The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > Hogan's Alley > Tactics and Training

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old December 3, 2011, 08:11 AM   #51
Senior Member
Join Date: May 10, 2011
Posts: 213
Since you mention Austin, note that in Texas you cannot legally carry in a bar, nightclub or other 51% establishment. Therefore if you have been in one of these places, you have either gone there without a sidearm or you have carried there in defiance of the law.
Exactly right TXHootus. A person has no business in an alcohol establishment in Texas, if he is carrying a gun and has a gun permit. One needs to make a choice in Texas, because that is illegal. The 51% sign and the 30.06 signs are the two signs you have to comply with in Texas.

And incidentally, Texas has no brandishing law. The law in Texas is you
are in violation for Intentional Unconcealment, not accidental. And if one is
threatened, he is not going to jail for having to expose the gun to stop an
assault, but if he has been drinking and gets in a confrontation, then he
has a problem. As for me, I do not drink, but if I did, I would not carry.
TexasJustice7 is offline  
Old December 3, 2011, 09:00 AM   #52
Senior Member
Join Date: February 21, 2010
Location: Rome, NY
Posts: 941
Don't they have taxis in Texas? Sounds much safer, especially since you may be a little tipsy. (sans gun of course).
JimPage is offline  
Old December 3, 2011, 06:57 PM   #53
Deja vu
Senior Member
Join Date: March 14, 2010
Location: Border of Idaho & Montana
Posts: 2,507
When I was still in school I felt I was being followed by 2 scary looking guys. I lived about 3 blocks from the collage. I realized I was being followed and started walking around the block. I circled the same block 4 times. I then saw that one of the guys stopped and looked like he was waiting at that spot for me to circle around again. So instead I walked back to campus and stayed with a friend in the dorms for a few hours. I reported it to campus security but never heard any thing after that.
Shot placement is everything! I would rather take a round of 50BMG to the foot than a 22short to the base of the skull.

all 26 of my guns are 45/70 govt, 357 mag, 22 or 12 ga... I believe in keeping it simple. Wish my wife did as well...
Deja vu is offline  
Old December 3, 2011, 08:24 PM   #54
Senior Member
Join Date: January 25, 2009
Location: Ohio
Posts: 552
Same thing happened to me and my wife several years ago.We walked out of a show,three males were standing just outside of the doors of the convention center and followed us 3 blocks,and 2 street crossovers.The last crossover was between two garages, where i pulled my Browning HP and kept it along side my leg.When they hustled to catch up,they saw the 9,acted like they were looking at street signs,and took off.
m.p.driver is offline  
Old December 5, 2011, 10:56 PM   #55
Junior Member
Join Date: August 4, 2011
Posts: 2
I guess the question is, how close do you let someone get before you feel you are at risk?

Are you familliar with the 21 foot rule?

There was a Utah police study about it and the Portland Police Academy in Monmouth mentiones it.

The thought is that someone can cover 21 feet and stab you before you can react, draw, aim, and fire.

