air guns

[libiglou]

Hey Guys

Surprised I haven't seen anything on this forum about air guns with everything going on.(or maybe I missed it) Anyway like many of you my ranges are closed and I'm itchy not shooting. This is the longest I've ever gone not shooting since my kids were born. Today I ordered a crosman 1377 pneumatic pellet pistol off amazon. Reviews were mostly positive. I'm hoping to do some creative shooting in my limited backyard area without letting my neighbors know whats going on. My wife thinks I'm crazy but these are desperate times.
Anybody else buy a pellet gun recently. Experiences and maybe even range setups would be appreciated

[NoSecondBest]

I'm in my seventies and recently got my first ever "BB gun". It's a Daystate Huntsman Regal XL in .22 cal. I was looking for something I could shoot that was inexpensive to shoot, quiet (it's moderated), and accurate. Well, it's been a surprise. It shoots as well as any of my expensive target rifles and does it for pennies a shot. At 25 yards I'm getting five shot groups as small as .13" c-c, and at fifty a half inch or under. I wished I'd gotten one years ago. When I shoot it, it makes about as much noise as a hand held staple gun. Nothing fancy in the range setup, just a picnic table and a small metal bullet trap I got off Amazon that's suitable for either .22 rimfire or airgun. Just a heads up on things though....it will shoot right through a sheet of plywood so I have to make sure I've got a good backstop behind it. I've got a sheet of plywood behind it and a large archery target. So far nothing has missed the bullet trap.

[mikejonestkd]

I am in the market for a decent nitro piston springer rifle. I am still fairly young so a break barrel won't wear me out. Any suggestions for a quality springer in the $3-400 range, including a decent scope?

[NoSecondBest]

If you're serious about getting into an airgun and don't want to jump into a PCP gun, look at a Nitro Piston instead of a springer. You can get a pretty nice gun for what you say you're willing to spend and the Nitro Piston guns have a good number of advantages over a springer....both accuracy and power.

[mikejonestkd]

Thanks! any recommendations on a decent nitro piston rifle?

[NoSecondBest]

Here's a good link to see several of them. Read the reviews.
https://www.airgundepot.com/remingto...ifle-sale.html

PM if you'd like more info

[littlebikerider]

I've been getting a fair amount of trigger time with my airguns these last few weeks. It's great being able to shoot in the back yard or basement when the ranges are closed. I shoot both PCP's and springers...well, I'm down to one springer right now.

Here are a few general tips for "springers" aka "break barrel airguns", regardless of whether they are spring or gas piston powered:

1. All of these guns have a recoil, but not like firearm recoil. This recoil is when the air piston is released with the trigger pull and slams forward to compress the air. The sudden forward-backward jolt is more powerful as the guns get more powerful. Consequently, the more powerful guns take more skill to shoot and can be much harder on scopes.

2. Like firearms, much of a gun's accuracy is in the trigger, not just in the power plant. European brands Like Diana and Weihrauch generally have better, more adjustable triggers than the guns commonly found in the big box stores like Ruger, Remington, Gamo, etc (mostly rebranded Chinese guns). Some of the triggers can be improved by a skilled craftsman...some not so much.

3. There are companies that sell all kinds of springs, seals etc for the spring powered guns where the skilled craftsman with a spring compressor can modify his own rifle. There aren't as many options for tuning a gas piston gun, unless you can find a higher or lower powered piston.

4. The advertised pellet velocities on these guns is usually a complete fabrication. The truth is that diabolo pellets are most accurate subsonic, and many seasoned shooters will tell you that velocities of 800-880fps with an appropriately weighted pellet is about optimal. "Magnum" airguns that shoot over 20fpe (foot-pounds of energy) will probably take considerable practice to shoot well, no matter how good the gun is. If I remember correctly, 20fpe is about 930fps with a 10.3gr .177 pellet, or about 820fps with a 14.3gr .22 pellet.

If you want to learn about airguns until your eyes bleed, check out these forums:
https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA...p?action=forum
https://www.airgunnation.com/

Carry on!

[Pond, James Pond]

If you're serious about getting into an airgun and don't want to jump into a PCP gun, look at a Nitro Piston instead of a springer. You can get a pretty nice gun for what you say you're willing to spend and the Nitro Piston guns have a good number of advantages over a springer....both accuracy and power.

However, they can't be regulated as easily as a springer and if the piston loses pressure, then its a whole new unit which is more expensive than a new spring.

I know this as I have a piston springer and it's something I was warned about but only once I'd bought it.

For accuracy, certainly, I would recommend looking at an under-lever gun over a break-barrel, first and foremost.

