M1 Garand or AR-15?

[Homerboy]

I have a Spike Tactical lower/CMMG Upper AR-15 that I have had for 3 years. In that time, I am gonna say I have shot 300 rounds out of it. I can't make it as much to the range anymore, and when I do, it's usually a handgun. I have always wanted an M1 from the CMP. Just want to have an actual service rifle that had a place in history. My paperwork is filled out for a Sertice Grade M1 with 400 rounds of ammo from the CMP.

Now, I don't want to hear about the AR being a better tactical weapon and lighter if I ever have to "bug-out". I don't believe that is ever going to happen, and if it does, we're all screwed anyway. I know the ammo for the AR is cheaper and the AR reloads faster.

But, for the amount of shooting I do, who would rather have an M1? Only way I could keep both is to sell a few handguns, and I only have 5 handguns. If I sell the Ar, the cost of the rifle and the ammo delivered (about 900 bucks) would be a wash, plus I have about 1200 rounds of .223 ammo that I could also sell, putting me about 500 ahead.

So let me hear the opinions. All are welcome. Thanks.

[Fishbed77]

I can't tell you what to do, since I like both ARs and Garands. I can say that CMP Garands won't be around forever, though. Barring any unconstitutional legislation, ARs should be available for a long time if you wanted to get another.

[Hapax Legomena]

Probability of CMP exhausting M1 supply in next two years: high.
Probability of AR-15 ban in next two years: low.

[musher]

Given your description of your interests, I think you'll enjoy the M1. Like others have said, if you sell the AR you'll likely be able to buy another down the road.

[NWPilgrim]

I agree with everyone above. I have both rifles and they are both a lot of fun! The CMP won't have Garands forever so if you want one it is better to get sooner than later.

If you can only get commercial ammo then get a ported gas plug (Schuster or Garand Gear) to attenuate gas volume. Otherwise get Greek ammo from CMP or online retailers, or Hornady Garand ammo from CMP or online.

[Technosavant]

I have both, quite like both.

IMO, if you're thinking about a Garand, it's time to get on it. Once the CMP runs out we'll be left with the secondary market and modern reproductions (Springfield Armory made one for a while, I can see them doing it again in the future once the CMP isn't cutting into the business)... all at higher prices than we're seeing now.

As much as I love the AR platform, there's just something that feels RIGHT about a Garand.

[TheBear]

My brain says AR-15 but my heart says M1 Garand!

[MLeake]

I have both.

If I had to choose one, it would be the AR.

Heresy, I know, but the AR is more shootable (recoil, heft, ergonomics); it is both less expensive and easier to feed (mine is 5.56 chambered, and will take most brass cased 5.56 or .223 ammo; the M1 requires match ammo or similar, and most .30-06 ammo in the stores is loaded too hot); and it is more practical (for home defense - easier to use, and higher capacity; for hunting, my Savage 99 is much easier to carry than an M1).

I realize the OP could handload some suitable .30-06, but my assumption is he does not reload, if he only shoots 100 rounds per year.

The only advantage the M1 has is nostalgic.

Happily, I don't need to sell either one.

[allaroundhunter]

I have had an AR for about 4 years and have enjoyed it. I recently inherited an M1 Garand - Springfield Armory, manufactured March 1941.

If I had to pick one, 8 shots would get the nod. The M1 is a fantastic gun, and the history is remarkable. There is a feeling that you get when holding one that no AR will ever be able to mimic.

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/09/06/gujy6ahe.jpg

[olddav]

Nothing speaks to me like a M1 Garand.
Quirky on ammo but worth it, the gun is heavy so you don't feel the recoil.

[hodaka]

I would get the M1.

[Quentin2]

It's a tough decision and I think you've already come to the right one for you. No one can fault you either way.

I know what you're saying about having a US firearm actually from the WWII/Korea era. I'm embarrassed to say I don't have one either, though do have a P08 Luger, SKS and Mosin. Closest I come is a '76 Colt Government Model (shoulda also got a Remington Rand back then!)

The Garand is now at the top of my list but I won't get rid of an AR to buy it. I'm a Vietnam vet and now a big fan of the AR-15. I'd just save up and buy the M1 without selling one of your current guns if at all possible.

[Homerboy]

I don't NEED to sell a gun, just can't justifty buying another gun when there is a mortgage and two kids. I'm thinking I'll get the M1, and then wait to see what "speaks to me". I can always sell it to at least break even, if not make a few bucks. Or if it sings to me, the Ar will go without a second thought.

Just curious, what is the value on my AR? Spikes Tactical lower, CMMG 16" upper?

Funny thing is that I have a civilian Beretta M9 (marked M9, not 92FS) that I bought cause I really like Beretta's and it's the US sidearm. But I have a 92FS Vertec that fits me better. So the M9 could go, but it would only pay for half the Garand. Something to think about. Sell a reproduction military pistol to help fund the real thing.

[Quentin2]

For a value on your used Spikes/CMMG, it's hard to say. The rifle only, no ammo or accessories, would fall between $500-800 depending on configuration (rails, sights, etc.). Look at a new PSA that goes for $750 or so for comparison.

[Quentin2]

Well it is cool to have an M9 actually marked "M9", just like my old Colt 45ACP marked "Government Model". But neither saw actual military service like a Garand may have. Can't say if you should sell it, you'll know - but I'm keeping my Colt because it's pretty darn close to an authentic WWII 1911A1. And a fine pistol to boot.

[Fishbed77]

Heresy, I know, but the AR is more shootable (recoil, heft, ergonomics)

This may be the first time I've ever heard someone complain about the recoil or ergonomics of an M1 Garand. Sure, the recoil is heavier than a .223/5.56mm AR, but it's still probably the lightest-recoiling rifle ever made that fires a full-size .30 caliber round (not counting some of the newer .308 uber-rifles like the SCAR 17). The recoil is a firm push, but not sharp, and not something that's going to tire you out after a day of shooting.

