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Old May 12, 2013, 12:34 PM   #24
Double Naught Spy
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Join Date: January 8, 2001
Location: Forestburg, Montague Cnty, TX
Posts: 11,537
Personally, I would not choose the word critical. There were obvious mistakes made that police themselves are sure to point out to future trainees or as a review into the shooting.
I would and did use the word "critical" in specific reference to not checking the cars and for specific reasons as out stated. Yes, there were mistakes, but there is a combination of issues at hand. It is am impossibility to clear all spaces all the time and still proceed while at the same time dealing with a known suspect.

Did the cops appear to have tunnel vision. Yep, but also had a perceived threat with which to deal. That brings up a serious logistical issue as to whether you ignore the perceived threat and check for other threats or not. Somebody should have been looking around, but officers 1 and 2 were fixated on the threat. That is why I commented that I thought officer #3 who wasn't handling the threat should have been looking around and wasn't.

During the gun fight, none of the officers are checking their sixes. Mistake or necessary risk. At about 7:20 in the video, the shooting is over (for the time being and as it turned out, for good) and the suspect originally approached by the cops is being ordered to an awaiting officer who is out in the open. Mistake or necessary risk? The officers who arrive in squad cars do not stop and clear the area before proceeding. The just out of their cars and run with tunnel vision to a new area of safety behind vehicles in the street. It doesn't even appear that they all have their guns drawn before exiting their vehicles as at least one appears to be drawing his gun as he runs and one who runs behind and between the vehicles in the street appears to be empty handed. Mistakes or necessary risks?

Did anyone notice that it took backup 6 1/2 minutes to get there!
Yep, three posts above yours.

I believe this was anything but a "knock and talk". There's no reason for multiple unmarked cars to converge quickly unless it was some type of bust or arrest attempt. My guess is the department labeled this as such rather than admit this was a poorly executed bust.

Given the number of vehicles in the drive way, these guys are extremely fortunate that no one else joined in the fight from another vehicle or the house.
Or the trees, roof, houses across the street. You really can't secure everywhere all the time.

Second, he steps right into the open in front of the shooter as the shooting starts.
He steps in front of the shooter? LOL! He corners the tree in order to have a shot at the threat from the car. The officer closes to the street does the same thing in the opposite direction, forcing the guy behind the tree to deal with threats from multiple and widely spaced directions. In short, the officers catch the perp in a cross fire where the perp is then exceptionally limited in the directions he can move and is shot multiple times in the process.

He should also be reprimanded for his inability to control his weapon. The two shots at the ground, one of them while he was tuned the other direction were a danger to everyone.
Yeah, I don't know what he was thinking. He had only been shot 3 times in the gut at that point and probably realized his ability to fight was rapidly declining and so was firing hail Mary shots just to try to get the guy to stop shooting him anymore. I agree that he should not have been pulling the trigger, but I seriously doubt anybody will reprimand him for firing at that point.

Another 20 degrees and he would have sent that round towards the officer on the left.
But it didn't go that way so complaining about it is moot.

I noticed that that the first car to arrive, the white one that backed out of a spot on the other side of the street, appeared to have a line of sight to the BMW while the first man was getting into it. Perhaps the angle isn't what it appears to be, but how did they not see him coming out of the house before they approached it?
I don't think the angle is good from the driver's side of the white car plus there are multiple trees and branches, along with the BMW that all help block the view. Even if a decent view, he may not have had eye on that spot at the time. We don't know what job the officer in the white car was tasked with doing and in what direction.
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