The Firing Line Forums - View Single Post - Oklahoma pharmacist Jerome Ersland sentenced to life in prison

Alaska444 · July 17, 2011, 12:09 AM

Dear JohnKSa,

Why is the heat of passion manslaughter not a viable option? I understand that this man made quite a few lies about his past record that killed any chance of an affirmative defense, but the definition of heat of passion seams much better to me. I still have difficulty declaring premeditation in this circumstance. that is the argument that I can't accept, nor am I alone in this assessment. My brother's friend started the fight that ended in the other persons death and deliberately turned and stabbed the kid at the door when he couldn't beat him up. He got manslaughter in that case. If he was in OK, I suspect that they would have given him murder 1 under this definition.

As far as my car accident, when I did get to the point where I could speak, and I wasn't in shock from any injuries, just the situation and stress response, the first thing I said to the lady who came over to me, I asked her, "did I run a red light" because I was disoriented and completely at a loss to what had actually just happened. I simply didn't know nor could I remember what had just occurred a few seconds before.

Everyone reacts to physiologic stress in a different manner. Fortunately, the Lord gave me four witnesses at the scene who testified that the other guy was the one that ran the red light. If I had to depend on my own testimony to clear myself, I would have been in trouble since the creep did claim I ran the light not him in his sworn statement to the cops. He was declared at fault based on the witness testimony, once again, that the Lord for that since I would have been my own worst witness.

I simply cannot get past this being at most manslaughter. I believe if they gave the guy 5 years in the tank that would be a reasonable decision, but I don't get the life sentence myself. Was it a bad shoot, absolutely. Was it murder 1 with malice and forethought? I can't go that far despite how bad the video looks.

In any case, I don't think anyone is going to change the other's mind. Thank you for the excellent discussion and I hope and pray none of us ever have to use our CCW to defend ourself or our family. I truly believe that many decisions made in court rooms are based on impressions and suppositions instead of facts and that places all of us at risk. If nothing else, this is an example of what not to do from many different points of view and I am sure this case will be a part of just about all of the upcoming CCW classes around the nation as it should be.

July 17, 2011, 12:09 AM	#244
Alaska444 Junior member Join Date: April 3, 2010 Posts: 1,231	Dear JohnKSa, Why is the heat of passion manslaughter not a viable option? I understand that this man made quite a few lies about his past record that killed any chance of an affirmative defense, but the definition of heat of passion seams much better to me. I still have difficulty declaring premeditation in this circumstance. that is the argument that I can't accept, nor am I alone in this assessment. My brother's friend started the fight that ended in the other persons death and deliberately turned and stabbed the kid at the door when he couldn't beat him up. He got manslaughter in that case. If he was in OK, I suspect that they would have given him murder 1 under this definition. As far as my car accident, when I did get to the point where I could speak, and I wasn't in shock from any injuries, just the situation and stress response, the first thing I said to the lady who came over to me, I asked her, "did I run a red light" because I was disoriented and completely at a loss to what had actually just happened. I simply didn't know nor could I remember what had just occurred a few seconds before. Everyone reacts to physiologic stress in a different manner. Fortunately, the Lord gave me four witnesses at the scene who testified that the other guy was the one that ran the red light. If I had to depend on my own testimony to clear myself, I would have been in trouble since the creep did claim I ran the light not him in his sworn statement to the cops. He was declared at fault based on the witness testimony, once again, that the Lord for that since I would have been my own worst witness. I simply cannot get past this being at most manslaughter. I believe if they gave the guy 5 years in the tank that would be a reasonable decision, but I don't get the life sentence myself. Was it a bad shoot, absolutely. Was it murder 1 with malice and forethought? I can't go that far despite how bad the video looks. In any case, I don't think anyone is going to change the other's mind. Thank you for the excellent discussion and I hope and pray none of us ever have to use our CCW to defend ourself or our family. I truly believe that many decisions made in court rooms are based on impressions and suppositions instead of facts and that places all of us at risk. If nothing else, this is an example of what not to do from many different points of view and I am sure this case will be a part of just about all of the upcoming CCW classes around the nation as it should be.