2 guns in IDPA

Alex Johnson · April 22, 2002, 01:44 PM

I just shot my first match in IDPA this weekend and had a great time doing it. I shot this match entirely with a G22, but next time I would like to shoot at least one segement of the match with my primary carry gun a S&W model 60. Some time ago I remember reading an article on using the J-frames in IDPA competiton, but the author was recommending using two of the little J-frames to avoid as much reloading. Would this be allowed under IDPA rules? I realize that somebody opting to use a J-frame under these circumstances is probably not all that concerned with being competetive and simply reloading the gun would be the alternative, but I'm still curious.

RickB · April 22, 2002, 04:08 PM

You are not allowed to carry/use two guns. Some clubs will allow competitors to shoot the match twice - bring two guns, and pretend you are two competitors. Also, you could encourage your club to run a side match or side stage for Back-Up Guns. We try to do either a shotgun or BUG side-stage in conjunction with our regular match, but there's no reason why a group of BUG shooters couldn't just be scored separately form the rest of the shooters. I've seen a guy shoot the classifier with a j-frame, and it wasn't pretty.

ACP230 · April 22, 2002, 06:11 PM

I think IDPA went wrong by sticking snubbies into their own division. I would rather have seen all stages be snub neutral so people would shoot the guns they often carry. I wish pocket carry was legal along with strong side hip too. IDPA was supposed to be realistic, nes pas?

midvalley · April 22, 2002, 07:31 PM

2 gun carry is not allowed in most IDPA matches. Most folks would not care if you carried enough speedloaders, bianchi strips or loose ammo to finish the stages though.

There is not a rule saying you can't shoot a 38 snub in the main matches. You will just not be as competitive as you would with a full size service pistol. But I think that reflects reality. Little guns are easy to carry, bigger guns are more effective when the shooting starts.

IDPA is what you make it. Shoot it with the gear that reflects your purposes. If you don't like the matches get involved and create better ones.

The problem with pocket carry is one of safety. IDPA matches are not training. You cannot do things like pocket carry, weak hand draws, weak hand reloads etc..... in an IDPA match because you have no control over the skill level of the entrants. While you are at the range training alone or with trusted friends is the time to work on skills that don't work in the match enviornment.

Best regards,
Keith

ACP230 · April 23, 2002, 06:13 AM

I have used both types of carry for years, and I don't find that pocket carry, with a holster, is any more dangerous than strong side hip carry. I have tried shooting a snubby in the regular revolver section of IDPA, but to my knowledge I am the only one here. If IDPA was snubby neutral more people would try it with the snubs they carry. I think that would be a good thing.

Billy Sparks · April 23, 2002, 07:13 AM

I think one of the reasons that IDPA is not snub neutral is that the headache of trying to make the stages up. Most snubs are 5 rounders so you would have the people that would want to either be handicaped or have all stages be 5 rounds and under.

ACP230 Although you have carried in a pocket holster for years there are others that just read about it in there favorite gun magazine and are trying it out for the first time on the line. After being a SO at a few of my home range matches I can tell you it would scare the pee out of me to have some unknown (to me) person trying to draw and shot from a pocket holster. Then some would want to just shove the gun in there pocket sans holster.

Ricky T · April 23, 2002, 01:36 PM

Unless noted otherwise only one gun can be used in a match. In a club match, a shooter can choose to enter twice and shoot two in two separate divisions.
As for the BUG friendly matches, we found out that although the concept is popular, the actual practice is not. We usually run two matches are year that are BUG or 5 shot friendly. The last one was in January. There were 64 total shooters. 49 of them chose to shoot full size service weapons. 15 shot in the BUG class. Of those 15, 11 shot some variant of a full size gun, i.e. Glocks 26/27/29/30/26. Only 4 used a 5 shots revolvers, S&W J-frames or Taurus 85. Two of the J-frame S&W shooters are expert level practitioners, they were easily beaten by semi-auto shooters who are sharpshooter or lower.

HeadHunter · April 23, 2002, 02:07 PM

As RT said, I have tried for 3 years to get folks to shoot their carry guns, such as J-frames, without much success. I plan to continue offering that type of match regularly but I don't anticipate much of a J-frame turnout.

One problem is that few people who have and carry J-frames ever practice with them to any extent.

9x45 · April 23, 2002, 04:06 PM

Look around the web. There are a few clubs that run J-frame matches only. http://members.cox.net/snubbymatch/

Ranger Grant · April 24, 2002, 09:43 PM

I think IDPA missed the boat with BUG guns. With some minor rule changes, and minor changes to the current classifier BUG's could have their own division. The most rounds allowed in a stage is 18. Load with 5, and have 3 speedloaders, or speedstrips on your belt. You won't be as fast as the pistol shooters, but you can compete with the snubby you carry. I'm not in favor of "neutral" stages as life is not neutral, especially when it comes to gun fights.

best, RG

PS: See ya Sunday Midvalley!

April 22, 2002, 01:44 PM	#1
Alex Johnson Senior Member Join Date: February 16, 2000 Location: Grand Forks, ND Posts: 812	2 guns in IDPA I just shot my first match in IDPA this weekend and had a great time doing it. I shot this match entirely with a G22, but next time I would like to shoot at least one segement of the match with my primary carry gun a S&W model 60. Some time ago I remember reading an article on using the J-frames in IDPA competiton, but the author was recommending using two of the little J-frames to avoid as much reloading. Would this be allowed under IDPA rules? I realize that somebody opting to use a J-frame under these circumstances is probably not all that concerned with being competetive and simply reloading the gun would be the alternative, but I'm still curious. __________________ I thoroughly disapprove of duels. I consider them unwise and I know they are dangerous. Also, sinful. If a man should challenge me, I would take him kindly and forgivingly by the hand and lead him to a quiet retired spot and kill him. - Mark Twain

April 22, 2002, 06:11 PM	#3
ACP230 Senior Member Join Date: October 18, 2000 Posts: 708	I think IDPA went wrong by sticking snubbies into their own division. I would rather have seen all stages be snub neutral so people would shoot the guns they often carry. I wish pocket carry was legal along with strong side hip too. IDPA was supposed to be realistic, nes pas? __________________ "To disarm the people (is) the best & most effectual way to enslave them." George Mason.

