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Old October 5, 2017, 01:49 PM   #1
jrinne0430
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NRA is calling ATF to review the bump stock!!

Looks like the NRA maybe jumping in on the ban wagon. I never thought I would see the day...

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017...-shooting.html
Quote:
“The NRA believes that devices designed to allow semi-automatic rifles to function like fully-automatic rifles should be subject to additional regulations,” the NRA said in a written statement.
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Old October 5, 2017, 01:54 PM   #2
spacemanspiff
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Maybe because they are confidant no ban will occur?
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Old October 5, 2017, 02:48 PM   #3
thallub
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IMO: The BATFE should have never blessed bump fire rifle stocks. Apparently no one in the BATFE technical department ever test fired a rifle fitted with a bump fire stock.

The NRA banned bump fire stocks from their rifle range:

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/1...-ranges-243495
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Old October 5, 2017, 03:31 PM   #4
heyjoe
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maybe because they arent tone deaf
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Old October 5, 2017, 03:48 PM   #5
WWWJD
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Looks like the NRA maybe jumping in on the band wagon...
I don't know if I'd call it a band wagon. Given recent events that won't be mentioned here, I think that the NRA and Republicans both are offering this up as their way of 'calling off the dogs' or 'relieving pressures' since immediately following unspoken events, certain almost POTUS individuals among others started spewing the ol' anti-2A rhetoric.

Personally, I don't see any value in a bump-stock. On the other hand, I doubt there are many NRA members that vehemently oppose it's existence, since they also oppose the NFA. Now, if they use the bump-stock bill to start sneaking in other legislation, well.. that's another discussion. If my losing the ability to purchase a bump-stock/ammo burner makes them STFU... I'm down.
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Old October 5, 2017, 03:52 PM   #6
JoeSixpack
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jrinne0430 View Post
Looks like the NRA maybe jumping in on the ban wagon. I never thought I would see the day...
Why not? They supported 34/68 laws.
Said so in a old issue of american riflemen.

When Ever I brought that up years ago I'd get the "oh it was a different time then" or "they wasn't politically active then" well.. ok .. excuse now?

NRA is dead to me.

"Stand and Fight" my ass.
They should have said nothing if this was what was gonna come out of their mouth.
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Old October 5, 2017, 04:09 PM   #7
2damnold4this
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I think it's a mistake to ask the ATF to review bump stocks. This should be a decision for Congress. Add some legislation to the SHARE Act if bump stocks are to be addressed.
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Old October 5, 2017, 04:24 PM   #8
Tuzo
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Good for the NRA!
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Old October 5, 2017, 04:32 PM   #9
sirgilligan
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I was never interested in bump fire stocks.

I wonder, is it a slippery slope to have the ATF ban the item, or is it a slippery slope to have congress do it?

If the ATF does it, it seems it makes it so that we are at the mercy of the current "personality" of the ATF, and they are not accountable to us.

If Congress does it, it will surely have a lot of "pork" on it and could reach further than just bump fire stocks.

In my opinion, bump fire stocks will be made illegal in such a way that those that own them will have to give them up. I also believe they will go after arm braces while they are at it, and removing suppressors from the controlled list will never make it to the floor and is dead.
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Old October 5, 2017, 04:58 PM   #10
Stroge
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Unacceptable, Draconian ATF gets to just make up laws on a whim....

THEY SHOULD HAVE ASKED CONGRESS TO TAKE ACTION!!! We need legislation! LAWS!

I refuse to acknowledge any "ruling" of the lord our god the almighty "ATF".
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Old October 5, 2017, 04:58 PM   #11
JWM
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Toss them this bone

I'm a NRA member since 1975. I'm a long time follower of the gun control debate for decades. In order to get FOPA passed in 1986, the NRA tossed machine gun owners under the bus.

Last edited by JWM; October 5, 2017 at 05:30 PM.
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Old October 5, 2017, 05:00 PM   #12
Stroge
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Let's toss this bone to our opponents.
Not cool, so because others got thrown under the bus its OK to do that to me and lawful owners of these devices?

I dont think so TIM!
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Old October 5, 2017, 05:05 PM   #13
JoeSixpack
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That's the cracks among gun owners just like you run into hunters that see no point in your evil black rifle, large magazines, etc.

