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Old June 9, 2018, 01:13 AM   #126
Cosmodragoon
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That is a discussion our school district is having these days. SRO's and hired security have rifles but the rifles are locked in gun racks in cars in the parking lot. Much less useful.
I'm glad your district is having it. I find it helpful to ask: "how long would it take a guard to get out to their vehicle, unlock and prepare everything, and get back on scene?", "how many of our kids might get hurt or killed in that amount of time?", and "what if the murderer happens to be between the guard and the guns?"

It's a fact that "gun free zones" and other such restrictions create a dangerous "fish in a barrel" scenario. Simply lifting restrictions on the natural right and the probability that a responsible adult might be carrying would go a long way towards dissuading attackers and potentially reducing the duration of attacks that do happen.
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Old June 9, 2018, 07:01 AM   #127
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I'm glad your district is having it. I find it helpful to ask: "how long would it take a guard to get out to their vehicle, unlock and prepare everything, and get back on scene?", "how many of our kids might get hurt or killed in that amount of time?", and "what if the murderer happens to be between the guard and the guns?"
There seems to be an expectation that SROs will jump right in to a long gun fight with their handgun. This will most likely be what happens but the success rate will likely be better with an appropriate long gun.

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It's a fact that "gun free zones" and other such restrictions create a dangerous "fish in a barrel" scenario. Simply lifting restrictions on the natural right and the probability that a responsible adult might be carrying would go a long way towards dissuading attackers and potentially reducing the duration of attacks that do happen.
Even in the most pro gun areas of the country the teachers tend to run overwhelmingly anti-gun. Administrators too, but less so.
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Old June 9, 2018, 10:58 AM   #128
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Originally Posted by MTT TL View Post
That is a discussion our school district is having these days. SRO's and hired security have rifles but the rifles are locked in gun racks in cars in the parking lot. Much less useful.
I would have no problem with properly trained and competent SROs carrying an AR in a school that my children attended.
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Old June 10, 2018, 03:01 PM   #129
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I would have no problem with properly trained and competent SROs carrying an AR in a school that my children attended.
I agree, but I'd rather see them with a SBR that uses the same caliber and mags as their duty pistol. Considering the ranges and tight spaces, something like a 9mm AR or MP-5 would be ideal.

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Old June 10, 2018, 03:11 PM   #130
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Considering the ranges and tight spaces, something like a 9mm AR or MP-5 would be ideal.
Except a PCC does not give you the ability to shoot thru body armor.
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Old June 10, 2018, 06:23 PM   #131
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I agree, but I'd rather see them with a SBR that uses the same caliber and mags as their duty pistol. Considering the ranges and tight spaces, something like a 9mm AR or MP-5 would be ideal.

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Maybe not, especially if you're going up against a BG with an AR.
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Old June 11, 2018, 12:46 AM   #132
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Except a PCC does not give you the ability to shoot thru body armor.
The fact that this is even a thing these days is worrying. But if you are going to carry a long gun it may as well be a rifle in a rifle caliber. A lot of the police carry an SBR. 5.56 even in a 7" barrel is going right through any armor under Level III.
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Old June 11, 2018, 12:01 PM   #133
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The fact that this is even a thing these days is worrying. But if you are going to carry a long gun it may as well be a rifle in a rifle caliber. A lot of the police carry an SBR. 5.56 even in a 7" barrel is going right through any armor under Level III.
I agree its a troubling thought, but go to any gunshow and you can buy soft armor pretty cheap. If you dont mind laying out a little more cash hard plates are available as well. I walked into a LGS over the weekend and they had plates and carriers on display.

Just the times we live in. Plan and train accordingly.
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Old June 11, 2018, 02:19 PM   #134
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I don't post much but I've been around a while. I have a potential scenario and am interested in feedback from the community.

Imagine an active shooter situation, say one or possibly multiple assailants, in a large, "auditorium" type environment.

...

And yes, I know a rifle would solve problems, but lets just say for arguments' sake, it must be a pistol.

Thanks for the info.
I rather like this concisely worded post:

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I'm not about to switch because of a scenario. Train with what you have and train hard. " "Shed sweat, not blood." - Rommel.
I consider any of my assorted full-size, compact or subcompact 9, .40 or .45 pistols - or my remaining 4" .357 Magnum revolver - to be suitable for such a task, regardless of caliber or ammunition capacity.

Then again, I spent many years carrying both issued revolvers, and then issued pistols (in 9, .40 & .45), and realized that I might face such a daunting scenario at any time, while armed with any of them. That meant I spent just as many years training hard with all of them. Of course, I was lucky in the respect that I started more serious training as the result of my firearms instructor role several years into my LE career. Lots of trigger time and free ammo on a LE Only range, with some pretty experienced and gifted senior instructors to guide me.

Now, practically speaking, while my usual "retirement" weapons are often one of my .38 snubs or a diminutive .380, I still practice (and have qualified) using those little guns. That means having used them in the usual 3-15yd courses, of fire, and then taking them out to further distances, to assess basics.

I don't have any false expectations that the short .38's/.380's will likely be as potentially "effective" at longer distances, at least compared to my 3"-5" guns in 9, .40 or .45, but neither do I feel like going back to carrying around a bigger and heavier belt gun all the time again.

FWIW, if I found myself in the situation of becoming some authorized "church security", I'd probably not go any "lighter" than one of my .38 snubs. I might just as easily go back to wearing one of my 3"-3.5" 9's, .40's or .45's for that role.
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Old June 15, 2018, 09:36 PM   #135
MoArk Willy
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Which gun?

The longest barrel you can conceal with a laser sight.
You can't always get the opportunity to aim in a situation you describe. The sight will allow you to engage at an angle where you just may be under cover or shielded. Just my 2 cents. Your level of expertise will dictate the rest.
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