Does the 9mm really have enough stopping power ??

[blhseawa]

Assuming you can maintain shot placement, bigger is always better.

That said, the modern 9mm pistol is an excellent compromise between stopping power and number of rounds.

For example,

Walther PP 8 x .32 ACP
Walther PPS 6 x .380 ACP
Ruger P94 15 x 9 mm
Ruger P944 10 x .40 S&W
Colt M1911 7 x .45 ACP

Revolvers 5 or 6 rounds

Most hi-capacity modern 9 mm's have twice the magazine capacity of the 1911 45.

Like everything is life, I think it is a valid compromise.

My $0.02.

[JohnKSa]

He, like many others, says it's a 357 magnum or a 45 automatic that does the job. But he feels that a 357 just has too much speed and is too narrow. It usually goes through the person. 45s stay in the body.

.357Magnum expanding rounds don't overpenetrate, in fact, due to the high velocity they have a tendency to fragmentation and rather shallow penetration. I would expect that in typical self-defense loadings you would find that the two calibers penetrate to very similar depths.

If he's talking about non-expanding rounds then he's still wrong. Either caliber will easily penetrate a human being through and through with non-expanding bullets.

[mdell2]

God forbid you ever have to use your weapon on someone, but if you do, shoot to stop the person. Most handguns designed for self defense can stop someone depending on bullet placement but for the most part you will have to take more than one shot. The caliber does not matter, shot placement does. During a situation of life and death where you are actually using your weapon, instincts take over (training,training,training) and you don't think, you react. You will do whatever it is you normally do when you practice (for most people, it will be a shot to the torso). A single shot will cause damage and eventually the person will go down, but not like you see on TV. In the real world, depending on the persons mind set, it could take several shots before he/she goes down, so you must be prepared to take several shots. Most head shots can and will bring someone down with a single shot but again in the real world you may not have the luxury to make that kind of shot. I would rather hit you several times in the torso than risk missing your head. At the range, your target does not move or shoot back. People move quite a bit, and even more so when they are being shot at so all in all PRACTICE, PRACTICE, PRACTICE! I carry a XD-9 subcompact with Double Tap gold dot ammo. Any 9mm should do just fine as long as you hit your target.

[R1145]

The lighter (115 and 124gr.) +P and +P+ loads seem just fine for social work, based on the data from the innumerable threads I've read on the subject.

[45usp]

from friends who served in afghanistan and iraq, from vietnam vet friends of my dad, from ww2 and korea vet friends of my grandpa, and from most of what i have read, i am willing to believe that 'stopping power' is largely a myth, as relates to handguns. no matter the size, they're going to make holes, not stop a running man in his tracks and throw him backwards.

no matter what caliber of handgun you are using, you need to hit the central nervous system or a major artery. i have both a usp .45 and a ppk, and i spend as much cash on ammo and range time as i can possibly spare, so that i can do one or the other, with either of those guns.

i figure, sure, the .45 will tear up more tissue than the .380, but taking a .380 through the eye is going to stop anyone's aggressive tendencies in a hurry. i also understand that it is fairly unlikely that a .380 jhp will mushroom as intended, but i figure the extra powder behind gold dots will help make deeper holes.

in answer to your question, i would not worry at all about 9mm. it has served well for many years.

[GoSlash27]

I'm not sure that any handgun has what I'd refer to as "stopping power". If I didn't feel the 9 was up to the task, I'd get something bigger. I don't want to hesitate to use it if (God forbid) I should need it.

JMO

[Northalius]

This is why I'm getting a 10mm (G29) pistol. A 9mm, .40, .45 and .357SIG all have very similar ballistics; with some superior to others, but none to make a huge difference. A 10mm pistol with DoubleTap rounds... that's a different story; we're talking true .357 MAGNUM (and higher) power here, my friend. With a 6" barrel, the 200 gr. DT round rivals even one of the loads from the .41 Magnum!

I live in the woods, and a pitbull is the least of my concern; I'm looking for 400-600 lb. BEARS! And that is why I will be packing the 10mm Glock 29 (and eventually Glock 20), with DoubleTap 200 gr. FMJ Beartooth and FMJ-FD rounds.

If you're not confident in 9mm, then definitely check out the 10mm (.40 Magnum Auto, as I call it).

Seriously, check it out.

www.doubletapammo.com

[Keltyke]

Maybe I don't know what I'm talking about, but I've talked to pistol season bear hunters. I don't really think a 10mm will stop a charging 400# bear fast enough to save ya.

[Northalius]

I've read people taking down bears with 10mm Glocks quite a few times. Even the smaller Glock 29.

One comment on the DoubleTap 200 gr. FMJ-FP, a guy said he put the round straight through a dense telephone pole.

You might be thinking of the weaker loaded 10mm on the market. DoubleTap is a different story when it comes to loaded 10mm.

Ted Nugent goes hunting with his 10mm Glock 20 in Africa... and those aren't your backyard deer over there.

[cozidaddy]

Anybody remember Dirty Harry , and the infamous 44 mag ? Do you feel lucky punk , well... do ya ? Plenty of stopping power there in 44 mag & 44 spl

[Chui]

Does anyone wish to try his or her pet theory against the 9 mm bullet?

I didn't think so...

