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Old September 7, 2021, 01:30 PM   #51
ChasHam
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Updating Post #22 From 1 August

Stopped by that same gun store today: Noticeably more guns and ammo-- but y'all better bring plenty of money!
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Old September 7, 2021, 04:21 PM   #52
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Originally Posted by JB in SC View Post
Paid $70 for a 200 round box of WW 9mm 115 grain FMJ two weeks ago a local store. Blazer aluminum was $15 a box. Even .380 Blazer Brass showing up at $27 a box. Not pre 2020 pricing but better. Lead .38 Special ammo is very difficult to find but it was not exactly cheap in 2019, WW and Federal WC and SWC loads were over $30 a box then. I did see some Federal 158 RN lead for $29.99 last week.

Decent hunting caliber rifle ammo is very expensive when you can find it, that would push me to hand load if I still hunted.
We'll most people who do hunt probably have a decent stockpile for their rifles, but I would think hunting this year is largely going to bemuzzleloader and shotgun, maybe handgun.

As to the prices you paid for 9mm, when this is all over I don't want to hear from anyone complaining about how they stick with 9mm at $15 a box (that will be the new normal) because .32, .40, 10mm, etc. all cost a few bucks more a box. 2 years ago all those calibers cost $18 a box (online) and people cited that as the reason they shoot 9mm and now I see people paying that price and even more for 9mm now.
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Old September 7, 2021, 07:16 PM   #53
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I live in central Washington state east of the Cascades.

Our local gun stores now have quite a wide selection of pistol, rifle, and shotgun ammunition in stock - a change from 60 days ago, when shelves were mostly bare.

But as stated above, prices have largely remained very high. On one hand it may still be a matter of supply not keeping up with demand.

But on the other, eggs, chicken, tuna, and other baseline groceries are amazingly high right now also. Can't find rubber tires for motorcycles at all, and if you can, those prices are sky high too.

So it could be that the cost of components and so forth will be keeping ammunition prices very high for the foreseeable future - regardless of how much of it is available.
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Old September 9, 2021, 10:17 AM   #54
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I live in central Washington state east of the Cascades.

Our local gun stores now have quite a wide selection of pistol, rifle, and shotgun ammunition in stock - a change from 60 days ago, when shelves were mostly bare.

But as stated above, prices have largely remained very high. On one hand it may still be a matter of supply not keeping up with demand.

But on the other, eggs, chicken, tuna, and other baseline groceries are amazingly high right now also. Can't find rubber tires for motorcycles at all, and if you can, those prices are sky high too.

So it could be that the cost of components and so forth will be keeping ammunition prices very high for the foreseeable future - regardless of how much of it is available.
1 thing has nothing to with supply and demand.

BEFORE the planned DEM panic, diesel was $1.89
Now, diesel is $3.09

Shipping ost to receive raw materials UP (almost double)
Shipping cost to deliver goods UP

Without supply and issues, those costs would be passed on.
Increase and or suspected increase in taxes added on.
Imminent minimum wage increase added on

Prices will not return UNLESS sanity returns
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Old September 9, 2021, 01:16 PM   #55
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Fake news. Supply and Demand WORKS. It's not a political stunt, it's ECONOMICS.
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Old September 9, 2021, 01:19 PM   #56
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As clearly the most liberal person on this forum, I assure you, a lot of this sounds bonkers.

No offense.

But from my side, I can back up where the problem is coming from with data (ie, it's Vista, a US monopoly of ammo)
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Old September 9, 2021, 01:54 PM   #57
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Is ammo availabilty getting better yet?

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Originally Posted by wild cat mccane View Post
As clearly the most liberal person on this forum, I assure you, a lot of this sounds bonkers.

No offense.

But from my side, I can back up where the problem is coming from with data (ie, it's Vista, a US monopoly of ammo)

I disagree that Vista is the problem, based on my own experience. Through all of this some of the cheapest ammunition I have bought has been Vista in origin. A few months ago I bought two cases of Blazer Brass 9mm for $280. This was a new shipment to the store, multiple pallets with no limits and it all sold for that price. I’ve also bought American Eagle at moderate prices, or at least as cheap as any of the Ruag/Norma/S&B I’ve also purchased. I can go on Ammoseek right now and it’s not as if all of the cheapest brass cased 9mm is foreign made or that the Vista produced ammunition is significantly more expensive (Blazer is often one of the cheaper options).

https://ammoseek.com/ammo/9mm-luger?ca=brass&co=new

There has been a large quantity of Belom and Igman and other Serbian and Bosnian ammunition at lower prices than American manufactured ammunition, but these were always priced lower even before the panic. If anything that price savings on Serbian/Bosnian ammunition seems to have decreased from what it was in terms of percentages.


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Old September 9, 2021, 03:46 PM   #58
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You can't in one beat say globally traded raw goods cost more and then in the other say it's a conspiracy in America.

Winchester is exporting the majority of their ammo to Australia right now.

There isn't enough CAPACITY in one year time to meet demand.

Russian ammo in 9mm, how popular was it in your inventory? Like truly.