I highly recommend Weihrauch air-rifles, both springer and PCP, although I don't own any, sadly.

I thoroughly enjoy my air-rifles. They allow to shoot on my land without flaunting the regs: firearms are only for ranges here, unless you're hunting or saving your life.

But between the air-guns, my crossbows and verticals, I can still enjoy ballistic bliss.

[NoSecondBest]

There are many, many manufacturers of airguns and they aren't all built to break down....no matter which type. You can learn more about them by visiting a couple of the shooting forums dedicated to airguns, and receive input from all over the world. Also, there seems to be no end of video's out there put on by some individuals who are very knowledgeable on the subject. Do some further research and find out the pros and cons of each type. Then visit the sites such as Airguns of Arizona, Pyramid Air, Airgun Depot, and a few others and read the specs of each type and the reviews. Comparing these guns, keep in mind that the reviews and opinions you read from most European countries, especially England, are from people who are restricted to very anemic guns. In England you can't shoot one with more than a mere 12 ft/lbs of energy unless you have a firearms license. Take a bit of time and learn more about them or you'll end up with something making you wished you'd taken a little more time to research.

[Erno86]

Cowbell metal targets work well and they last a long time with airguns. I also like to shoot empty shotgun shell hulls off of a wooden carpenter horse.

I used to shoot the snot out of my recoilless, Diana Model 54 Air King in .177 --- Till I had to send the rifle back too get a new piston spring installed (after a lot of pellets were sent downrange) --- Though I don't know the round count.

Now...with our outdoor range closed for the last two months --- because of the ronna --- I'm just getting ready for opening day spring turkey season in Maryland.

[mikejonestkd]

Thanks for the info. I have been scouring the sites and have a few contenders for a springer
Beeman R9,Diana 34 or 350, or the Hastan 135.
Any thoughts on these rifles?

[cslinger]

What do you want to do with your springer? If you are really looking for fun plinking sessions I would go Beeman R7/HW30 over the R9. If you don’t need the power for dispatching pests the lower powered springers are the way to go and will shoot quite nicely to 25 yards and can be stretched to 50. They will also be easier to shoot. I prefer Weihrauch/Beeman Gun’s but Diana makes some good stuff as well and the 34 is pretty legendary.

Keep in mind that when shooting a spring airgun your firearm skills will likely not translate. You need a lighter touch and follow through is VERY important. If you find yourself saying this thing is a piece of crap and horribly inaccurate........ it’s you not the gun. You just need to learn a different technique and although it can be frustrating at first, especially to us gun guys, it is very rewarding and although your powder burner skills don’t necessarily translate, the skills you learn shooting a springer such as trigger control and follow through will translate to firearms.

Enjoy it’s a fun Journey and either that Beeman or Diana are a great start.

Chris

[mikejonestkd]

cslinger- the purpose would be backyard plinking, 20-50 yards at the most, mostly casual recreation. I am looking for quality, ease of use, accuracy, and a decent trigger.
I have some experience with gamo and crosman break barrels, but want to step up a bit on the quality scale.

[cslinger]

My personal opinion and we all know what opinions are like and I am just some idjit who knows very little about very little so take my opinion for what it’s with.

All that said go Weihrauch HW30S or HW50s or the Beeman equivalents (R7 and ???). They are low to mid power springers with EXCEPTIONAL triggers that are very easy to cock and shoot for long periods. The HW30/R7 is the quintessential plinker, ridiculously easy to cock, super quiet, smooth shot cycle, accurate as the day is long and just a pleasure to shoot. Think Ruger 10/22 only WAY HIGHER QUALITY and WAY WAY WAY BETTER TRIGGER.

We gun guys tend to want to gravitate to powerful airguns because......well we are GUN guys. What we lose sight of is what we really want is a fun plinker and we forget if we need power we have........you know firearms. .

Powerful spring guns can be difficult to shoot and some of the very powerful ones can be a chore to cock and louder then you might think. My personal opinion is if you want power go firearm or PCP air gun.

All that said I am not saying an R9 or D34 are poor choices. They are both fantastic. The difference in quality, feel, trigger and pride of ownership of these few the average Gamo/Crosman is the difference between a toy gun and a real firearms. It’s a chasm of difference in my opinion. You will be very pleased.

Also keep in mind like .22 rimfires air guns should be shot with quality ammo and can like a particular ammo even from gun to gun. I have generally found H&N Field Target Trophy and Crosman Premier pellets tend to be good all around pellets across a variety of guns for general purpose shooting.