[Glockeroo]

Double taps with speer gold dots will more than do the trick

[Chui]

"Double taps with Speer Gold Dots will more than do the trick."

Not if they don't hit anything vital they wont...

[fitfighter81]

Unfortunately now days too much is put into how much power a round has and not enough thought into how well the user can shoot it. recently a woman was in the news who took a .44MAG through the windshield of her mini-van. She took a bullet directly between the eyes, where the round split and the traveled along her skull to both sides and exited behind her ears. she lived. Even with a direct hit from a large Cal. bullit, a victim can still funtion with quite a bit of fight in them for several minutes. keep you accuracy to 100% and you don't need to carry a cannon.

[mavracer]

Not if they don't hit anything vital they wont...

they'll due and thats 25 yards

[Chui]

It's a whole lot different when you're trying to shoot as fast as you can while someone is doing something to IMMEDIATELY remove your genes from the planet...


Good target shooting, btw.

[Ichiro]

Yes. 9mm is definitely the way to go.

[mavracer]

It's a whole lot different when you're trying to shoot as fast as you can while someone is doing something to IMMEDIATELY remove your genes from the planet...

only mind set. your setting yourself up to fail.you can't miss fast enough.but since you wan't to through a timer on.here is 7 yards IWB under shirt from buzzer 2.46 sec

[North Bender]

Mr. Camp, I read your reply on the first page and it was good to see a considered post from you, which I appreciate once again.

Thanks,

North Bender

[LUPUS]

I chose my firing platform before my caliber

I can not agree much more.

[Wildalaska]

if anyone doesnt think a 9mm is effective, let me shoot you in the face with one

Haven't said that one in a while

WildnotakersiassumeAlaska TM

Most folks are gonna say OW when they get shot, if even capable of that

[imthegrumpyone]

+10 Have one easy straight shoot'en Baby Eagle, don't want to be shot by anything but this "stopping power" crap is getting old Sure don't want to be in front of my 9mm

[Keltyke]

With all due respect, that paper target ain't moving and shooting back. At the range, it's not 11 at night when you, your wife, and your child exit the restaurant and come upon 3 armed perps who want your money and more. Your adrenalin isn't pumped up so much that you can't even FIND your gun. Your heart isn't beating about 500 times a minute and you can't even hold a sight picture because you're shaking so much.

I'm NOT discounting range time, I put in a lot of it. Shot placement is EVERYTHING. My wife can put 6 rounds of .32 auto in a playing card at 15 feet. That makes her .32 a viable stopper. I'll be glad to have her at my side with her little "popgun" in any gunfight.

Fact: Most people will NOT die immediately (if at all) when shot.
Fact: If a perp is hyped on drugs and/or adrenalin, he might not stop for several seconds after being shot. We've all heard (true) stories of perps who absorb 5 or more rounds of .45 and keep coming until they bleed out.

I'm NOT a combat expert. I've only had to pull my piece twice and never had to shoot it. Both times I had the perp by surprise and dead-to-rights. I know how I felt during and after the fact.

Now that I'm TOTALLY off the subject - Tactical practice and shot placement is EVERYTHING. A .32 between the eyes or in chest center will stop a perp faster than a .45 to the arm.

Caliber aside, carry what you shoot the best. Any gun in your pocket is better than a .454 Casull on the dresser.

[mavracer]

With all due respect, that paper target ain't moving and shooting back. At the range, it's not 11 at night when you, your wife, and your child exit the restaurant and come upon 3 armed perps who want your money and more. Your adrenalin isn't pumped up so much that you can't even FIND your gun. Your heart isn't beating about 500 times a minute and you can't even hold a sight picture because you're shaking so much.

as I said mind set plays an important roll.you keep telling yourself "when it happens I'm gonna panic" and you will.My mind is set I have always stayed calm in every stressful situation and don't plan on changing my tactics.now 10 minutes later I will probably be shakin'and a little out of it.which is what's happened in the past.

[Northalius]

It's true, the mind plays a big part in a bad situation. Stay calm, and you've got great chances of doing the right thing when the SHTF. Sadly, there's no TRUE experience for practice, until it literally happens... but you can play "visual scenarios" over and over in your mind, and the more you do this, the more prepared you'll be for when it really happens.

It's pretty similar to someone wanting to join the Navy SEALS: They work out on a daily basis, swim in the cold ocean regularly, etc. but when they finally get to BUD/S, they realize it's much harder than they had thought... yet their prior training at least helped a lot compared to the person that didn't bother doing ANY workouts at all!

A high ranking SEAL once said: We train close to 100%, because real war is 150%.

It's true, shot placement means a lot; but a bigger, faster bullet shot in the same place as a smaller, slower bullet? The bigger faster bullet is the one I want to use! That's why I go with the 10mm... and practice, practice, PRACTICE!

It's all up to personal preference; I know there're guys out there that'll say "Screw 10mm, and use a .44 Mag!" and others'll say "Screw the .44 Mag, and use a .500!" And it goes on and on.

Like they say: Use what you shoot best with.

But don't ever assume just because you shoot better with a 9mm, and crappy with a 10mm, supposedly means EVERYONE ELSE is the same? Nope. Others can handle bigger rounds better than you! And the other way around, too. It all depends on each person, and how much they're willing to put such and such amount of time, money and practice into mastering their prefered round for self defense, is all.