The Firing Line Forums - View Single Post - (TX) Man shoots boy he said was stealing his chickens

kjm · April 22, 2001, 12:59 AM

Elizabeth Peterson:
Smoked pot as a teen? Yes.
Stayed out too late? Yes.
Drank too much and drove as a teen? Yes.
Cheated on my tax forms? No.
Carry concealed without a permit? All the time.

Just how do those actions deprive anyone of LIFE, LIBERTY, or PROPERTY? HOW? Oh you'll say the driving after drinking COULD have killed someone, but in actuallity, it didn't. If I had killed someone in Texas while drunk, I GUARANTEE YOU, I'd be looking at parole in maybe 10 more years (and the last time I did that I was a teenager.

I didn't get caught in the backyards of people stealing property. I make it a habit of breaking at least a few laws every day. NEVER DO I DEPRIVE ANOTHER HUMAN BEING OF LIFE LIBERTY OR PROPERTY. If I should, then being a resident of Texas, then I suspect that I'm playing with my life. That is simply a fact. It ain't that the boy was breaking the law, 'cause I expect any teenager with half a conscience and a brain to break the law. The law can be flat wrong. Sometimes good law can be applied badly. Do we get rid of the law because of the exception to the rule? If so, I'm happy to see that you're not running for the Texas Legislature.

As for a cop shooting the criminal for stealing? While I wouldn't support it as whole-heartedly, I would use only one criteria sitting on the Grand Jury or Jury: IF the Felon (caught in the act) wasn't stealing and trespassing at night would he have been shot by the cop? Since the only answer is no, I must also No-bill the cop who shot the felon (caught in the act), as the felon took his life in his own hands when he decided to deprive another person of life, liberty or property.

Mike Irwin:
You claim that we're playing into the hands of the anti-gunners, but in reality YOU are playing into their hands. My arguement is based on principles. There aren't degrees of principles. If you don't want to offend Sara Brady or Rosie O'Donnell, that is your business. I personally don't give to hoots about their opinions. My arguement is still the same. Your right to protect your property in Texas (especially after dark) is absolute. Should he have chased down the perps and then beat them? What if the 12 year old was a short and skinny 21 year old with a knife or gun? Is it unusual to expect someone who is stealing your property and possibly your livelyhood might also be armed or is it only the good guys who have guns?

I don't criticize the Arabs for their harsh, unforgiving and even brutal consequences for theft, murder and rape. I don't criticize the Malaysians or the good folks in Singapore for their tough laws either. It works for them and keeps honest folk honest. Texas may have some tough laws, but then, we just don't care much for theives or murderers, and we don't expect homeowners to get shot trying to ID the perps, guess their age, or otherwise put themselves in jeopardy when trying to protect their lives or property. You do. That is the difference between you and I, and that just wont change.

It was dark. They were on his property stealing his livestock. No matter how deranged you think I am, I am still on the side of the homeowner, and that will NEVER change. If you folks would like to suck up to HCI and curb your behavior and refrain from exercising legal rights in order to not offend those types of folks, then more power to ya. I choose to exercise my rights as being absolute. I'm sorry you feel that is base, coarse, or otherwise wrong-headed. I live in Texas. You do not. You may KMTA too!

[Edited by kjm on 04-22-2001 at 02:30 AM]

April 22, 2001, 12:59 AM	#75
kjm Senior Member Join Date: December 24, 1999 Location: College Station, Texas Posts: 1,871	Elizabeth Peterson: Smoked pot as a teen? Yes. Stayed out too late? Yes. Drank too much and drove as a teen? Yes. Cheated on my tax forms? No. Carry concealed without a permit? All the time. Just how do those actions deprive anyone of LIFE, LIBERTY, or PROPERTY? HOW? Oh you'll say the driving after drinking COULD have killed someone, but in actuallity, it didn't. If I had killed someone in Texas while drunk, I GUARANTEE YOU, I'd be looking at parole in maybe 10 more years (and the last time I did that I was a teenager. I didn't get caught in the backyards of people stealing property. I make it a habit of breaking at least a few laws every day. NEVER DO I DEPRIVE ANOTHER HUMAN BEING OF LIFE LIBERTY OR PROPERTY. If I should, then being a resident of Texas, then I suspect that I'm playing with my life. That is simply a fact. It ain't that the boy was breaking the law, 'cause I expect any teenager with half a conscience and a brain to break the law. The law can be flat wrong. Sometimes good law can be applied badly. Do we get rid of the law because of the exception to the rule? If so, I'm happy to see that you're not running for the Texas Legislature. As for a cop shooting the criminal for stealing? While I wouldn't support it as whole-heartedly, I would use only one criteria sitting on the Grand Jury or Jury: IF the Felon (caught in the act) wasn't stealing and trespassing at night would he have been shot by the cop? Since the only answer is no, I must also No-bill the cop who shot the felon (caught in the act), as the felon took his life in his own hands when he decided to deprive another person of life, liberty or property. Mike Irwin: You claim that we're playing into the hands of the anti-gunners, but in reality YOU are playing into their hands. My arguement is based on principles. There aren't degrees of principles. If you don't want to offend Sara Brady or Rosie O'Donnell, that is your business. I personally don't give to hoots about their opinions. My arguement is still the same. Your right to protect your property in Texas (especially after dark) is absolute. Should he have chased down the perps and then beat them? What if the 12 year old was a short and skinny 21 year old with a knife or gun? Is it unusual to expect someone who is stealing your property and possibly your livelyhood might also be armed or is it only the good guys who have guns? I don't criticize the Arabs for their harsh, unforgiving and even brutal consequences for theft, murder and rape. I don't criticize the Malaysians or the good folks in Singapore for their tough laws either. It works for them and keeps honest folk honest. Texas may have some tough laws, but then, we just don't care much for theives or murderers, and we don't expect homeowners to get shot trying to ID the perps, guess their age, or otherwise put themselves in jeopardy when trying to protect their lives or property. You do. That is the difference between you and I, and that just wont change. It was dark. They were on his property stealing his livestock. No matter how deranged you think I am, I am still on the side of the homeowner, and that will NEVER change. If you folks would like to suck up to HCI and curb your behavior and refrain from exercising legal rights in order to not offend those types of folks, then more power to ya. I choose to exercise my rights as being absolute. I'm sorry you feel that is base, coarse, or otherwise wrong-headed. I live in Texas. You do not. You may KMTA too! [Edited by kjm on 04-22-2001 at 02:30 AM]