Here is a reference including some drills relating to it.
Tangent123123 is offline  
Old December 6, 2011, 04:21 PM   #56
Senior Member
Join Date: May 3, 2009
Location: Central Texas
Posts: 3,547
Texas CHL holders note there was a slight change to the laws for the better of CHL holders. You can legaly carry into an establishement that sells alcohol. Even if more than 51% of thier funds come from alcohol revenue. As long as it is an off premisis liscensed establishment. Still illegal in a bar. The sign on the front door of several stores I frequent have signs that say it is a felony if you are carrying an unliscensed weapon on the property. The same sign is on the front door of the local liquor store. I talked to the owner, and he says concealed carry holders are welcome to carry while shopping in his store.
No matter how many times you do it and nothing happens it only takes something going wrong one time to kill you.
m&p45acp10+1 is offline  
Old December 6, 2011, 05:51 PM   #57
Senior Member
Join Date: November 20, 2008
Posts: 10,529
At 15' away, I'm not drawing any gun until there has been an overt physical threat. This would include closing in on me and my family. But, if they are just keeping their distance 15' away remaining silent, my gun's not coming out. My hand will be on my gun, in my pocket, but it's not coming out.
Skans is offline  
Old December 8, 2011, 10:51 AM   #58
Join Date: November 30, 2011
Posts: 91
The last thing I want to be doing is fumbling to get my gun out of a holster. Things are different when the adrenaline is pumping and your heart rate is increased. I would have my gun in hand and ready to go at the first sign of a menacing character. I don't need to point it at them but it is going to be conveniently located in hand and at my side.
lockinload is offline  
Old December 10, 2011, 06:40 PM   #59
Senior Member
Join Date: March 18, 2009
Location: Central Colorado
Posts: 825
I've had two circumstances where I had been "followed", one turns out was not harmful, and the other may have been an attempt at a mugging that was averted by my awareness to the situation.

First time, i was in my truck and just pulled up into the gas station. A van parked in a spot behind me started up and drove around me (i haven't gotten out of the truck yet) AND PULLED DIRECTLY IN FRONT of me, with the driver yelling "hey! hey, you!" at me with a p***ed off look on his face. I was 19 or 20 at the time, so I hadn't owned my handguns yet- but I have a combat knife with an 8" blade behind the seat. I looked at him and said to myself, i'm not dealing with this sh** right now and I pulled the knife and scabbard from behind the seat and waited in the truck, with it running (and now back in gear). He must have seen me pull the knife, because his demeanor IMMEDIATELY changed to relatively apologetic he almost timidly creeped up to my door and asked if I wanted to buy some stereo equipment. I sternly told him "no", and that was that. Was it an attempt at something else? Who knows, situation was averted and I don't lose sleep over it.

The second time i was at the gas station AGAIN in my truck (Anyone familiar with Pueblo will understand, both instances were there). And also, I violated my direct vigil of Murphy's law, and I just so happened to be totally unarmed. No gun, no knife, nothing. I'm standing between my truck and the pump, and a guy walks around the hood of my truck (it's hard to see people walking around it- it's an old K-10 with a 6" lift and 35" tires) and calmly asks me for a few bucks for gas so they can get home. As i went for my wallet with my back to the truck, another guy walked around the BED of the truck, effectively trapping me between the truck, the pump and them. I immediately whirled to meet him with clenched fists, in a very alert and startled state. when I did that, they both took a couple steps back and either realized that they accidentally put me in a compromising position, or i may have been too reactive for them to take advantage of me. Regardless, i sternly (again) handed the first guy a five dollar bill, and they said thank you and quickly strode off back to their car about fifty feet away.

Both instances were probably just my imagination, but I think people don't realize that they accidentally look more threatening than they mean to be. Who knows, maybe i'm just a hypersensitive a**hole . I just try to remain vigilant- because I think when someone is following you and you don't acknowledge their presence, you're gonna get whopped from behind long before you can respond. The only solution is try not to get in that position.

Oh, and my wife just reminded me of her encounter as well (sorry, enormous post) when she was "followed" as well. My wife is 5'6", 130 pounds, and pretty cute so she sometimes draws unscrupulous attention. She works in a pretty bad part of town, and typically goes to and from work during the seemingly "mugging witching hours". One of the parking lots is seriously a textbook place for a mugging- no cameras, dark, fenced in, away from public view. Once she was walking back to her car at a relatively late hour. She has her Sig P238TL in her purse with her, as well as a large pocket knife. Well, as she is walking out and is about thirty paces from her SUV, a car comes creeping up from the other side of the road, and parks a few spaces down in almost an "observing" position. He's kind of easy to notice, they're the only two cars in the lot . But once she is about to get into her SUV, the car suddenly starts again and moves close, into the same position. She's not the kind to be taunted/threatened, so she has her hand on her gun in her purse ever since the car went into the lot. She gets into her car, and watches the other car as hers warms up, plugs in her stereo, etc. Then the car exits the lot, drives to the other side of the street, and parks facing her AGAIN. She continued to watch them, and then the car moved AGAIN two or three spots down in the same lot, still facing her. At that point, she started moving and crossed the street, and slowly drove past the car and got its description (gold Corolla, license plate XXX-XXX). She exited that lot, and left for home. She said the car was completely full of stuff, with a large sticker or something over the driver side window to either obscure who was in the car, or it could have possibly been for blocking the sunlight, if someone was living out of their car looking for a calm spot to sleep. Regardless, people make themselves look super-suspicious.

