View Full Version : Does this gun exist?

August 3, 2001, 11:04 AM
My dad has talked about a shotgun he carried in Viet Nam that I'd love to find.

He said it was a Winchester 10ga "Riot gun".

He describes it as a pump/semi auto that is fed by an 8 round detachable box magazine and that a full auto version was available.

Sometimes my dad remembers things slightly different from the way they really happened, so I'm wondering if such a creature even exists.

I know there is a Winchester called a "Riot gun" (aka a "Trench gun") but it's the detachable magazine and full auto part I'm not sure I buy.

August 3, 2001, 12:03 PM
Winchester did make a prototype box fed shotgun during Viet-Nam. But to my knowledge there were only a few of them. And they were just modified 12 guages.

The only other box fed from that era that I can think of was the U.S. Navy prototype SOW. But then again I think that there were only a few of those.

So the odds of your Dad actually having one of these is slim to nil.

Information on both of these is availible in the great book World's Fighting Shotguns by Thomas Swerergen. (sp?)

Dave McC
August 3, 2001, 12:11 PM
There were lots of shotguns in that mess, most obtained by irregular means. Never saw what is described here, tho.

August 3, 2001, 01:06 PM
I figure the gun he carried was either a Winchester Model 12 or Model 1897...these are the 2 guns I see called "Riot Gun" the most.

[edit] or he could have the make wrong and it could be a Mossberg 590...either way it wasn't semi-auto, and there was no full-auto available.

August 3, 2001, 10:48 PM
I DO know that Winchester manufactured an auto shotgun which was supplied to Seal Teams in Vietnam. I don't know what type of magazine it had, or even the model number. I can only say that something LIKE what your dad is describing did exist in country. I also know that they were experimental, 12 ga., and only a few of them were produced.

August 5, 2001, 07:19 PM
What about the Hi Standard model 10 bullpup? No clip, but semi auto, and a "10" if not a 10 gauge?
Alledgedly some were tested over there. Just a thought!

Don in Ohio

August 5, 2001, 07:32 PM
There were VERY limited numbers of tricked-out 1100's set up to fire full-auto and used as point guns for SEAL TEAM work in Vietnam. One could have ended up in his platoon, these things have a way of happening! Who knows, maybe his memory is just a little off, but still having some validity, if you follow me!

Jody Hudson
August 5, 2001, 08:38 PM
There is a book:

Worlds Fighting Shotguns by Swearengen $40.00


Winchester Trench Riot Guns by Poyer $17.00

I did not find a reference to the Winchester 10 gauge fighting shotgun however.

The 'Nam era however, as has been stated, included a LOT of experimentation and non-standard ways of getting things.

I was in the Coast Guard and saw and had lots of stuff that "doesn't exist". Some that didn't exist at the time. I got several things custom made, one of a kind, for my job. Just ordered it. The maker put the price on it.

Case in point, I wanted a new computer. I had seen Star Trek but we didn't have any computer catalogs. It was 1970 and computers were not around much.

I needed a portable computer to run a certain series of calculations. So I ordered one. Hewlet Packard brought me one, and to the best of my knowledge it did not and still does not exist. It was portable allright, just as I ordered. I came in on two Sikorski Sky Crane hellicopters. It was about 14'x12'x50' and weighed several tons. HP claimed it was the first portable computer. Frankly I imagined it to be much smaller. It did the calculations fairly well (some things are always the same.

So the jist of this example is; that during 'Nam, there were some of us who just ordered what we wanted and we got it. Whether it existed or not...