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Old May 25, 2022, 04:43 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by Drm50 View Post
There is a serious shortage in new scopes for actual hunters. In the woods a 4x scope is about all you need. Sometimes a 6x with big nice for low light situations.
The new generation of hunters are not hunting, they are assassinating game from stands with Target/ Varmit scopes. If you want a hunting optic you are going to pay big bucks for what is now considered a “European Style” scope. Same thing as the old K Weaver and straight power Redfield and Leupolds.
I’m not buying the low end Chinese scopes and not the $1200 German scopes either. Best bet is to buy a nice used Leupold for reasonable money. It’s still guaranteed. I’m looking for scopes for two #3 Rugers as we speak. I just want to shoot deer in the woods not observe craters on Mars.
Not to derail post, I promise, but to the point of “taking game in the woods and not staring at craters on Mars” I must protest.

Some, like myself, have our one rifle for all around use. Stalking deer, stand “assassinating” as you so eloquently pointed out, and varmint control. The latter requiring the higher power for longer distance shots.

I do, however, completely agree with you on buying a lightly used Leupold Gold Ring for the forever guarantee, and that they are made here in the states by fellow Yanks.

OP, Brownells has their sale/clearance section stocked with a few lower power scopes, like the 1-4x range with varying objective bell sizes. Right in your price range.
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Old May 25, 2022, 08:38 PM   #27
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Burris Compacts

I have two Burris Mini 4X scopes on two carbine rifles. They work well and they are gloss. The rifles are older vintage blued rifles. I wanted gloss scopes for them so I ended up with Burris scope. I bought each used for $125.00 to $150.00 about ten years ago. Prices like everything else are rising.
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Old May 25, 2022, 10:29 PM   #28
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I bought Burris Compact 6x new for 77/22 Ruger when they first came out in 80s. The scope was clear and no problems with adjustments. It was basically for squirrels and I didn’t like field of view. I bought top of line Redfield 4x and made fine rig. Still on there today. I have Weaver K series from 2.5x to 12x that were bought new when guns were bought new from back in 60s. I never bough varibles until forced by manf dropping fixed powers. Biggest scope I had was Redfield 16x on a Win 70, 220 Swift.
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Old May 28, 2022, 12:11 AM   #29
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I have not read all posts, but offer the following comments based on several of the early comments in this thread.

It should be possible to purchase a used Leupold 4x on eBay w/o too much hassle. Even a vintage M8 will suffice for a great deal of typical whitetail hunting. Leupold offers a lifetime warranty on their products, no questions asked re used or otherwise, if the scope goes down, Leupold will fix it.

The problem with a vintage USA made Weaver K4 or other vintage Weaver is that if it goes sour, there are few options , if any, for repair. There was at one time an outfit or two that would service the old USA Weavers and Redfields, I am uncertain if they still operate. Last I checked, a decade ago, turnaround was huge and cost had skyrocketed.

Finally, the OP states his existing 4x M8 is on his defensive AR rifle. I would respectfully suggest that is not an optimal choice. There are circumstances where the magnification would be useful but the inability to use the rifle /optic in poor light, or in great haste up close and personal severely handicap his AR as a defensive weapon. My advice would be to remount the 4x on his hunting rifle, and consider a red dot or a low power illuminated variable for the AR. Vortex offers affordable (sub $200) versions of both. Burris had a 3x illuminated optic that might serve, I cannot advise model. A functional budget compact
non magnifying red dot from Bushnell or Primary Arms can be had for sub $150 if intended for light duty and cared for.
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Old May 28, 2022, 08:49 AM   #30
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bamaranger, thank you for your thoughtful response.

The market has changed. stinkeypete and I were both surprised to learn that simple fixed 4X scopes are generally not offered by respected manufacturers like Leupold or Burris, except an FX 11 4X 'rimfire' from Leupold.

Leupold does offers lightweight (6.5 oz) 2.5X scope that is probably perfect for my application on the IMI Timberwolf carbine.

I need to get into the current century and look more closely at the red dot and prism scopes you suggest. I've hesitated because 'they say' that red dots don't work well with astigmatism (which I've got) but I need to test that better, with my regular eyeglasses that correct for astigmatism. If I didn't look through the proper part of the lens the front sight on my old AR looked curved, and the best I could do was to put the aiming black on top and ignore the curved stem. Not perfect but well enough.

