 6 Cyl. to tow things, and some will probably be able to cite instances where they have used the 6 Cyl. and gotten a job done.
Most people have some personal rules they follow through their lives and some are maybe debatable. For instance I have a personal rule where I will not purchase anything advertised as "badass"...as I consider it a low class and offensive term to be used in a public venue. Other people probably would have a different caliber they would consider a minimum for large game.....to each his own. They have to live with it... |
August 24, 2017, 09:00 AM | #52 |
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.22,even a 22-250, at 250-300 yards is a poor choice. Gonna result in a lot of wounded deer. A .243 ain't got much punch left at 300. Better off with a 25-06 or .270 for long shots.
My 2 cents. |
August 24, 2017, 11:30 AM | #53 |
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We've been hunting hogs at my farm for 20+ years using various 223/5.56 rifles with good success. We originally used Winchester 64gr PSP (I think they used to call it something else back then) in Bushmaster AR rifles with 1-9" twist barrel. They were effective out to about 150 yards or so and would put down good size hogs effectively with good hit. Now we use mostly Barnes 55gr TTSX, Speer Gold Dot 55gr or 64gr, Federal Fusion 62gr MSR and couple others. They are all capable of putting down good size hogs with one well placed shot so I'm sure they would be effective on deer size game too.
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August 24, 2017, 11:43 AM | #54 |
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To answer the OP:
Two years ago my then 11 year old daughter dropped a button buck with my M4gery and a 53gr TSX FB, pushed to near 3200 f/sec from 132 yards. Perfect behind the shoulder shot and the deer went 30 yards and piled up...... bullet exited the far side making about a 1" exit wound..... Last fall she hit and we failed to recover 3 larger deer with the same bullet and rig...... two of which ran off on 3 legs...... looking for a better answer this fall. |
August 24, 2017, 11:53 AM | #55 | |
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August 24, 2017, 01:25 PM | #56 |
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Serious question. Where are you people taking 300 yard shots at deer with these dinky calibers? Save those calibers and ranges for varmits or yotes. i guess I'm old school and prefer kids start with a .243 or better and keep the range within reason.
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August 24, 2017, 04:56 PM | #57 | |
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I shoot a .270WIN now. |
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August 24, 2017, 05:03 PM | #58 |
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Speaking only for myself, I would not dream of shooting a deer at 300 yds, using my 223 or 220 Swift. But....I sure will shoot at a hog or coyote at up to 400. My experience with that shows that it's very hard to put down even a medium sized hog at 300 or 400 with those calibers. It would help if they'd just stand still for 10 seconds, but that seldom happens. The coyotes generally drop on the spot, but the hogs stumble, sometimes hit the ground, get back up and keep on trucking. Used to be that on our place I saw mostly coyotes, so I hunted with the 220. But then the pigs started showing up in numbers, and here I was with my peashooter. I'd have gone to a 243 but didn't have one, so I started taking the 260. With that, I dropped hogs and coyotes out to 400.
I was up in my blind once with the 220, and here was a whopper hog, going away from me. I put a 55 grainier on the back of his head and got not the pink mist, but the dirt mist. And he shook his head and kept going. |
August 24, 2017, 05:30 PM | #59 | |
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August 24, 2017, 06:10 PM | #60 | |
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August 24, 2017, 06:17 PM | #61 | |
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August 24, 2017, 06:23 PM | #62 | |
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August 24, 2017, 06:39 PM | #63 | |
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August 25, 2017, 06:30 AM | #64 |
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Here's the thing with the 22 centerfires. Shooters are much more likely to be able to shoot them accurately than larger centerfires. If you were to gather a bunch of hunting guides together and ask them if too much gun or too little gun has caused them more headaches, overwhelmingly the response would be too much gun. I have seen more animals wounded as a result of botched shots with big centerfires than with smaller bores. It's as unethical to shoot badly with a 30-06 as it is with a 223, and based on my experience it happens more often. It's all about shot placement and bullet construction.
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August 25, 2017, 08:17 AM | #65 | |||
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August 25, 2017, 08:27 AM | #66 | |
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@jimbob86 - They are not low expectations, they are reasonable expectations. There is no way I'm going to let a first time shooter have their first shot be at 300 yards on a deer. And unless it's a wall hanger there is really no need for one either as chances are you can close that distance. Come on man, it's just common sense, why are you arguing that point?
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August 25, 2017, 08:58 AM | #67 | |
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And why would it matter if there was a wallhanger or a button buck involved? As for closing the distance, there's no way to get closer to a deer in the middle of a cut alfalfa/ beanfield measuring 600 yards x 800 yards. You are not going to sneak up on them in daylight ..... with the kids, we do our best to sneak into the blinds before first light.... and with the rut on and temps low, deer generally wander by every couple of hours during the day..... it's fairly open country, and if one never learns to make good hits to the middle of those fields, there's going to be a lot of winters eating ghetto round steak instead of venison..... the ideal is to teach them to "shoot up to their rifle" from field positons..... but this is the internet, and everyone tends to take the most extreme view what the other guy is doing ..... you go ahead and put a muzzle brake on a 30-06 and hand it to a little kid if that works for you ..... best of luck with that. |
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August 25, 2017, 09:36 AM | #68 | ||
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August 25, 2017, 11:14 AM | #69 | ||
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As for the muzzle brake onto an existing full size, medium bore rifle: what's that cost? Add to that that i does nothing to help the youngster carry and hold the adult sized gun ..... so add another pile of cash to shorten the length of pull and lighten the gun (if possible) to make handling easier for them..... and then when you lighten it, perceived recoil increases.... as it does when the gun gets louder for the shooter and everyone around them because of the increased muzzle blast with the brake ..... would it not be wiser to get them a rifle that fits them in the first place, in a chambering that will kill deer without beating the hell out of them? Then you'd have two rifles with some value, instead of one that's been butchered ...... But of course, you seem to be married to the idea that a .243 won't kill a deer at the extreme range of 300 yards, and is marginal at best for shorter shots ....whatever. |
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August 25, 2017, 11:35 AM | #70 | |
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Who are these people all around you hunting that can't stand a rifle shot? It only effects you if standing 15 feet away to the side of the barrel at the range. Stop taking Internet misinformation. Now you are bringing costs and loudness into this equation LOL???? Please go be miserable to somewhere else. Last edited by zipspyder; August 25, 2017 at 11:41 AM. |
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August 25, 2017, 12:06 PM | #71 | ||||
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Your answer to the problem is not the same as mine ..... and I explained my reasoning before.... won't bother again.... Quote:
... and I know all about the joys of muzzle brakes, in person, next to me on the range. I despise them. Cheers. |
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August 25, 2017, 02:04 PM | #72 |
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If every deer my grandson has squeezed the trigger of his 223 on has died, most of them in their tracks, how much deader would a .243 have killed them?
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August 25, 2017, 06:33 PM | #73 |
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Thread drift + getting personal = Yuck.
Enuf. |
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