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Old January 29, 2013, 08:28 AM   #25
Mike Irwin
Join Date: April 13, 2000
Location: Northern Virginia
Posts: 39,218
"We don't call 1911s "pre-Model 1911A1s" just as we don't call a Gen 1 Glock a "pre Gen 4". Same as we don't call all planes that aren't 767s "non 767s". This is because it actually makes a difference in the history of the gun and of firearms.

Wow. That's a monumental failure of an example.

1911 was the OFFICIAL US MILITARY designation for that particular model.

1911A1 was the OFFICIAL US MILITARY designation for that particular model.

Come on... I think you're bright enough to recognize that "pre-Model 10" is NOT an official designation from the factory or any governmental agency.

It is exactly what I said it was -- a convenient, collective way of identifying a group of guns, the exact same way that the term Victory Model is used.

Oh, by the way, Victory Model was NEVER an official S&W or Government designation, so by your apparent logic it is absolute anathma and should never, never, never ever be used, right?

"The "pre model 10" designation is a bit controversial with some S&W collectors... A lot of shooters may not know or care but you can bet such differences do matter over to the Colt Forums, the S&W forum, Ruger forum, Sig and Glock forums, etc.

Wait, now I'm really confused... Are you saying that some collectors USE the term pre-Model 10, while others do not, and there's controversy about it? How could there be controversy about it (and why would there be controversy in the Ruger forums? Who cares what they think?) IF it wasn't used.

But I thought you've been taking the line that no one uses it. So you're saying that some DO use it?

So, Yes? No? Yes? No? No? Yes? Yes? Maybe?

Ok, time for you to face some simple facts...

1. Is Pre-Model 10 an official factory designation? No. We've established that.

2. Is pre-Model 10 used as an identifer, even by some well respected members of the S&W collecting community? Yes.

3. Given 1 combined with 2, we're left with the simple fact that no one has, or can exercise, absolute the authority to say "yes, that's right," or "No, that's wrong."

"If you, or someone else, were to argue that only the post war, short-action M&Ps made between 1946 and 1957 are pre-Model 10s, then you may have a firmer argument."

That is exactly what a pre model 10 is.

I love it when the fish gobbles down the bait...

How can it be a pre-Model 10? That was never an official factory designation, so based on your strident absolutism, that phrase is verboten and those guns made between 1946 and 1957 can only be Military and Police Hand Ejectors...

Tsk tsk tsk...
"The gift which I am sending you is called a dog, and is in fact the most precious and valuable possession of mankind" -Theodorus Gaza

Baby Jesus cries when the fat redneck doesn't have military-grade firepower.

Last edited by Mike Irwin; January 29, 2013 at 08:43 AM.
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