Inexpensive safety readers from Amazon work for pistol and for the Timberwolf, at the range. Front sight is in focus (even if slightly curved) but the rest of the world is out of focus.

Anyway a friend has a red dot on an AR pistol and had me try it, with my regular glasses, and the dot might not have been exactly round but it was quite usable.

So I think your point is excellent; I just need more convincing by looking through other red dots. They are light enough, and it is hypocritical for me to say "I don't want anything with a battery" while wearing a hearing aid that runs on a battery.

My AR carbine with the 4X Leupold is not exactly a defensive rifle, it is just a go-to arm that works with my regular glasses - and probably needs a light to work in low-light conditions.

Anyway thanks for the input.
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Old May 29, 2022, 12:37 PM   #31
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Well said about the serious lack of "hunting" versus "assassination" scopes!
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Old May 30, 2022, 11:12 AM   #32
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Bobcat, I have bad news for you.

Over the years, the diode in my Ultradot went from round to oblong with a “smear”. I bemoaned this to my 23 year old daughter.

“Let me see, dad”

I hand her my gun.

“What are you talking about, that’s a perfectly round dot.”

“Perfectly round?”

“Yep. A round red dot.”

It’s the old eyes. Still, much better than iron sights!
I hunt, shoot bullseye, plink, reload, and tinker with firearms. I have hung out with the Cowboy Action fellas. I have no interest in carrying firearms in urban areas.
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Old May 30, 2022, 06:32 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by Condorcet View Post
Well said about the serious lack of "hunting" versus "assassination" scopes!
In all fairness, its almost impossible to assassinate an animal as they are not important people and I have yet to meet and animal that has political or religious beliefs.

as·sas·si·nate (verb)
murder (an important person) in a surprise attack for political or religious reasons.
I don't believe in "range fodder" that is why I reload.
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Old May 30, 2022, 07:31 PM   #34
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stinkeypete, I need to get into the current century and get used to red dots, even if they are smeared or weird.

Tried to buy an manual transmission car lately?

There is no market for simple fixed power scopes and if I had any sense, I'd buy the 2.5X Leupold and probably also the Swift 4X, and call them investments. In a while they will not be offered new at any price. My wife was looking on ebay for vintage computer stuff, and the junk we donated or sold for pennies years ago commands big bucks now.

Old eyes are better than no eves, and irons work with the right eyeglasses. I avoid gunfights on the street because no assailant will be accommodating enough to wait until I change into my shooting glasses. JK.

My wife is up in arms because the possums are after her garden. She says she feels like Elmer Fudd - who hated "that waskcally wabbit" - and wants to sit out over night to bushwhack possums. I offered her a .22 rifle (an ancient Remington Nylon 12 bolt action, scoped) but she wants something that makes more noise; the Timberwolf would be perfect.
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Old May 31, 2022, 09:21 AM   #35
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Probably not what you are looking for…..but…I have a Trijicon TA01 4X32 that is the clearest scope i have had the pleasure of looking through.
Compact. Durable, Expensive. Needs its own mount.
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Old May 31, 2022, 03:56 PM   #36
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First red dot I tried had all sorts of weird "rays" in a wide pattern. Then I lifted the see through lens covers...
All data is flawed, some just less so.
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Old June 11, 2022, 10:26 AM   #37
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Buck Rogers meets Blue Steel and Wood

Several friends at the range let me look through their red dot sights. The dots are not precisely round but they are easily discernible as aiming tools.

I'm getting over my distrust of electrical things, just as I got over my distrust of glass sights.

The Timberwolf is for close-in, less than 100 yards, so it does not really need a scope per se - just a sight I can see with my regular (not shooting) glasses. And one that is light and not complicated - the 2.5X Leupold would be perfect, but I went with a red dot instead.

Closer up

Thanks for your help and consideration!
Attached Images
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File Type: jpg Twolfcrop.jpg (53.4 KB, 52 views)
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Old June 11, 2022, 10:39 AM   #38
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Glad you found a solution - it should work well.
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