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Old January 26, 2014, 02:32 PM   #22
FrankenMauser
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Join Date: August 25, 2008
Location: In the valley above the plain
Posts: 13,424
Quote:
Couldn't agree with steveNChunter more. Didn't winchester initially lose a lawsuit to Mauser over the model 70? And had to pay Mauser rights for the design.
During WWI, the United States actually had to pay royalties to Mauser, for every Springfield we produced. The funds, however, were held in trust until after the war.


Quote:
The 7X57 was the first rimless cartridge with the . 473 rim diameter , Which is common to way more cartridges than steveNChunter listed . The 30-06 was probably the first one , so all it's offspring should be on that list too . Which should also list the .308 and all it's offspring .
When you get into cartridge lineage, things get really complicated, really quickly. And, most of the common knowledge "facts" are usually incorrect, or only partially correct.

For example, the United States' first official cartridge based on the Mauser dimensions was .30-03. The .30-06 came a few years later (shorter neck and case length, and intended to use a different spitzer bullet). And, contrary to popular belief, .270 Win, .280 Rem, and .35 Whelen are based on .30-03 - not .30-06.

The same goes for .308 Winchester/7.62x51mm. Although it's easy to say it's a shortened .30-06, it's actually a "stretched" .300 Savage. The .300 Savage, of course, was its own development, also based on the 7x57mm case (rather than .30-03 or .30-06).

No matter what you look at....
Most people, even P.P. Mauser, agree that modern bottleneck cartridge design all started with the French () and their 11mm Gras.
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Last edited by FrankenMauser; January 27, 2014 at 04:44 PM. Reason: Cartridge name typo...
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