April 23, 2002, 06:13 AM	#5
ACP230 Senior Member Join Date: October 18, 2000 Posts: 708	I have used both types of carry for years, and I don't find that pocket carry, with a holster, is any more dangerous than strong side hip carry. I have tried shooting a snubby in the regular revolver section of IDPA, but to my knowledge I am the only one here. If IDPA was snubby neutral more people would try it with the snubs they carry. I think that would be a good thing. __________________ "To disarm the people (is) the best & most effectual way to enslave them." George Mason.

April 23, 2002, 01:36 PM	#7
Ricky T Senior Member Join Date: July 19, 1999 Location: ATL, GA Posts: 197	Unless noted otherwise only one gun can be used in a match. In a club match, a shooter can choose to enter twice and shoot two in two separate divisions. As for the BUG friendly matches, we found out that although the concept is popular, the actual practice is not. We usually run two matches are year that are BUG or 5 shot friendly. The last one was in January. There were 64 total shooters. 49 of them chose to shoot full size service weapons. 15 shot in the BUG class. Of those 15, 11 shot some variant of a full size gun, i.e. Glocks 26/27/29/30/26. Only 4 used a 5 shots revolvers, S&W J-frames or Taurus 85. Two of the J-frame S&W shooters are expert level practitioners, they were easily beaten by semi-auto shooters who are sharpshooter or lower. __________________ "Less yacking and more cacking" SDH

April 23, 2002, 02:07 PM	#8
HeadHunter Senior Member Join Date: May 21, 1999 Location: Atlanta Posts: 162	As RT said, I have tried for 3 years to get folks to shoot their carry guns, such as J-frames, without much success. I plan to continue offering that type of match regularly but I don't anticipate much of a J-frame turnout. One problem is that few people who have and carry J-frames ever practice with them to any extent. __________________ "Risk comes from not knowing what you're doing." — Warren Buffett "You can't go as deep [in] training as in a race or a fight. If you don't compete it's easy to convince yourself you're going hard. You're not." — Mark Twight

April 22, 2002, 04:08 PM	#2
RickB Senior Member Join Date: March 1, 2000 Location: Boise, ID Posts: 8,518	You are not allowed to carry/use two guns. Some clubs will allow competitors to shoot the match twice - bring two guns, and pretend you are two competitors. Also, you could encourage your club to run a side match or side stage for Back-Up Guns. We try to do either a shotgun or BUG side-stage in conjunction with our regular match, but there's no reason why a group of BUG shooters couldn't just be scored separately form the rest of the shooters. I've seen a guy shoot the classifier with a j-frame, and it wasn't pretty.

April 22, 2002, 07:31 PM	#4
midvalley Junior Member Join Date: April 22, 2002 Posts: 3	2 gun carry is not allowed in most IDPA matches. Most folks would not care if you carried enough speedloaders, bianchi strips or loose ammo to finish the stages though. There is not a rule saying you can't shoot a 38 snub in the main matches. You will just not be as competitive as you would with a full size service pistol. But I think that reflects reality. Little guns are easy to carry, bigger guns are more effective when the shooting starts. IDPA is what you make it. Shoot it with the gear that reflects your purposes. If you don't like the matches get involved and create better ones. The problem with pocket carry is one of safety. IDPA matches are not training. You cannot do things like pocket carry, weak hand draws, weak hand reloads etc..... in an IDPA match because you have no control over the skill level of the entrants. While you are at the range training alone or with trusted friends is the time to work on skills that don't work in the match enviornment. Best regards, Keith

April 23, 2002, 07:13 AM	#6
Billy Sparks Senior Member Join Date: December 10, 1999 Location: Winston-Salem, NC 27105 Posts: 745	I think one of the reasons that IDPA is not snub neutral is that the headache of trying to make the stages up. Most snubs are 5 rounders so you would have the people that would want to either be handicaped or have all stages be 5 rounds and under. ACP230 Although you have carried in a pocket holster for years there are others that just read about it in there favorite gun magazine and are trying it out for the first time on the line. After being a SO at a few of my home range matches I can tell you it would scare the pee out of me to have some unknown (to me) person trying to draw and shot from a pocket holster. Then some would want to just shove the gun in there pocket sans holster.

April 23, 2002, 04:06 PM	#9
9x45 Senior Member Join Date: January 14, 2000 Location: Southern California Posts: 1,089	Look around the web. There are a few clubs that run J-frame matches only. http://members.cox.net/snubbymatch/

April 24, 2002, 09:43 PM	#10
Ranger Grant Member Join Date: April 9, 2001 Location: San Francisco Bay Area Posts: 56	I think IDPA missed the boat with BUG guns. With some minor rule changes, and minor changes to the current classifier BUG's could have their own division. The most rounds allowed in a stage is 18. Load with 5, and have 3 speedloaders, or speedstrips on your belt. You won't be as fast as the pistol shooters, but you can compete with the snubby you carry. I'm not in favor of "neutral" stages as life is not neutral, especially when it comes to gun fights. best, RG PS: See ya Sunday Midvalley! __________________ "An armed society is a polite society"