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Old May 23, 2013, 02:17 PM   #1
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911 dispatcher tells woman about to be assaulted, no officers available

This story is a very forceful reminder that there is no guarantee of individual protection by LE, and that officers may only be able to clean up the mess afterward.

See the Sheriff's comments on public radio, at bottom of the article.

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Old May 23, 2013, 04:26 PM   #2
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The government will protect you, now here's some koolaid

Ashame the woman didn't obtain a firearm and training after the first assault.
Not all the facts are in the article but I doubt she had a firearm.
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Old May 23, 2013, 05:01 PM   #3
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This is the hidden (from those who choose not to see it) downside to all those government subsidy and grant programs. Departments (and their jurisdictions) come to rely on the "free" external money for day-to-day operational funding, with no planning for what they'll do when (not if) the grant money dries up.

The same thing happened with School Resource Officers (SROs). Several years ago, the Federal .gov was giving out grants to fund SROs in schools, so many departments and school districts happily took the money and installed SROs. But, when the grants ended ... so did the SROs. The schools and the jurisdictions had made no provisions for continued funding of the SROs once the grant money ended. Then, of course, along came sandy Hook and suddenly departments everywhere were able to post officers in schools where previously they had NOT been able to post officers in schools.

It's all smoke and mirrors. This is what inevitably happens when we cede control over our destinies to faceless politicians hundreds or thousands of miles away. The fact the some states receive more from the Federal government in funds and services than they send to Washington, while othjer states receive less, should be proof enough that the system is inequitable at best (if not outright broken).
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Old May 24, 2013, 07:23 AM   #4
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That was so true in my agency with different grants for numerous positions that there were more specialty units working on a shift than regular patrol deputies. The specialty units didn't have to answer calls so calls for service just backed up in a holding pattern. The specialty units made the press so it was more important to our "elected" Sheriff.
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Old May 24, 2013, 09:21 AM   #5
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It is interesting that all the anti LEO people on Facebook are claiming that this is somehow the fault of the police. Emergency services should be the last line item on a budget to see the chopping block. This woman should have had a weapon to defend herself.

Last edited by Evan Thomas; May 24, 2013 at 10:11 AM. Reason: invective.
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Old May 24, 2013, 09:41 AM   #6
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I didn't get to see this article until today. The answer for many in the media was voting for more dollars, and not advocating carrying a defensive weapon. That seems like the root of the problem right there. I've been a victim of scumbags more than once, and I can tell you that there was never an officer around when I needed one. I live in a major metropolitan city.
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Old May 24, 2013, 10:24 AM   #7
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The government will protect you, now here's some koolaid
Has nothing to do with government and everything to do with poor choices by the people in that area.

1. They chose to rely on federal subsidies for essential services apparently just assuming that that money would keep flowing forever.
2. From articles I've read they've had 2-3 chances to vote for tax increases so that emergency services wouldn't be cut and they've turned them down every time.

Not to sound like an ass but they really have no one to blame but themselves.
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Old May 24, 2013, 10:27 AM   #8
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I find it annoying that some people feel that their always needs to be people to come deal with personal problems at the drop of a hat.

The woman picked a violent boyfrend had problems. ok that sucks. Good time to reevaluate your life choices and personal defense.

-Get a large dog
-Get a gun
-Marry a cop and live next to a police station

or.. we can all spend millions and billions of dollars to put police on every corner, just in case a woman has a violent boyfriend that gets mad at 2am
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Old May 24, 2013, 11:19 AM   #9
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Considering the attack happened on the weekend and the police only work one shift M-F, and the dispatcher did not summon state police in time, only AFTER the attack, folks should be outraged that essential services like this were cut, but you can bet some other, non-critical ones weren't
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Old May 24, 2013, 11:20 AM   #10
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Yes, it's a pity that this woman wasn't better prepared to defend herself against an ex-boyfriend. But she is the victim here, and it is not her fault she was assaulted. Blaming the victim isn't helpful.
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Old May 24, 2013, 12:13 PM   #11
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I tend to agree with Aguila and Punisher about the grant funding. The grants start off being just a nice additional item, say another car/equipment. Then instead of the admin (usually more with the city/county manager then the LE Agency) saying great, we have a bit extra, they go hey, lets keep this grant coming, and then we will use the money we already had earmarked for another long term project. They get several grants freeing up money for multiple other long term projects, but then the grants get cut, and there is little to no money for the essential stuff that most people move to a city for, such as water/sewer/trash/fire/medical/police, which is usually some of the first to get cut.

