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tipoc · July 16, 2018, 02:20 PM

Until a couple of years ago Fiocchi continued to sell 38acp ammo named as such. and the small fry continue to make it.

In the pics above the Remington 38 Colt Pistol ammo is from the late 1970s and is not, by far, the last of it they made.

Also keep in mind that a good deal of current ammo is still loaded to the 38 acp velocities.

https://www.grafs.com/catalog/product/productId/11948

http://www.ammo-one.com/38APCAuto.html

https://www.buffaloarms.com/38-auto-...f-50-amo38auto

https://www.loadxammo.com/retailcat.pdf

Recall the discussion about velocity and pressure for the 38 ACP and the 38 Super. The case is identical. The difference is the powder charge and the velocity of the bullet. The 1911 is a stronger gun than the Colt 1902 Military, etc. It could handle the additional pressure of a more powerful load.

According to Doug Sheldon (and some other sources) , the initial 1900 specs for the Colt M1900 called for a 130 gr. bullet and a velocity from the 6" barrel of 1260 fps. Throughout this first part of the 38 acp's life manufacturers listed the velocity as from 1160 to 1280 fps with the same 130 gr. bullet. Nothing wrong the ammo but the early Colt pistols were weaker than the 1911.

The Thompson LaGarde reports of 1904 listed the velocity from the 6" barrel of the 1902 Military with a 130 gr. pill as 1107 fps. (In the same tests a Luger was shot with a 123.5 gr. bullet from a 4" barrel and did 1048 fps.) So the listed velocities from manufacturers and Colt ad-men may have been a touch optimistic.

In 1929 Colt chambered the 1911 in the 38 acp and named the gun the Colt Super 38. The ballistics did not change and Colt called the ammo the 38acp and advertised the gun as being chambered in 38 acp.

In late 1932 Remington produced a round that pushed a 130 gr. bullet to 1300 fps. from a 5" barrel so they advertised. Some other manufacturers followed suit. It's unclear but a few years later ammo companies began to label the higher pressure loads "for 38 Super autos only" and similar as complaints came in that the older 38 acp guns were being damaged by the higher pressure loads. In the pre-war years some companies apparently began using nickel plated cases for the higher pressure loads to distinguish them from the loads for the older pistols. It was most likely in the late pre-war period that ammo manufacturers began to name loads for the 38 acp as 38 acp and loads for the 1911s as 38 Super. It became more common to do so.

Note in the pics that all the Winchester ammo boxes are from the 1980s and more recently. They have different names and ways to call the round from 38 Automatic through till 38 Super +P, but that they all have the same product code, X38ASHP.

tipoc

July 16, 2018, 02:20 PM	#89
tipoc Senior Member Join Date: December 11, 2004 Location: Redwood City, Ca. Posts: 4,114	Until a couple of years ago Fiocchi continued to sell 38acp ammo named as such. and the small fry continue to make it. In the pics above the Remington 38 Colt Pistol ammo is from the late 1970s and is not, by far, the last of it they made. Also keep in mind that a good deal of current ammo is still loaded to the 38 acp velocities. https://www.grafs.com/catalog/product/productId/11948 http://www.ammo-one.com/38APCAuto.html https://www.buffaloarms.com/38-auto-...f-50-amo38auto https://www.loadxammo.com/retailcat.pdf Recall the discussion about velocity and pressure for the 38 ACP and the 38 Super. The case is identical. The difference is the powder charge and the velocity of the bullet. The 1911 is a stronger gun than the Colt 1902 Military, etc. It could handle the additional pressure of a more powerful load. According to Doug Sheldon (and some other sources) , the initial 1900 specs for the Colt M1900 called for a 130 gr. bullet and a velocity from the 6" barrel of 1260 fps. Throughout this first part of the 38 acp's life manufacturers listed the velocity as from 1160 to 1280 fps with the same 130 gr. bullet. Nothing wrong the ammo but the early Colt pistols were weaker than the 1911. The Thompson LaGarde reports of 1904 listed the velocity from the 6" barrel of the 1902 Military with a 130 gr. pill as 1107 fps. (In the same tests a Luger was shot with a 123.5 gr. bullet from a 4" barrel and did 1048 fps.) So the listed velocities from manufacturers and Colt ad-men may have been a touch optimistic. In 1929 Colt chambered the 1911 in the 38 acp and named the gun the Colt Super 38. The ballistics did not change and Colt called the ammo the 38acp and advertised the gun as being chambered in 38 acp. In late 1932 Remington produced a round that pushed a 130 gr. bullet to 1300 fps. from a 5" barrel so they advertised. Some other manufacturers followed suit. It's unclear but a few years later ammo companies began to label the higher pressure loads "for 38 Super autos only" and similar as complaints came in that the older 38 acp guns were being damaged by the higher pressure loads. In the pre-war years some companies apparently began using nickel plated cases for the higher pressure loads to distinguish them from the loads for the older pistols. It was most likely in the late pre-war period that ammo manufacturers began to name loads for the 38 acp as 38 acp and loads for the 1911s as 38 Super. It became more common to do so. Note in the pics that all the Winchester ammo boxes are from the 1980s and more recently. They have different names and ways to call the round from 38 Automatic through till 38 Super +P, but that they all have the same product code, X38ASHP. tipoc __________________ 1. All guns are always loaded. 2. Never let the muzzle cover anything you are not willing to destroy. 3. Keep your finger off the trigger till you are ready to shoot. 4. Identify your target and know what is beyond it. Last edited by tipoc; July 16, 2018 at 02:30 PM.