7.62x54R conversion insert?

**Aguila Blanca** · April 22, 2011, 09:36 PM

Has anyone ever tried one of these pistol caliber conversions in a Mosin-Nagant? Sportsmans Guide is offering two flavors of the thing, one for .32 caliber and one for 7.62x25.

Can you actually shoot .32 ammo through a Mosin-Nagant barrel? I'm curious mostly because the indoor range where I shoot has a backstop that's not suitable for rifle rounds, but they do allow pistol caliber carbines, so a conversion like this would allow me to play with a mil-surp Mosin-Nagant without having to trek across the state to an outdoor range.

But -- I don't know if they work, or -- if so -- which one would be better.

http://www.sportsmansguide.com/net/cb/cb.aspx?a=650814

http://www.sportsmansguide.com/net/cb/cb.aspx?a=587989

benogil · April 22, 2011, 10:06 PM

.32 - good
7.62x25 - very bad, may ruin your rifle from the insert welding itself to the chamber wall bad,

**Aguila Blanca** · April 23, 2011, 11:18 PM

Why would the .25 caliber insert weld itself to the chamber?

mapsjanhere · April 24, 2011, 08:10 AM

It's not a .25 cal, it's a .30 cal (7.62 mm) bullet in a .95 (25 mm) long case, hence 7.62x25
In regards to the welding issue, the 7.62x25 has twice the power of the 32ACP, until the appearance of the 357 Magnum it was the most powerful cartridge available. The cartridge is also a bottleneck shape, so there's less material in the insert, and more hot gasses to heat it up. No idea if you can actually achieve a weld, but I can see how that could get sticky.

benogil · April 24, 2011, 08:52 AM

To the above, quite right. On another board, a member said SG has seen the inserts permanently attach themselves to the chamber walls of mosin's.
Too bad, sounds like a great idea ( and is in .32 ). I know, because I bought one to use with 7.62x25. By all accounts, the .32 is good for rabbits out to 50 yards.

30-30remchester · April 24, 2011, 10:37 AM

I have collected and shot chamber inserts aka cartridge coversions aka chamber adapters for many years. They are a very old solution to a weight and availability problem. Years ago before the advent of the ATV, many true outdoorsmen actually spent many days afield with just what they had on their back. Either through poverty, regulations, or weight considerations, many of these men didnt carry a small game handgun or rifle in which to get their daily supper. Thus the chamber adapter allowed the owner of certain calibered high power rifles to load an adapter with light weight handgun ammo and take small game. The noise level of say a 32 ACP is far less than a 22 LR. A big drawback is sight adjustment and accuracy. In days of old most high power rifles had only iron sight which easily allowed for fast sight adjustment. Most all adapter I have shot hit @1 foot low at 25 yards when gun sighted for high power ammo. Simply adjust your rear sight up a couple notchs and you can get point of aim impact at close range. Not advisable with scoped sighted guns. However I have learned that there are some "holdover" tricks that can be learned with scope sighted rifles. Accuracy on many adapters is barely acceptable for rabbit sized animals at 25 yards. All in all I try to always carry an adapter when afield with a gun that allows one. A few adapter rounds of ammo and a wounded animal can be dispatched quietly and a grouse or rabbit can be taken at close range without scaring all game away.

SIGSHR · April 24, 2011, 07:01 PM

I have used them in 32 ACP, judicious reloading could probably produce some loads with useable hunting accuracy. Their main virtue is they allow shooting on indoor ranges-"gallery shooting", to use an old term, they let you get the feel of the rifle with live ammunition.
I have not used mine in 7.62 x 54R, I have used them in 8MM Mauser and 7.5 x54 French.
My drill when I use them-BTW, I bought mine from an apparently now defuncy company called Ace, I have not used the MCI ones- is to insert the 32ACP round into the adapter, load the chamber, then, after I have fired, remove the insert with the fired case, then use a wooden dowel to remove the case, then repeat the drill.
It seems to me if the adapter sticks in the chamber of a Mosin, perhaps a little VERY gentle polishing of both the chamber and adaptor is in order, most Mosins have had rough handling, perhaps some heavy grease on the adaptor
would help-?

**Aguila Blanca** · April 24, 2011, 10:15 PM

7.62x25 not .25 caliber. :doh:

I knew that. Brain fade.

Sounds interesting. I may treat myself to one of the .32 caliber versions.