Its easy to blame, say the fire/medical/police because, well since they don't have a call to on this very minute, so they are paid to either ride around and be a visable deterrent, or sit at the station doing other busy work between calls for service. What people don't realize is that when you cut staff levels back, there will be less staff available for calls, plus there will generally be a rise in employee turnover, so you will have a lot of either new guys, or folks just passing through for a stepping stone. Its a pay one way for services, or pay less and accept what happens with less.
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Old May 24, 2013, 12:17 PM   #12
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Despite how often we hear "protect and serve," the courts have repeatedly found that the police are under little (if any) obligation to protect us. Their mandate is to investigate crimes and apprehend suspects.

Situations like this are a grim reminder of that.
Sometimes it’s nice not to destroy the world for a change.
--Randall Munroe
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Old May 24, 2013, 12:48 PM   #13
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Court decisions have stated that the police as a whole have no duty to protect individual citizens, merely the public as a whole. Individual protection is, and always has been, up to you. Funding or no funding, specialty units or no SWAT, police departments try to prevent crime, and clean up the mess afterwards. You are your own first responder.
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Old May 24, 2013, 07:13 PM   #14
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This is why you arm yourself. If the cops want to wait a few days to send a meat wagon after a few JHP's drop an intruder so be it. I have been places not that far in the country where the cops take over an hour to respond. I am sure most of us have.

I have a sick feeling though that had the woman called up and said "I just shot someone" they would have found a cop to come out.
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Old May 24, 2013, 08:25 PM   #15
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Aguila Blanca and Punisher summed it up very well. Sheriff Departments all over the country took that free federal money, formed SWAT teams and bought all kinds of neat to have stuff. When the free federal money goes away the sheriffs office lays off deputies.

Aguila Blanca is spot on in regards to the School Resource Officers. Comanche county, OK had so much free federal money for SROs that the program turned into a fraudulent ghost employee scam. Several people ended up in prison.


Close to twenty former Lawton police officers, Comanche County Sheriff's Deputies, and Lawton Public Schools' Deputy Superintendent were convicted of stealing almost half-a-million dollars of taxpayer money over a three to four year period in a ghost employee scheme that became public in the summer of 2005.


Out of the roughly $500,000 owed, the guilty parties have repaid about $133,000 - a little more than 27% - collected in less than three years. While some have paid a lot, others have paid very little, and one person has yet to pay a dime.
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Old May 24, 2013, 09:19 PM   #16
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Marry a cop and live next to a police station
Back in the early 80's my house was burglarized. I was a cop, but I was on duty not at home.

As to living close to the police station.....Remember the shooting at the Clackamas County Town Center......The Mall is one two blocks away. The incident was over long before the cops got there.

I policed a city of 300K, we had the above average cops per 100K on the street. But at best we were lucky to get on scene in less then 8 minutes.

Something I've said, time and time again on this forum, and others, something I learned pretty quick in my LE Career:

If you want the police to investigate a crime, call 911.....If you want to prevent a crime, get a gun.

Learn to use it. Not just how to shoot, but how to react to criminal activities. There is a huge difference.
Kraig Stuart
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Old May 24, 2013, 09:43 PM   #17
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In 2011, on a Sunday evening in my metro area I saw a man knock a woman to the ground & start to punch/kick her.
The local PD responded approx 25min later & the patrol officer said; "Dude we only have 5 guys working in this area.".

True story.
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Old May 25, 2013, 08:07 AM   #18
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Cops are only there to hand out speeding tickets in general, and that's about the only crime they manage to stop in progress on a regular basis. At least it seems that way.

They are not even very good at finding the perpetrators after the crime. We had a shop building broken into 3 times and stuff stolen, and they even figured out who it probably was, but no one was ever arrested, and they won't even tell you who it is because they are afraid that you might administer some street justice.

However, they will find time to arrest you if you do administer some street justice.

We are on our own and we always have been.
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Old May 25, 2013, 05:46 PM   #19
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Traffic Citations accomplishes two things for a street officer, self initiated activity and mental therapy. There was no "quota" but supervisors expected self initiated activity to show at the end of a shift. It also provides therapy in the form of see violation, stop violator and issue punishment (fine). Most of the day is drive to crime that is over, write report and move to the next call like an assembly line. Unless the bad guy is standing there the street officer won't have time for the follow up investigation due to calls holding. The Detectives get all the glory, lol. When priority calls occur dispatch usually has to call you off of the call you are on to respond which could lead to long waiting periods (response times) or even no officer available if there were all priority calls being serviced. Protecting yourself or your family is a priority for everyone including the caller
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