The Firing Line Forums - View Single Post - Foot-pounds of a good punch?

ICBentley · December 10, 2001, 02:42 AM

I would figure the force of a punch (not energy) not by what you put into it, but by what is taken out by the strike (i.e. what is actually delivered). With your best blow (assuming your hand is perfectly elastic (i.e. all the force is delivered none dissipated in your hand) how fast can you make a 1Kg (perfectly elastic, stationary) mass go in a frictionless environment devoid of other factors. This would be difficult to estimate. It is even more difficult to decide what, if anything, it means.

However, impact (or impulse = force X time) and the area over which it is spread are more important than energy or force alone, though related. The impact applied to the tissues struck and the vulnerability of those tissues to that impact seem to be important factors in strike efficacy.

I participated in a physics of martial arts email list for a time. I quit when it became apparent that: the physical quantities involved are very difficult to measure, the physical systems involved are exceedingly complex, too many assumptions were needed to reach any difinitive appearing answers, physiology and psychology are too important for physics alone to yeild answers a fighter can actually use.

For example all of these may stop a fight in one blow: high force blow to the correct part of the head (you want high leverage against limited muscular strength), moderate force blow to the nose causing reflex eye closure, mild to moderate force blow in the right direction to the knee, low to moderate force to the proper areas of the throat. One could go on, but the point is that the art of getting the right blow to the right target at the right time is what is useful.

Overgeneralizing to emphasize the point, Boxing is an art which involves high force blows to limited targets, Taiji (as a fighting art) involves multiple lower force blows to a higher number of highly selected targets of physiologic import. Both work. The art is more important than the physics as each was developed by experiment in the real world which involves systems of such high complexity that they defy rigorous analysis (too many variables).

Learn your art. When martial artists talk about science they are often full of bulltwinkies. When good martial artists talk of fighting they more often know whereof they speak.

Bentley

"There is more truth in one sword than in 10,000 words.."
-The Koran

December 10, 2001, 02:42 AM	#13
ICBentley Senior Member Join Date: May 12, 2000 Location: U.S.A. Posts: 169	I would figure the force of a punch (not energy) not by what you put into it, but by what is taken out by the strike (i.e. what is actually delivered). With your best blow (assuming your hand is perfectly elastic (i.e. all the force is delivered none dissipated in your hand) how fast can you make a 1Kg (perfectly elastic, stationary) mass go in a frictionless environment devoid of other factors. This would be difficult to estimate. It is even more difficult to decide what, if anything, it means. However, impact (or impulse = force X time) and the area over which it is spread are more important than energy or force alone, though related. The impact applied to the tissues struck and the vulnerability of those tissues to that impact seem to be important factors in strike efficacy. I participated in a physics of martial arts email list for a time. I quit when it became apparent that: the physical quantities involved are very difficult to measure, the physical systems involved are exceedingly complex, too many assumptions were needed to reach any difinitive appearing answers, physiology and psychology are too important for physics alone to yeild answers a fighter can actually use. For example all of these may stop a fight in one blow: high force blow to the correct part of the head (you want high leverage against limited muscular strength), moderate force blow to the nose causing reflex eye closure, mild to moderate force blow in the right direction to the knee, low to moderate force to the proper areas of the throat. One could go on, but the point is that the art of getting the right blow to the right target at the right time is what is useful. Overgeneralizing to emphasize the point, Boxing is an art which involves high force blows to limited targets, Taiji (as a fighting art) involves multiple lower force blows to a higher number of highly selected targets of physiologic import. Both work. The art is more important than the physics as each was developed by experiment in the real world which involves systems of such high complexity that they defy rigorous analysis (too many variables). Learn your art. When martial artists talk about science they are often full of bulltwinkies. When good martial artists talk of fighting they more often know whereof they speak. Bentley "There is more truth in one sword than in 10,000 words.." -The Koran