I realize the below is only around a 10m group and it was rested but it will give you some idea of the mechanical accuracy of a HW30/R7. It’s 6 shots from one of my HW30’s through the same hole and by shot 4 it was damn near stressful as I didn’t want to screw or up. .

[littlebikerider]

I give a strong second to cslinger's advice. BTW, if you didn't know, the better Beeman guns like the R9 are rebranded Weihrauchs. The cheaper Beeman guns like the "Duo" you often see at Walmart are rebranded Chinese guns.

Of the guns you listed, the Diana 350 is a 20fpe rifle. The Diana 34 is a 15-16fpe rifle. These are good for small game hunting, but overkill for backyard paper shredding and can perforating. The Weihrauch models cslinger mentioned will be much easier to shoot accurately, and much easier on scopes. And don't be concerned that it's a breakbarrel instead of an underlever. In real terms, there is no difference in accuracy to any but the most profoundly gifted shooters...if any difference at all.

[Double K]

Ditto on the R7, best little garage gun ever made. Being in the pest contol business I love and use air rifles often.

Here's mine. Gamo whisper, Sheridan SS, Beeman QB78,Beeman R7, Fienwerkbau 300s, RWS Diana 54 and Diana outlaw

[dyl]

Just wanted to offer another experience. Air soft pistols. I have 1 so of course I'm an expert now LOL. I didn't purchase it because of Coronavirus closures but because of opportunity. Externally it's very much like one of my carry pistols and fits in the same holsters. I can practice draw, presentation, sight alignment for the initial shot - beyond that the mechanics are different. Trigger isn't bad either. It's cheap to run, has practical benefits, since I can fill up the magazines with small green propane cans rather than "green gas". Accuracy in my subcompact M&P9c lookalike is pretty good at about 3-4 inch group at 5 yards. Garage distance. Sometimes sneak in a tiny bit of practice as I volunteer to "let out the dogs".

[5whiskey]

I’ve always wanted a PCP but they are expensive. I’ve also though about super light cast bullet primer only loads in .32 for plinking in the backyard. I can burn through a lot of primers for the price of a nice air gun.

[Double K]

Airsoft guns are fun especially in the dead of winter when it's to cold to even go to the garage.
I'll never forget my daughter hosing down a herd of deer in the backyard with my full auto MP-5 when she was about 7, the deer all jumped then stood there watching the glow in the dark bb's bounce off with a look like....what?

[4V50 Gary]

Double_K roflmao. Nowadays you can get into trouble for harassing game. Of course, she was only seven then.

[Double K]

They deer were only mildly annoyed, I'm one of the few people around here that really love wildlife including the deer which is ironic because the neighbors don't hunt and I anxiously wait for the season to come every year.

[wabo2190]

I agree with cslinger. If you want something powerful I'd go with a PCP. The Benjamin Marauder is an absoulte steal for it's price, but the one thing with PCPs is that you also need a pump or compressor. There might be some newer models out there but I have been using the Marauder for years and it shoots like a dream.

Some of these air rifles marketed at 1200FPS .177 air rifles on the market right now actually have a problem with hypervelocity. The pellets were not made to travel at those speeds so they tumbel and yaw in flight leading to poor accuracy. That's one reason I usually go with heavier/larger pellets. This is a good resource on PCP air rifles.

[FITASC]

I use a RWS 34 in .177; it is advertised at +1000fps; actual reading @5' over a chrono is less.

[Double K]

Since I posted that picture in july I got wild hair and sold nearly all of them plus 5 pistols, kept 3 rifles and 3 pistols, Diana outlaw, QB78, R7 and 3 vintage Benjamin pistols. Ended up with enough to pay for a FX dreamline classic laminated and a Leupold scope. The used airgun market was absolutely crazy this summer, rifles selling for 3-5 times what they're normally worth.
It's supposed to be here next week, I ordered it in August. I did get a SCBA tank which makes filling my Diana Outlaw a snap.

[stephen426]

@libiglou,

While BB guns are pretty good, I would actually go with airsoft instead. If you miss with a BB gun, you may damage something. There is little chance of damage with an air soft. Neither gun will have recoil so that would be a moot point. You can easily shoot airsoft indoors. Just find a place to hang a towel and drop the bottom of it into a box to collect the ammo. Safety pin your target to the towel, and you’re good to go. I would get a decent CO2 airsoft that is as similar to your carry gun as possible. Try working on rapidly acquiring the target and point shooting. I did that when ammo got scare/expensive after the Sandy Hook tragedy. I was easily grouping around the size of a silver dollar without sights from 15 feet away. Go from low ready and try to get on target as quickly as possible. Also practice drawing from concealment. This will make you a much better shooter even when ammo is pleantiful again.