All you need is some blood to lube the gears and something (bump stocks) to wedge the cracks open and chip you off some gun control.

Quote:
First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Socialist.

Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.
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Old October 5, 2017, 05:07 PM   #14
Dred
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The first time I ever witnessed bump firing ... nobody was cashing in on purpose built stocks. The stocks appeared many decades after the first redneck recruited a beer holder and uttered the famous words "Watch this."

For the most part ... I think the guys jacking with the bump fire stocks can be found at the stage in their local strip club - making it "rain."
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Old October 5, 2017, 05:11 PM   #15
johnwilliamson062
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There is a possibility...
Everyone agrees atfe should review. In 6 months Atfe says doesnt meet definition of mg by law, must be change in law. Momentum has dissipated nothing happens, but everyone 'did something'
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Old October 5, 2017, 05:37 PM   #16
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I would prefer ATF action over a law that was permanently on the books, but I fear the worst: haste creating bad legislation. Again.
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Old October 5, 2017, 05:46 PM   #17
steve4102
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this is an excellent move and an excellent statement by the NRA, excellent.

"In the aftermath of the evil and senseless attack in Las Vegas, the American people are looking for answers as to how future tragedies can be prevented. Unfortunately, the first response from some politicians has been to call for more gun control. Banning guns from law-abiding Americans based on the criminal act of a madman will do nothing to prevent future attacks. This is a fact that has been proven time and again in countries across the world. In Las Vegas, reports indicate that certain devices were used to modify the firearms involved. Despite the fact that the Obama administration approved the sale of bump fire stocks on at least two occasions, the National Rifle Association is calling on the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (BATFE) to immediately review whether these devices comply with federal law. The NRA believes that devices designed to allow semi-automatic rifles to function like fully-automatic rifles should be subject to additional regulations. In an increasingly dangerous world, the NRA remains focused on our mission: strengthening Americans' Second Amendment freedom to defend themselves, their families and their communities. To that end, on behalf of our five million members across the country, we urge Congress to pass National Right-to-Carry reciprocity, which will allow law-abiding Americans to defend themselves and their families from acts of violence."

The first thing the Media, Hollywood and the Democrats did was blame the NRA, the Republicans and President Trump for allowing these "devices" to get into the hands of those that wish to do us harm.

The statement makes it clear that neither the NRA or President Trump had anything to do with the legalization of Bump-Stocks. That rests clearly on Obama and HIS ATF. They placed the blame exactly where it belongs and into the lap of Obama.

This statement also takes the wind out of the MSM, Hollywood and Democrat sails. These groups are left dumbfounded as they were of the belief that the NRA was responsible for the legalization of Bump-Stocks and therefore would defend them to the death and as the NRA pointed out it was Obama that legalized them.

Next this statement doesn't call for additional Firearm Legislation, it simple calls for the ATF to evaluate the device and see if it complies with "existing" federal legislation.

If the ATF determines that the Bump-Stock does not comply with Federal legislation, then this Mass Murder becomes the fault of Obama, HIS ATF and the Democrats even more so.

If they find that the Bump-Stock does comply with Federal law, then the NRA and President can no longer be blamed. It will then be up to Congress to either pass new legislation or not.

Either way this was a brilliant move by the NRA.
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Old October 5, 2017, 05:48 PM   #18
JoeSixpack
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnwilliamson062 View Post
There is a possibility...
Everyone agrees atfe should review. In 6 months Atfe says doesnt meet definition of mg by law, must be change in law. Momentum has dissipated nothing happens, but everyone 'did something'
That's what Im hoping happens, But with the NRA giving indications of support that's practically as good as a seal of approval..

they usually don't say anything.. I imagine behind the scenes they're giving the *meh* do what you want fellas we won't hold it against you signal.

Trump see's this as the thumbs up to go ahead, Won't loose any brownie points.
Half the of the TFL a gun board.. think about that a GUN BOARD saying ya ban the damn things.

The antigunners have a cake walk with this.. I don't think there is enough resistance at this exact moment to delay a vote long enough for to it to fail.

