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tipoc · June 18, 2018, 10:49 PM

Colt came to Browning in 1896 or so and asked him to begin designing a semi-automatic pistol for the U.S. Military. It was clear by then that the major powers of Europe were done with revolvers and moving to semi-automatic pistols.

The Europeans had moved first in seeing the advantages in smokeless powder and in semi-automatic pistols. There was Borchardt C93 pistol in the 30 Borchardt round (85 grains at 1280 fps more or less). The Mauser C96 in 30 Mauser and others. The 9mm was introduced in Georg Luger's gun about 1902 after the German Army complained of the lack of shocking power in the lighter 30 Luger.

Browning and Colt introduced the Model of 1900 and sent it to the U.S. Army. They followed this up with an improved Military Model of 1902 as well. The guns were chambered in a new round, 38 acp. It was introduced about 1897. It moved a 130 gr. pill at between 1200-1300 fps from a 6" barrel. Browning and Colt were not all in on the new smokeless powder and Browning brought out the case as a semi rim. So the case was long. Longer than what was being used in Europe which he was well aware of. He also designed the round to work at a lower pressure than the lighter rounds being used in Europe for semi-autos. Remember it was 1896 and no one was using a pistol round over 100 grains.

http://www.coltautos.com/1900.htm

But...the guns were not strong enough for that velocity and power. So a lower power of about 1050 fps was settled on for those pistols. If you study the construction of those early guns you can see why.

Meanwhile about 1905 the U.S. military told Colt that they wanted a new gun in 45 caliber and not in 38 caliber which they believed lacked sufficient stopping power. So Browning adapted the design he had for a new 45 caliber round, the 45 acp and a gun to go with it. The case was the same overall length as the 38 acp. After more trials and changes it became the 1911.

Meanwhile sales of the guns chambered in 38 acp fell. So in the late 1920s Colt decided to chamber the 38 acp in the 1911.

They named the gun the Super 38 They announced it was chambered in 38 acp. The 1911 was a much stronger gun than the earlier Browning pistols in 38acp. The velocity and pressure of the 38 acp was kicked up some for the 1911. Colt let the earlier guns die on the vine. It wasn't until some years later that manufacturers began to call the 38 acp. the 38 Super.

The diameter of the 38 acp and 38 Super is .358. For 38 Special/357 Magnum it is .357. In recent years manufacturers use the barrel diameter for the 38 Super as for the 9mm, .355, saves them money.

Until after the second world war few guns in 9mm were imported into the U.S. The BHP was never imported in any numbers at all till well after the war.

The first American made gun to be chambered in 9mm was the Colt Commander with an alloy frame introduced in 1948-49. It sold very well in 45 acp and 38 Super. It did not sell as well in 9mm.

The next 9mm gun made in U.S. by an was by S&W in 1954.

June 18, 2018, 10:49 PM	#50
tipoc Senior Member Join Date: December 11, 2004 Location: Redwood City, Ca. Posts: 4,114	Colt came to Browning in 1896 or so and asked him to begin designing a semi-automatic pistol for the U.S. Military. It was clear by then that the major powers of Europe were done with revolvers and moving to semi-automatic pistols. The Europeans had moved first in seeing the advantages in smokeless powder and in semi-automatic pistols. There was Borchardt C93 pistol in the 30 Borchardt round (85 grains at 1280 fps more or less). The Mauser C96 in 30 Mauser and others. The 9mm was introduced in Georg Luger's gun about 1902 after the German Army complained of the lack of shocking power in the lighter 30 Luger. Browning and Colt introduced the Model of 1900 and sent it to the U.S. Army. They followed this up with an improved Military Model of 1902 as well. The guns were chambered in a new round, 38 acp. It was introduced about 1897. It moved a 130 gr. pill at between 1200-1300 fps from a 6" barrel. Browning and Colt were not all in on the new smokeless powder and Browning brought out the case as a semi rim. So the case was long. Longer than what was being used in Europe which he was well aware of. He also designed the round to work at a lower pressure than the lighter rounds being used in Europe for semi-autos. Remember it was 1896 and no one was using a pistol round over 100 grains. http://www.coltautos.com/1900.htm But...the guns were not strong enough for that velocity and power. So a lower power of about 1050 fps was settled on for those pistols. If you study the construction of those early guns you can see why. Meanwhile about 1905 the U.S. military told Colt that they wanted a new gun in 45 caliber and not in 38 caliber which they believed lacked sufficient stopping power. So Browning adapted the design he had for a new 45 caliber round, the 45 acp and a gun to go with it. The case was the same overall length as the 38 acp. After more trials and changes it became the 1911. Meanwhile sales of the guns chambered in 38 acp fell. So in the late 1920s Colt decided to chamber the 38 acp in the 1911. They named the gun the Super 38 They announced it was chambered in 38 acp. The 1911 was a much stronger gun than the earlier Browning pistols in 38acp. The velocity and pressure of the 38 acp was kicked up some for the 1911. Colt let the earlier guns die on the vine. It wasn't until some years later that manufacturers began to call the 38 acp. the 38 Super. The diameter of the 38 acp and 38 Super is .358. For 38 Special/357 Magnum it is .357. In recent years manufacturers use the barrel diameter for the 38 Super as for the 9mm, .355, saves them money. Until after the second world war few guns in 9mm were imported into the U.S. The BHP was never imported in any numbers at all till well after the war. The first American made gun to be chambered in 9mm was the Colt Commander with an alloy frame introduced in 1948-49. It sold very well in 45 acp and 38 Super. It did not sell as well in 9mm. The next 9mm gun made in U.S. by an was by S&W in 1954. __________________ 1. All guns are always loaded. 2. Never let the muzzle cover anything you are not willing to destroy. 3. Keep your finger off the trigger till you are ready to shoot. 4. Identify your target and know what is beyond it.