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Old September 15, 2011, 03:48 AM   #85
Bill Akins
Senior Member
Join Date: August 28, 2007
Location: Hudson, Florida
Posts: 1,130
Blue Train wrote:
You would have to have a system to engage the charger (let's call it a charger) when the gun is loaded.
Absolutely Blue Train. If by the "charger" you mean the same as the harmonica block....absolutely you would have to have a system to engage it in the receiver so it could be fed through the receiver as it fired.

Blue Train wrote:
If this beast is to be semi-automatic, I'd say that some major redesign of the moving parts might be in order. Civil War period weapons were not expected to be operated at high speed, and neither were the early cartridge revolvers. Ask anyone who's done a lot of fanning with their Single Action Army. It's more a question of design than anything else.
You're absolutely right Blue Train. It is a question of design more than anything else. With the semi-auto revolver concept, that design has to be slowed down to avoid breakage of parts and for the system to operate properly. With the tripod mounted harmonica gun, whether hand cranked or gas operated, it is all about the geared design to draw the harmonica block through the receiver.

Blue Train wrote:
But don't give up hope. There is always something appealing about things like this and the gun world is full of them, even though most of them only seem that way at the distance of 75 or 100 years, like for example, a pistol with a fixed magazine charged with stripper clips. Seen one of them lately?
Yes I have and I used to own one. The Steyr Hahn fixed mag, stripper clip loaded model 1912, delayed blowback pistol. I referenced the Steyr hahn in my earlier posts in this thread concerning slowing down the operation of my muzzleloading semi-auto revolver concept, as an excellent example of a system that on the Steyr uses angled lugs on the barrel with corresponding angled slots in the slide, to slow down and delay the system so it can operate effectively. Just like the angled slots on a Webley Fosbery style cylinder on my muzzleloading semi-auto revolver concept would do.....

Blue Train wrote:
Seeing the photos from the movie, if that's what it was, it suggests to me that the idea is a natural for a slide-action (pump action) rifle. You could utilize the harmonica charger, keep it at five or six rounds and it's a natural for primative hunting, right up there with a slur bow. Remember, someone invented a repeating crossbow in time to be used in the Russo-Japanese war, only I don't remember which side tried it out.
If you're speaking of the brass frame, Captain Nemo designed (supposedly) harmonica rifles, yes they were from the 2005 movie "Mysterious Island".
It's not a semi-auto or full auto concept, but nonetheless an excellent idea you have on the slide action Blue Train. The fore end slides moves back, has a straight gear track in it that turns a round gear that acts upon the other straight gear track on the harmonica block, which advances the harmonica block to the next chamber. Good idea and much faster than having to take one hand off the weapon to turn a rotating trigger guard crank to advance the harmonica block/"charger" to the next chamber like was done in the 2005 Mysterious Island movie rifles. I like your idea. Good thinking!

Funny you should mention the repeating crossbow. I was just today talking with my dive buddy and partner in some of my gun projects about utilizing the repeating magazine concept of the repeating crossbow applied to an underwater spear gun that omitted the bow and string (too much water resistance) but still utilized the lever concept to pull back the rubber bands and utilized the multiple spear repeating magazine concept too. Only I envisioned it with the ability to reload multiple spears quickly, but not fire the spears automatically at the end of the lever travel. Instead it would reload only and have a regular trigger. Here's pictures of the Manchurian repeating crossbow design that inspired me to that underwater spear gun idea. The ancient Romans had a similar design as well as another one that used an Archimedean screw groove to rotate a bolt/spear into position. Almost like the angled archimedean screw grooves in a rotary Ruger 10/22 magazine.

Ancient martial weapons are amazing aren't they? Both mechanical ballista style and black powder style. Principles used thousands of years ago in a rotary magazine for a repeating Roman crossbow being used today in firearm magazines. Never ceases to amaze me. Except for the addition of gun powder, not too much new under the sun from ancient concepts. We can learn a lot from studying them.

and an excellent link to videos of repeating crossbows and how to build them.....

(My apologies to admin for temporarily deviating with crossbows from black powder subjects )

Good analyzing on the subject of this thread and great ideas on the manual slide action for advancing the harmonica block/"charger" Blue Train. Thanks and keep those ideas coming!

"This is my Remy and this is my Colt. Remy loads easy and topstrap strong, Colt balances better and never feels wrong. A repro black powder revolver gun, they smoke and shoot lead and give me much fun. I can't figure out which one I like better, they're both fine revolvers that fit in my leather".
"To be sure of hitting the target, shoot first and call whatever you hit the target".

Last edited by Bill Akins; September 15, 2011 at 05:08 AM.
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