All the while republicans will get nothing out of this, they wont' even try cause they won't wanna look like they're going against the tide.. the hard core pro2a ones will vote no but with the dem's on board they don't need that much republican support.
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Old October 5, 2017, 06:07 PM   #19
jrinne0430
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If we give in on this, you can be certain more bans and regulations will follow...it will never end, it never does. Soon it will be tannerite, then 30rd mags (no hunting purposes right?), waiting periods, limits on quantity of firearms you can own, etc.. The NRA and some RINOs decided to play politics and this will not end well for us if we remain silent. Instead of looking back and just saying "I remember when we could own bump stocks", we will be telling our children "I remember when I could own an AR, AK, semi autos, pistols, 10 firearms, etc." but I stayed idle and now it's all gone.

What will have to give up when the next event happens?
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Old October 5, 2017, 06:18 PM   #20
Bartholomew Roberts
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Either way this was a brilliant move by the NRA.
Right up to the point they are on some news show trying to explain the difference between "devices that allow semi-automatic rifles to function like fully-automatic rifles" and semi-automatic rifles. My splits with a stock AR trigger are around 0.2.

How is the NRA going to justify that 600rpm needs to be regulated and 300rpm is A-OK?
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Old October 5, 2017, 06:21 PM   #21
mehavey
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Anyone who thinks we're going to wall away from ~60 dead/500 wounded Scot free is delusional.
Personally, I'm fine with the "bump" stock being relegated to the trash pile.
Small price, and effectively useless to a rifleman... except to spray bullets.

Xin Loi.....
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Old October 5, 2017, 06:27 PM   #22
jrinne0430
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Small price, and effectively useless to a rifleman... except to spray bullets
Though I agree, what will we have to give up after the next shooting (it will happen again)? 30rd mags since a rifleman does not need 30rds before a reload? Maybe restrictions on the number of firearms we can own since we can only fire one at a time. Let this slide and it will not end well.
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Old October 5, 2017, 06:35 PM   #23
garyhan
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Lets face reality. Look at how many people, let alone politicians, have gone over to supporting gun control. The number of casualties in this shooting is beyond my previous imagining:it will not go away from peoples minds. I have previously supported the position of "never give an inch" but in this case, regulations or bans on bump stocks are inevitable. The shooting has already cost us the possibility of de-regulating suppressors and national reciprocity. I understand the principle of not yielding, but what we would be giving up is at the low end of priority imo. I own two bump stocks. They are amusing toys simulating auto fire but sacrificing accuracy. If the NRA quickly endorses regulation of them, they help to disarm our enemies who claim we don't care. The anti gunners will, of course, continue to push for more egregious regulation: but giving up bump stocks will at least mollify some temporarily. When defeat is inevitable, a negotiated peace is often the best alternative. I don't like it, but it is our best hope. I hate to disagree with so many of my brethren, but I think the NRA gave careful consideration to this issue, and made the right choice.
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Old October 5, 2017, 06:35 PM   #24
Bartholomew Roberts
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mehavey
Anyone who thinks we're going to wall away from ~60 dead/500 wounded Scot free is delusional.
Not at all delusional. There are at least four different Republicans who have the power to stop any gun control cold without relying on any votes from anyone else. Every single one of them is NRA A+ rated.
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Old October 5, 2017, 06:41 PM   #25
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I was going to post this very topic but wasn't sure if it was acceptable or not.
I don't have a dog in this race but a reaction like this is just stupid. Banning the stock, banning the gun, banning the ammo - it's all the same. The problem wasn't the bump stock it was the idiot behind the stock. Yes, the bump stock increases the rate of fire but I have yet to see anyone who can repeatably hit a man size target at 100 yards while using one. I had to tell a guy at the range to move to the 25 yard berm because he was missing the berm at 50 yards. The only reason that so many people were hit is because they filled a football field. He was using a bump stock from over two blocks away and 320 feet above the field. If he was any kind of a shot he could have killed a lot more people firing semi-auto.
When I saw what the NRA-ILA had said I wrote a nice long letter telling them they were betraying their members. If it is ok to outlaw the bump stock, it should be ok to outlaw the rifle and the ammo. None of those items is responsible for the carnage. There was a man making that bump stock work and pointing the rifle at all those people. There is nothing wrong with the tools he used, only the way he used them. He was bad, not the stock or the gun or the ammo. We need to remember that in order to get rid of violence you have to prosecute the violence not the tools used.
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