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Old September 8, 2021, 10:54 PM   #14
Screwball
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 16, 2012
Location: ME
Posts: 719
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aguila Blanca View Post
You're missing the point.
Bud, in all fairness… I don’t even know what point you want to make.

You quoted something specifically discussing how ME carry (permit or permit-less) has no effect on USC… then after I reply, argue that it has no effect on it. [insert Captain Obvious meme] I specifically made reference to exemptions to that specific statute for that very reason, to show how it would need to be interpreted for it to work IN a Federal building (and as it also states, if it is incidental to hunting… which is part of the same exception in that USC).

Sorry, but I deal with people that “know” the law everyday. People who tell me I can’t ask X, or I have no justification questioning how much money they are traveling with (actually, I do). Best are Canadian truck drivers telling me it is their right to transport goods in the US… nope, their privilege as a visitor to this country. If you want to argue what a part of a building is, I’m going to say go talk with an engineer about it. Because I, and more importantly my superiors, view it as part of the facility… and my duties are carried out at that location. Meets the definition in the eyes of my agency. I’ll probably look to see if there are any other regulations/codes on those signs, but I know 18 USC §930 is definitely on them. Most of the CFR we use are directly related to Customs (19) and Immigration (8), which I don’t believe have regulations related to that… but I can’t say for sure, off the top of my head.

Whatever you want to tell yourself, it is fine with me. We live in America, and are allowed to have disagreeing opinions. If I’m conducting an inspection, and you declare a firearm on your person, I’ll handle it the exact same way that I have. There are officers that will pull you out of the car, cuff you, and then deal with it… and with our UOF policy, it is actually allowed (officer safety… not going to win favor with a lot of people, but all I will say is that it is officer discretion, minus NCIC matches; we have to cuff those). As long as you aren’t a felon (I’m figuring you aren’t, not just being a part of this forum but that 95% of travelers encountered are not… however that’s what NCIC is for) and the gun isn’t stolen (also NCIC)… you’ll have it back after our inspection process is complete and can reload/reholster once you leave.

If you have a problem with it, I can give you a comment card afterwards and you can bring it up to OPR at your convenience. We also have a complaint page on our website, if you lose said card. Name is on our uniform/jacket/vest.

Keep in mind, if you are sitting in front of me… you entered Canada with a firearm. If you got to Canadian Customs, they asked… removed your gun, unloaded it, put it inside a yellow gun locker, and we will open it for you when you get to us (same checks will be carried out; it isn’t that exciting, because it happens very frequently… like I’ve ran lockers back to Canada because they sent them all over within two hours).

If you didn’t get to Canadian Customs… you went about 75 yards into Canada to make that U-turn. Mention that if you want to say we also violated your 4th Amendment rights… being you had nexus with the international boundary. Border search authority… which is also our grounds for confirming the firearm isn’t stolen and you aren’t a felon.

And for every person with a firearm that I interacted with (well over 100 by now), I do explain that process to them. Why we do it, and that I appreciate their patience during our inspection process. I’ve yet to have one person complain or even say anything remotely negative about it.

I was going to quote your statement about it being the definition of the law and not your definition. As you said, words have meanings… like when I state “per your own quoted definition,” I specifically mean the definition that you quoted. But… I lost ambition with copy and paste on my iPhone.

All that being said, I truly mean zero disrespect directed towards you, Aguila Blanca. I get that political/interpretation of law is a hot debate… hell, if you haven’t seen the hour long saga on YouTube that one of our heads down in Portland had with a First Amendment auditor… there is a lot of buttons being pushed in our occupation (internally in the aftermarket of that). If I came off hostile towards you, I’ll apologize for that. Was not my intention.

That being said, I also don’t think there will be much positive coming out of this thread if we both continue the back and forth. If you do find any case law specific to ports of entry and “Federal facilities,” I’d be interested to take a look. I don’t say that government has never made a mistake… so if there is an opinion that differs from our policy, I’d definitely be open to give it a read. But usually if there is, the agency disseminates it somewhat quickly for obvious reasons.
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