OK, that's all I got. thank you for bearing with me.
Those who hammer their swords into plow shares will plow for those who didn't...

Last edited by MagnumWill; December 10, 2011 at 06:58 PM.
MagnumWill is offline  
Old December 11, 2011, 12:06 AM   #60
Join Date: December 10, 2011
Posts: 86
Ihad a situation the other day that has since got me in the process of ccw and buying a handgun. Last Saturday morning I took my daughter with me to wash my truck. I was going to just run thru the auto side but it was broke. So I was washing it in one of the stalls and this older guy ( mid 60s) kept walking in front of the stall then behind it for several minutes. Walking by pretty fast for his age. I thought it was strange but didn't think to much about it. My time ran out and I had to get more quarters. I opened the door of my truck told her I'd be right back and walked around the corner. Then I thought I should have locked the truck. At the bill changer I could see the stall my truck was in. Sure enough he walked in it. I ran back to the truck and as I'm rounding the corner he's walking beside the drivers door. The speed he had been walking he should have been past the truck already unless he had stopped. I went to the drivers door and looked in and she was just staring out the passenger window so luckily never saw the old freak looking at her. I'm early 30s and work out 5 days a week so I'm pretty sure I could have bounced his old head off my trailer hitch pretty easily. That's what I reall wanted to do. Especially since he was standing at the back corner of the stall staring at the passenger side of my truck. But all I could think is what if he's got a gun. (10 years ago that thought probably wouldn't cross my mind.). So I decided to jump in the truck and leave. I hope I never get in another situation like this again. But if I do there will be some confrontation.
Sbowling79 is offline  
Old December 22, 2011, 12:29 AM   #61
Prof Young
Senior Member
Join Date: August 21, 2007
Posts: 1,276
Had a would be robber in college


Was walking girl friend home one evening in college. We had a follower, that I didn't see or hear, but she did. Just as we crossed an alley she turned, gasped, and he ran down the alley. I didn't occur to me until later that that guy was probably a nervous robber. Amazing.

Now days I just do my best to not be in unpeopled places after dark.

Live well, be safe.
Prof Young
Prof Young is offline  
Old December 24, 2011, 07:45 AM   #62
Ben Towe
Senior Member
Join Date: March 6, 2009
Location: Middle Tennessee
Posts: 1,128
Hard to say when you would draw without being there, but if you wanted to deter without brandishing and you carry OWB covered by a jacket or outer shirt as I do, then simply turn the gun side toward them, sweep the outer garment back and make a big show of adjusting the holster. 99.9% of thugs at this point will get scarce. If they are innocents you may get a funny look but they likely won't totally freak like they would if you drew. Of the other .1%, they might initiate a fight with you. If so, you are ready. Your hand is on or almost on your weapon (my thumb break would have been unsnapped long since, at the moment I thought I was being shadowed) and you can pivot to cover your girl and address the threat. Hopefully you will, at the least, soak up any lead intended for her and stop the threat. Best case, you stop the threat and neither of you is injured. Of course, if she carries, you can fight as a team.
'Merica: Back to back World War Champs
Ben Towe is offline  

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:12 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2017 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent:
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.09522 seconds with 9 queries