But...since it's gun related it's a conspiracy. But no a single person has said it was conspiracy that the same thing happened in the car market.

Oh well.
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Old September 9, 2021, 05:06 PM   #59
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Is ammo availabilty getting better yet?

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Originally Posted by wild cat mccane View Post
You can't in one beat say globally traded raw goods cost more and then in the other say it's a conspiracy in America.

Winchester is exporting the majority of their ammo to Australia right now.

There isn't enough CAPACITY in one year time to meet demand.

Russian ammo in 9mm, how popular was it in your inventory? Like truly.

But...since it's gun related it's a conspiracy. But no a single person has said it was conspiracy that the same thing happened in the car market.

Oh well.

I have never stated there is a conspiracy, so I’m not sure to whom this comment is directed (that it directly follows my comment which was a response to your comment seems to suggest this is in response to something I said, which again isn’t the case).


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Old September 10, 2021, 09:25 AM   #60
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I received yesterday 20 boxes of Norma 124gr for $380 from Swiss based Ruag Ammoshoponline.com and 20 boxes of AE 124gr 9mm for $400 from Locked and Loaded. All of which I will shoot presently.

The truth is simple, ammo buyers, only in America, are hoarding. Domestic can't keep up with demand and raised prices far exceeding material costs they are using as justification. There isn't a law against that, but in forums, this just has to be a conspiracy.

It is 100% fact that the ammo shortage is a US problem only. It is 100% fact that material costs have no where near met justification for increased pricing in the US. Additionally, relatively junk brass 124gr PPU sub Belom is going for US prices? What about South Korea?

-PMC in all calibers has been 100% available this whole time. Even in 357mag.
-Fiocchi non US made has been available 100% of the time.
-Mexico made Aguila has been around a lot.
-PPU/Belom has been 100% around this whole time.

You can't tell me private company based in Switzerland, Ruag, is importing Swiss made GOOD ammo, made in more expensive everything/more socialized Switzerland, shipped to the US, and make a profit when US AE retailis bought at a higher price is just covering cost.

That doesn't square with any of the smallest fragments of reality.
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Old September 10, 2021, 10:15 AM   #61
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Is ammo availabilty getting better yet?

You’re comparing prices of ammunition bought at two different retailers in an attempt to prove regional price fixing. How do I know the markup from both retailers is the same? You’re also comparing a grand total of two retailers when all of ammoseek is available. I’ll also add the Norma ammunition available on normashooting.com, which is ammoshoponline’s new website that they link you to when you go to their old website, is not $0.38 a round but $0.40 a round. That’s the same price of the American Eagle that you seem convinced is price fixed.

Again, my own experience and the evidence in front of me doesn’t support Vista price fixing. If you want to believe differently that’s your call.


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Old September 10, 2021, 10:21 AM   #62
wild cat mccane
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Yes. But the fatal mistake there is ammoseek is US only.

We have a member here who lives in Switzerland. No problem getting ammo or components at normal pricing, per him.
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Old September 10, 2021, 10:24 AM   #63
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Is ammo availabilty getting better yet?

Yes. That’s American retailers marking up their products to take advantage of the situation. That’s not the same as Vista themselves doing this.

I mentioned buying Blazer Brass just two months ago for $0.28 a round. When I saw it I was in shock. I spoke to the owner of the store, moderate sized but not large, and asked him how he was able to sell it for that. He told me it was the same markup he always charged, not some special deal. When I asked him how the stores around him, some not even 5 min from his door, were charging $0.40 a round? He just looked at me and said, “I make it a habit not to speak badly of other business owners”. He could have easily charged $0.35 a round and the line would still have been out the door. Some retailers have no issue charging more.

That steel cased Russian ammunition didn’t magically increase 40% in cost when the ammunition ban was announced. It was already in the country and had been paid for. That was demand spiking and retailers adjusting their prices. I literally watched that night as ammoseek kept crashing and prices magically changed in a span of hours.


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Old September 10, 2021, 05:45 PM   #64
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Ammo is available but prices have remained at elevated levels. It's inflation and will likely not reverse as transitory only means the leveling of the increase. Prices will not deflate.
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Old September 11, 2021, 06:46 AM   #65
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as long as people buy....prices will remain at the high sell prices.
customers have a weapon. its called DONT BUY IT.
force inventory up.
come end of year where industry gets taxed on surplus, they must reduce price to normal or even less to break even.

THAT...is economics in action.
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Old September 11, 2021, 02:01 PM   #66
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Agreed. That's exactly what happened with lumber. Supply shift caused an initial and dramatic price increase which eventually shifted the demand curve and cause prices to go back to where they started.
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Old September 11, 2021, 03:08 PM   #67
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I have not hardly bought any ammo in the past two years, Just living on my stash. How can people be buying when there is hardly any for sale? My LGS seldom has much ammo at all in 9mm especially. And the store is dead. This is one of the most popular stores in my large city.
I do not know how people are buying much ammo at the prices they want now. I do not believe that is the issue. And it will get worse once they stop importing Russian Steel case. We are talking about a 35% decrease in supplies.
I go to my club and talk to members very often. Members I have known for decades that are avid shooting enthusiast. THEY ARE HARDLY BUYING ANY AMMO AS WELL. And they certainly are not shooting much. The range is no where near the shooting capacity on Sat. like years past. My local indoor ranges are nothing like before. Even a Sat is like a ghost town compared to before, where the wait was at least a hour. Now no wait and barely any shooters. So if people are buying so much. Then where the heck are these people?
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Old September 12, 2021, 09:52 AM   #68
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I gauge the overall price of ammo by looking at the price tag of the cheapest brass cased ammo that I can find on Ammoseek for 9mm and .308.

