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invention_45 · March 21, 2006, 10:03 AM

Scenario 2 is the only one I have a big issue with.

Do you routinely walk up and slug other people in the face? If not, why not?

I don't. For a lot of reasons. But one of them is that there is no way to know whether that slug will KILL them. It is possible. It has happened.

I therefore consider a slug in the face to be use of deadly force. While some may debate that, I also consider it evidence that I can't predict what might happen next (because I couldn't predict the slug). That puts me in fear for my life in any but the most obvious circumstance (small, wheelchair-bound slugger).

If I'm standing there and suddenly I get an out-of-the-blue slug in the face, I better not see ANY evidence that the attack is continuing.

There is a high probability that I will shoot somebody who slugs me in the face. I will NOT pull my gun to intimidate. I will NOT start slugging back. Both of these are ways to escalate from an unknown threat to my life to a definite threat to my life. Both of these can result in my gun being taken from me. Put those together and they are not good.

If it is EASILY possible, that is to say, if I KNOW I can successfully do so, I will retreat.

If I am with somebody I care about who cannot independently retreat, I will shoot.

I think this reaction will cost me $50,000, but I will not end up in jail.

Conversations with my lawyer suggest that there's a very bright line called "laying on of hands". Once that line is crossed, things change dramatically both civilly and criminally.

March 21, 2006, 10:03 AM	#8
invention_45 Senior Member Join Date: January 30, 2006 Location: Broward County Posts: 972	Scenario 2 is the only one I have a big issue with. Do you routinely walk up and slug other people in the face? If not, why not? I don't. For a lot of reasons. But one of them is that there is no way to know whether that slug will KILL them. It is possible. It has happened. I therefore consider a slug in the face to be use of deadly force. While some may debate that, I also consider it evidence that I can't predict what might happen next (because I couldn't predict the slug). That puts me in fear for my life in any but the most obvious circumstance (small, wheelchair-bound slugger). If I'm standing there and suddenly I get an out-of-the-blue slug in the face, I better not see ANY evidence that the attack is continuing. There is a high probability that I will shoot somebody who slugs me in the face. I will NOT pull my gun to intimidate. I will NOT start slugging back. Both of these are ways to escalate from an unknown threat to my life to a definite threat to my life. Both of these can result in my gun being taken from me. Put those together and they are not good. If it is EASILY possible, that is to say, if I KNOW I can successfully do so, I will retreat. If I am with somebody I care about who cannot independently retreat, I will shoot. I think this reaction will cost me $50,000, but I will not end up in jail. Conversations with my lawyer suggest that there's a very bright line called "laying on of hands". Once that line is crossed, things change dramatically both civilly and criminally.