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Old February 21, 2012, 09:37 AM   #26
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I have always sized cases to fit the rifle that I'm loading for . Just keep screwing the die down till you get the shoulder bump that fits your chamber and load away . Once you find the sweet spot , you can turn to neck sizing , for extended case life , if you wish , it's been known to help accuracy too ! All any of those measuring tools do is get your brass to SAMI specs , they are still not sized to your chamber . I've been reloading since 1967 without any oal gauges or comperators , and my ammo is just as accurate as any made with these aids , and I get Maximum case life too ! There is a learning curve to reloading and experience is the best teacher ! Just stay within the parameters in your manuals and you'll be fine .
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Old February 21, 2012, 10:41 AM   #27
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Way to go Oneoldsap, now that is what I'm talking about. "Experience" that is what's key...
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Old February 23, 2012, 11:12 PM   #28
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doing the same thing incorrectly is often mislabelled as experience though - not doubting all of your expertise here which i know exists - just saying - the right tools do come in handy.

Alternatively tools are a good substitute for experience

i've just bought one of the headspace gauges from larry willis, we'll see how well it works.

Might do a write up on it if anyones interested.
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Old February 24, 2012, 02:04 AM   #29
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It's only incorrect if it don't work...
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Old February 24, 2012, 06:10 AM   #30
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Some folks use torque plates when boring/honing an engine block,some don't.Some folks use a torque wrench when tightening fasteners,some don't.
Some automotive machinists will tell you"I have been building motors for.... years and you don't need torque plates to bore a block and fit pistons."

I called Jack Rousch and talked to him.He has experience.

I started loading in the late 60's too.I had all the lools a 15 year old kid could afford,and I made ammo that shot real well.I can still make pretty good ammo with a Lee hand press,a dipper and a scale.OK,add some calipers and a chamfer tool.

I can "seat of the pants" just fine.I have that experience

I can also load higher quality,more consistent and repeatable ammo,more perfectly tuned to my rifle,easier and more efficiently with precision tools.I have years of experience doing that,too.

If what you do is good enough for you,fine!!Enjoy!!

Then ,why are you here?To be negative?

For most folks,this is a place to share knowledge and experience,grow,get better.

I'll be happy to read a write up on that gage.

On the bushing gage,because our man of experience says he has never used a gage,he has NO EXPERIENCE with the gage.
Because he has never used a gage, he says it will only check to see if ammo is SAAMI length,guess what!If you drop your fired brass,as it comes from your rifle,in the bushing gage,and measure over the bushing and your case head with calipers,,you will have a useful number.Set your die bump so that number is .002,or.004,or whatever you choose,for head clearance.

That same $25 dollar bushing ,if you drop your brass in it,tells you if your necks need trimming.

if you drop loaded rounds in it,it is a functional gage that tells you your ammo is good to go,or not.

I don't say you need the tool to load.But,if you cannot see the value of the tool,it just might mean you do not have enough experience,no matter how many years,to understand how it all works.

Stick around,keep your eyes and ears ,and mind open,you will find out what you don't know.That is a good thing.Then you can learn something.

Last edited by HiBC; February 24, 2012 at 06:41 AM.
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Old February 24, 2012, 09:14 AM   #31
F. Guffey
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Davery 25,

“Might do a write up on it if anyone's interested”

For my part? Spare me the boring story, You have just purchased a comparator.

I know he calls it a head space gage, and reloaders with the lack of "Experience" do not know the difference or understand the principal of the 3 legged chair when compared with the 4 legged chair.

For years I thought reloaders believed head space gages were made on Mars, then I realized I had more confidence in their ability than they did, reloaders, not something from Mars.

F. Guffey
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Old February 24, 2012, 10:17 AM   #32
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What Negative ?

HiBC , I have reread my post several times and don't see where I was putting anything down . I was just pointing out that you can still make perfectly good ammo without some of the tools on the market these days . In the future it might be best if you just respond to the OP , and keep your opinions about other posters to yourself . I certainly don't need to hear them , and I doubt anyone else is very interested either !
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Old February 24, 2012, 07:14 PM   #33
William T. Watts
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A simplified way to set up a resizing die is find a case that will not chamber (range pick ups are perfect for this), turn the die down until it just kisses the shell holder with the ram fully up, lock the die in place lower the ram insert case and size it, measure the gap between the shell holder and sizing die with a feeler guage. This is how springy your press is, remove the resized case and try to chamber in your rifle, it will probable not allow the bolt to lock into place. You will probably have to adjust in several steps, I rotate the die 1/16" that's 1/16 of an inch (not 1/16 of a turn) repeat until the case chambers. Using this method your moving the case further in to the die less than .001" with each adjustment. This a precise method of setting up a sizing die, over simplified but non the less it does work and you will not over work your cases. One other tip do not mix headstamps, nor mix once twice and three times fired cases, keep the cases in lots, don't mix.. William
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Old February 25, 2012, 07:52 AM   #34
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Chairs? Why, isn't that just plane geometry? There I go, off topic again...
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Old February 25, 2012, 09:00 AM   #35
Bart B.
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One thing I've not seen mentioned in this thread is using shell holders with different heights above their bottom where the case head rests.

Redding makes these in .002" increments. While the "industry standard" seems to be .125", with the die set to "bump over" when the ram's all the way up, bottleneck case shoulders are set back to SAAMI minimum; sometimes even less. Redding says about these shell holders that come in a kit:
Shellholders are packaged in five piece sets in .002” increments (+.002”, +.004”. +.006”, +.008” and +.010”). Each shellholder has a distinct black oxide finish and is clearly marked to indicate the amount it will decrease case-to-chamber headspace. You can now easily adjust the shoulder bump to customize cases to your specific chamber.
They do work very well and help keep sized case headspace spread to a minimum which is essential for long case life and accuracy.
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