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Old August 9, 2009, 01:09 AM   #144
Dr. Strangelove
Senior Member
 
Join Date: August 1, 2008
Location: Athens, GA
Posts: 1,436
Reading is your friend.

The Florida Department of Agriculture, which issues concealed carry permits in Florida has a lot of good info here:

http://licgweb.doacs.state.fl.us/wea...f_defense.html

I posted this link in this thread already, but I think it's important information, so here it is again. Please do read it. Here is the most relevant info for those who won't bother to click on the link:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Florida Dept. of AG website
Q. When can I use my handgun to protect myself?

A. Florida law justifies use of deadly force when you are:

Trying to protect yourself or another person from death or serious bodily harm;
Trying to prevent a forcible felony, such as rape, robbery, burglary or kidnapping.
Using or displaying a handgun in any other circumstances could result in your conviction for crimes such as improper exhibition of a firearm, manslaughter, or worse.

Example of the kind of attack that will not justify defending yourself with deadly force: Two neighbors got into a fight, and one of them tried to hit the other by swinging a garden hose. The neighbor who was being attacked with the hose shot the other in the chest. The court upheld his conviction for aggravated battery with a firearm, because an attack with a garden hose is not the kind of violent assault that justifies responding with deadly force.

Q. What if someone uses threatening language to me so that I am afraid for my life or safety?

A. Verbal threats are not enough to justify the use of deadly force. There must be an overt act by the person which indicates that he immediately intends to carry out the threat. The person threatened must reasonably believe that he will be killed or suffer serious bodily harm if he does not immediately take the life of his adversary.

Q. What if I point my handgun at someone but don't use it?

A. Never display a handgun to gain "leverage" in an argument. Threatening someone verbally while possessing a handgun, even licensed, will land you in jail for three years. Even if the gun is broken or you don't have bullets, you will receive the mandatory three-year sentence if convicted. The law does not allow any possibility of getting out of jail early.

Example: In a 1987 case, a woman refused to pay an automobile mechanic who she thought did a poor job repairing her car. They argued about it, and the mechanic removed the radiator hose from the car so she couldn't drive it away. She reached into her purse, pulled out an unloaded gun, and threatened to kill the mechanic if he touched her car again. The mechanic grabbed the gun and called the police.

The woman was convicted of aggravated assault with a firearm and sentenced to serve a mandatory three-year prison term. The fact that the gun was not loaded was irrelevant. Even though she was the mother of three dependent children and had no prior criminal record, the statute does not allow for parole. Her only recourse was to seek clemency from the Governor.
Here for your reading pleasure is the summary of that Florida State web page, cut and pasted. Bolds and underlines are mine to emphasize what is most relevant to our discussion.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Florida Dept of AG website
Summary

1. Never display a handgun to gain "leverage" in an argument, even if it isn't loaded or you never intend to use it

2. The amount of force that you use to defend yourself must not be excessive under the circumstances.

Never use deadly force in self-defense unless you are afraid that if you don't, you will be killed or seriously injured;
Verbal threats never justify your use of deadly force;
If you think someone has a weapon and will use it unless you kill him, be sure you are right and are not overreacting to the situation.
3. The law permits you to carry a concealed weapon for self-defense. Carrying a concealed weapon does not make you a free-lance policeman or a "good samaritan."

4. Never carry your concealed weapon into any place where the statute prohibits carrying it.

This is not a complete summary of all the statutes and court opinions on the use of deadly force. Because the concealed weapons statute specifies that concealed weapons are to be used for lawful self-defense, we have not attempted to summarize the body of law on lawful defense of property. This information is not intended as legal advice. Every self-defense case has its own unique set of facts, and it is unwise to try to predict how a particular case would be decided. It is clear, however, that the law protects people who keep their tempers under control and use deadly force only as a last resort.
The Florida law reads "reasonably believe" and that doesn't mean one can just say "Eeek. I'm scared. Bang." It means would a reasonable person in that situation have cause to believe they were in imminent peril of loss of life or great physical harm.

This incident never went to grand jury or trial, and we certainly won't be deciding it here on The Firing Line. I believe the lesson to be taken to heart here, no matter what our personal opinion of the actions taken in this specific situation, is that if a bunch of pro-gun folks on a web forum can't agree on a relatively simple issue (was the OP justified in drawing his pistol) what would have happened had this actually gone to trial with twelve strangers who may not be gun enthusiasts deciding the issue?

Learn the law. Follow the law. Don't depend on what you hear from a friend or see on a web forum. Or pay the consequences for breaking the law.

Last edited by Dr. Strangelove; August 9, 2009 at 01:17 AM.
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