DWFan · May 5, 2011, 05:23 AM

Slug your bore first...
7.62x25mm = .309" bullet
.32 caliber = .312" bullet

sirsloop · May 5, 2011, 09:12 AM

If you made a pistol in 7.62x54R, it could potentially create a ban for all 7.62x54R surplus STEEL CORE ammo.

10 Spot Terminator · April 10, 2012, 11:35 AM

Most of the Moisons I have encountered slugged rather large with the tightest one ever being .3095 diameter. in a 91/30 with a barrel in the 29 inch range I would want my pistol cartrige conversion to have plenty of umph and yet be closer to bore diameter such as maybe the .327 Federal or .32 H&R Mag to reduce any chance of a squib and would be for hand lapping the bore on an old milsurp until I could see my own eyeball looking back at me when I looked down the bore ( mirror bright ). Am betting those instances in which the adaptors seized in the chambers had either less than smooth finish in them and or some chamber pressure issues from those bullets slowing down alot before they made it out of the barrel. Just my thoughts here as am not a smithy but seems like pistol cartridges were developed to perform out of "MUCH" shorter barrels with the occasional buntline being the rare exception otherwise why are Contender loads listed differently in loading Manuals such as Lyman vs. standard rifle cartridges of the same calibre

10 Spot

SIGSHR · April 10, 2012, 04:52 PM

Wouldn't coating the insert with Vaseline or heavy grease before each firing session prevent its adhering too tightly?

Avenger · April 10, 2012, 06:29 PM

That would work, oiling cases to aid extraction was somewhat common on early machineguns. But with a bolt-action rifle, it's a good way to potentially get hot oil in the face or eyes if there is ANY gap between the adapter and the chamber walls for gas to escape through.

April 22, 2011, 09:36 PM	#1
Aguila Blanca Staff Join Date: September 25, 2008 Location: CONUS Posts: 18,460	7.62x54R conversion insert? Has anyone ever tried one of these pistol caliber conversions in a Mosin-Nagant? Sportsmans Guide is offering two flavors of the thing, one for .32 caliber and one for 7.62x25. Can you actually shoot .32 ammo through a Mosin-Nagant barrel? I'm curious mostly because the indoor range where I shoot has a backstop that's not suitable for rifle rounds, but they do allow pistol caliber carbines, so a conversion like this would allow me to play with a mil-surp Mosin-Nagant without having to trek across the state to an outdoor range. But -- I don't know if they work, or -- if so -- which one would be better. http://www.sportsmansguide.com/net/cb/cb.aspx?a=650814 http://www.sportsmansguide.com/net/cb/cb.aspx?a=587989

April 24, 2011, 08:10 AM	#4
mapsjanhere Senior Member Join Date: August 6, 2009 Location: Albuquerque Posts: 2,832	It's not a .25 cal, it's a .30 cal (7.62 mm) bullet in a .95 (25 mm) long case, hence 7.62x25 In regards to the welding issue, the 7.62x25 has twice the power of the 32ACP, until the appearance of the 357 Magnum it was the most powerful cartridge available. The cartridge is also a bottleneck shape, so there's less material in the insert, and more hot gasses to heat it up. No idea if you can actually achieve a weld, but I can see how that could get sticky. __________________ I used to love being able to hit hard at 1000 yards. As I get older I find hitting a mini ram at 200 yards with the 22 oddly more satisfying. Last edited by mapsjanhere; April 24, 2011 at 08:16 AM.

April 24, 2011, 07:01 PM	#7
SIGSHR Senior Member Join Date: September 13, 2005 Posts: 4,700	I have used them in 32 ACP, judicious reloading could probably produce some loads with useable hunting accuracy. Their main virtue is they allow shooting on indoor ranges-"gallery shooting", to use an old term, they let you get the feel of the rifle with live ammunition. I have not used mine in 7.62 x 54R, I have used them in 8MM Mauser and 7.5 x54 French. My drill when I use them-BTW, I bought mine from an apparently now defuncy company called Ace, I have not used the MCI ones- is to insert the 32ACP round into the adapter, load the chamber, then, after I have fired, remove the insert with the fired case, then use a wooden dowel to remove the case, then repeat the drill. It seems to me if the adapter sticks in the chamber of a Mosin, perhaps a little VERY gentle polishing of both the chamber and adaptor is in order, most Mosins have had rough handling, perhaps some heavy grease on the adaptor would help-? Last edited by SIGSHR; April 24, 2011 at 07:10 PM.