Today Sept 12 2021 you can find .308 brass cased ammo for as low as $0.69
And 9mm brass cased for $0.33.

So I'd say the price of ammo is coming down in relation to what it was 6 months ago.

However you are out of luck if like me, you shoot russian calibers. 7.62x39 (steel) is retailing for $0.46 for steel and $0.47 brass, when it used to be less than $0.20 a round.

Lets not forget that in the last year and a half, besides the supply constraints, there has been rampant inflation all across the board. So in addition to the kinks in the supply chain and the russian ban, what is happening to ammo prices is not very different to what you are seeing regarding food prices at the supermarket. Go and try to see if you can find ground beef at $0.99 a lbs, which is how cheap you could find in January 2020:
Albertson's beef 99c/lbs

This is what happens when a Central Bank resorts to round after round of "quantitative easing" (printing money). But that is another story....

Ammo prices will NEVER go back to 2020 prices, get used to it, and neither will any other prices for that matter.

Now, if our salaries, and pensions, and wages go up at the same pace as inflation, no problem, no?
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Old September 12, 2021, 10:09 AM   #69
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Originally Posted by Carl the Floor Walker View Post
I have not hardly bought any ammo in the past two years, Just living on my stash. How can people be buying when there is hardly any for sale? My LGS seldom has much ammo at all in 9mm especially. And the store is dead. This is one of the most popular stores in my large city.
I do not know how people are buying much ammo at the prices they want now. I do not believe that is the issue. And it will get worse once they stop importing Russian Steel case. We are talking about a 35% decrease in supplies.
I go to my club and talk to members very often. Members I have known for decades that are avid shooting enthusiast. THEY ARE HARDLY BUYING ANY AMMO AS WELL. And they certainly are not shooting much. The range is no where near the shooting capacity on Sat. like years past. My local indoor ranges are nothing like before. Even a Sat is like a ghost town compared to before, where the wait was at least a hour. Now no wait and barely any shooters. So if people are buying so much. Then where the heck are these people?
Carl I think that one reason why it is hard to find ammo at a good price on store shelves is because much of the ammo market is moving online. I'd say it is the same if you try to find a big selection of small house appliances at a good price on store floors.

I think that if you are waiting for ammo on store shelves to be back at the price where it was in 2020 your ammo stash is going to disappear.

What I do to conserve my stash is go out and shoot, and replace what I shoot that day with ammo I find online. Oh yeah, and I am not taking classes where 400 rds are the minimum required, I can no longer afford that.
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Old September 12, 2021, 10:25 AM   #70
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Look at the bright side. In three more years, ammo we will have much more to worry about than Ammo. (If we are still here), Gee, I wonder where all that US banned Russian ammo will turn up? Some Country is going to make out like a Lucky Dog. And the last thing they have to worry about is their 2A rights taken away by our administration.
DON'T GO THROUGH YOUR STASH! You might need that ammo just to put food on the table.
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Old September 12, 2021, 10:35 AM   #71
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DON'T GO THROUGH YOUR STASH! You might need that ammo just to put food on the table.
Haha, based on my success (or lack thereof) as a hunter, I am afraid that if I need to put food on the table I better focus on getting me a plow and a stash of seeds.
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Old September 12, 2021, 11:09 AM   #72
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I have stocked up on Pellets for my air rifles. Sparrow stew is delicious. I figure once the Squirrel population is gone, there are always plenty of Rats.
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Old September 12, 2021, 07:58 PM   #73
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I found Blazer 9mm for $330 per 1,000 and it's brass cased. Supply is getting better.

Local Walmart had 30-06 and 300 Win mag on shelf today, but nothing else.
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Old September 13, 2021, 09:16 AM   #74
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I better focus on getting me a plow and a stash of seeds.

I have lots of seeds stockpiled and pellets, too
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Old September 13, 2021, 11:57 PM   #75
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I was out at the range a couple of weeks ago, and I had to go back, as it was absolutely full. When I went back during the hot times, there were still people shooting and when I left, more were showing up, many with ARs. I scarfed some good brass, too. The people down here are shooting like there is no shortage.
If I have to use my firearms to hunt for food where I am, we will starve. BUY food, water, medical supplies, etc., especially meat as beef has risen 16% since Jan, pork 13% and chicken about 6%, per an article I read two days ago. Filing the freezer as fast as I can.
Ammo is available, and prices are still nuts, but I am trying to find reloading components. I can still shoot every month and not put a huge dent in my stash, as it were.
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