April 22, 2011, 10:06 PM	#2
benogil Senior Member Join Date: January 23, 2008 Posts: 131	.32 - good 7.62x25 - very bad, may ruin your rifle from the insert welding itself to the chamber wall bad,

April 23, 2011, 11:18 PM	#3
Aguila Blanca Staff Join Date: September 25, 2008 Location: CONUS Posts: 18,460	Why would the .25 caliber insert weld itself to the chamber?

April 24, 2011, 08:52 AM	#5
benogil Senior Member Join Date: January 23, 2008 Posts: 131	To the above, quite right. On another board, a member said SG has seen the inserts permanently attach themselves to the chamber walls of mosin's. Too bad, sounds like a great idea ( and is in .32 ). I know, because I bought one to use with 7.62x25. By all accounts, the .32 is good for rabbits out to 50 yards.

April 24, 2011, 10:37 AM	#6
30-30remchester Senior Member Join Date: April 18, 2009 Location: mountains of colorado Posts: 977	I have collected and shot chamber inserts aka cartridge coversions aka chamber adapters for many years. They are a very old solution to a weight and availability problem. Years ago before the advent of the ATV, many true outdoorsmen actually spent many days afield with just what they had on their back. Either through poverty, regulations, or weight considerations, many of these men didnt carry a small game handgun or rifle in which to get their daily supper. Thus the chamber adapter allowed the owner of certain calibered high power rifles to load an adapter with light weight handgun ammo and take small game. The noise level of say a 32 ACP is far less than a 22 LR. A big drawback is sight adjustment and accuracy. In days of old most high power rifles had only iron sight which easily allowed for fast sight adjustment. Most all adapter I have shot hit @1 foot low at 25 yards when gun sighted for high power ammo. Simply adjust your rear sight up a couple notchs and you can get point of aim impact at close range. Not advisable with scoped sighted guns. However I have learned that there are some "holdover" tricks that can be learned with scope sighted rifles. Accuracy on many adapters is barely acceptable for rabbit sized animals at 25 yards. All in all I try to always carry an adapter when afield with a gun that allows one. A few adapter rounds of ammo and a wounded animal can be dispatched quietly and a grouse or rabbit can be taken at close range without scaring all game away.

April 24, 2011, 10:15 PM	#8
Aguila Blanca Staff Join Date: September 25, 2008 Location: CONUS Posts: 18,460	7.62x25 not .25 caliber. :doh: I knew that. Brain fade. Sounds interesting. I may treat myself to one of the .32 caliber versions.

May 5, 2011, 05:23 AM	#9
DWFan Senior Member Join Date: April 25, 2008 Posts: 305	Slug your bore first... 7.62x25mm = .309" bullet .32 caliber = .312" bullet

May 5, 2011, 09:12 AM	#10
sirsloop Junior member Join Date: January 13, 2011 Posts: 376	If you made a pistol in 7.62x54R, it could potentially create a ban for all 7.62x54R surplus STEEL CORE ammo.

April 10, 2012, 11:35 AM	#11
10 Spot Terminator Senior Member Join Date: January 3, 2008 Location: Central Oregon Posts: 348	Most of the Moisons I have encountered slugged rather large with the tightest one ever being .3095 diameter. in a 91/30 with a barrel in the 29 inch range I would want my pistol cartrige conversion to have plenty of umph and yet be closer to bore diameter such as maybe the .327 Federal or .32 H&R Mag to reduce any chance of a squib and would be for hand lapping the bore on an old milsurp until I could see my own eyeball looking back at me when I looked down the bore ( mirror bright ). Am betting those instances in which the adaptors seized in the chambers had either less than smooth finish in them and or some chamber pressure issues from those bullets slowing down alot before they made it out of the barrel. Just my thoughts here as am not a smithy but seems like pistol cartridges were developed to perform out of "MUCH" shorter barrels with the occasional buntline being the rare exception otherwise why are Contender loads listed differently in loading Manuals such as Lyman vs. standard rifle cartridges of the same calibre 10 Spot

April 10, 2012, 04:52 PM	#12
SIGSHR Senior Member Join Date: September 13, 2005 Posts: 4,700	Wouldn't coating the insert with Vaseline or heavy grease before each firing session prevent its adhering too tightly?

April 10, 2012, 06:29 PM	#13
Avenger Senior Member Join Date: September 29, 2008 Posts: 274	That would work, oiling cases to aid extraction was somewhat common on early machineguns. But with a bolt-action rifle, it's a good way to potentially get hot oil in the face or eyes if there is ANY gap between the adapter and the chamber walls for gas to escape through.