And M1 ergonomics are pretty fantastic. The rifle is almost perfectly balanced, and I can't think of any other rifle whose iron sights come up so quickly and naturally.

As far as the heft part goes...um.. yeah... its heavy. :) But probably not much heavier than your typical AR fully loaded with ammo and full host of optics and tacticool doo-dads.

Oh yeah - and to clarify - I have 3 AR-15s and I love them!

[tahunua001]

I personally prefer the AR to the M1. the M1 is a little too complicated and way heavier than I would like. 30-06 is also quite expensive, even if reloading compared to 223.

with that said. there's an little old woman that owns a 68' shelby GT500 and it's only used to drive to church on sundays and what she really wants is a buick century then perhaps selling the mustang is the better option. the buick is better for her needs.

[ripnbst]

As sweet as the M1 G is, and I want one, I'd take the AR15 every day for a shooter.

Ammo is cheaper, much easier to find, and there is significantly less risk of damaging the rifle by shooting the wrong ammo.

As something that is cool to get out every once in a while and get some nostalgia behind, yeah, the Garand wins hands down.

[Fishbed77]

30-06 is also quite expensive, even if reloading compared to 223.

If you get an M1, be sure to order some HXP M2 Ball ammo from the CMP as well. It's great stuff, and at $.50 a round, it's not much more expensive than brass-cased .223/5.56mm these days!

[HopeandChange]

If you want people OFF YOUR LAWN, get the M1 Garand. :D

[tahunua001]

If you get an M1, be sure to order some HXP M2 Ball ammo from the CMP as well. It's great stuff, and at $.50 a round, it's not much more expensive than brass-cased .223/5.56mm these days!
interesting... the first thing that popped up on a browser search was this (http://battlebagammo.com/products/battle-bag-ammo-remanufactured-5-56-nato-55gr-1000rd). in stock, 40 cents less a round. if OP were to buy 1000 rounds of HXP that would be a $100 difference in price in favor of the AR.

[Fishbed77]

interesting... the first thing that popped up on a browser search was this. in stock, 40 cents less a round. if OP were to buy 1000 rounds of HXP that would be a $100 difference in price in favor of the AR.

And we are talking 40 cents a round for reloaded 5.56mm of questionable origin versus 50 cents a round for high-quality 30-06 HXP M2 Ball Ammo that the Garand was designed to eat!

[Fishbed77]

If you want people OFF YOUR LAWN, get the M1 Garand.


http://bluntobject.files.wordpress.com/2010/04/get-off-my-lawn.jpg

[tahunua001]

And we are talking 40 cents a round for reloaded 5.56mm of questionable origin versus 50 cents a round for high-quality 30-06 HXP M2 Ball Ammo that the Garand was designed to eat!
actually we are talking about 40 cents a round questionable quality BRAND NEW remanufactured ammo VS 40 year old questionable quality military surplus.

HXP is good stuff but there is no way of telling the conditions it was stored in and that can mean the difference between ammo lasting for 75 years and lasting for 10 years. also, the garand was never designed to use HXP M2 ball, HXP made their closest approximation to what lake city was cranking out at the time.

[rdmallory]

M1.

Not that much difference in ammo cost anymore. I can get pulled .30 bullets cheaper than .224 now. Just a lot more powder. And I don't feel it is any more or less complicated the a AR. I own both.

And International Harvester never made a AR. :D

Doug

[tahunua001]

and Colt never made the M1...

not that I'd take a colt AR15 over an international harvester if they did.

[bernie]

Great question! Ultimately it will be your decision based upon what you like, need, etc.

Personally, I think the ammo question is somewhat moot, as I reload my own anyway. However, I would not have any reservations about buying and using HXP. I have shot quite a bit of it, and will probably shoot quite a bit more. It is not match quality, but it is actually designed to run in .30-06 weapons, including the M-1 Rifle.

I have had both M-1 Rifles and AR-15 Rifles. At this point, I have no AR's but do have an M-1. I like the way that it shoots. It is plenty accurate. The ammunition is much more substantial than a 5.56mm (not bashing, just sayin'...). Recoil is very managable. It is plenty "tactical" for me, 8 round en bloc clips can be loaded surprisingly fast if you practice. While I could care less what others think, it also does not have the "evil assault rifle" look to it, unless I fix a bayonet on it.

However, the AR is very ergonomic and easy to fire.

[MLeake]

Fishbed77, balance and sights are ergonomic factors, but not the only ones.

Safety manipulation: AR, hands down.

Unloading and loading: AR, again.

Quickness in moving between targets: AR, yet again.

Sights: Draw, virtually identical.

Recoil: Not severe, by any means on the M1, but enough to scrape my bare elbows raw after some prone shooting one day. That has never happened with an AR.

[5thShock]

There is no other rifle that owns the history and wears the virtues of the M1.
It's as if you could have an intact 8 foot Spartan dory found at the Hot Gates. But a Garand is deadlier than a spear and from a time closer to us. And when you get the cadence right, 8 rounds rapid at 300 yards is a dance to remember.

[bcarver]

I have both. I will not sell my garand.
CMP will run out.

[EdInk]

I would tell you to keep the AR and let somebody that is actually going to get out and shoot the fine rifle that is the M1 Garand have a chance to own it. :D

[Tejicano]

If I had to choose I would go with the M-1.

I'm just a bit old school and old Corps that way - even though the M-16A1 was the rifle I used in the Marines I prefer the Garand for a number of reasons. History, ruggedness, power... ...get a nice stock for it and they are even pretty. Well, at least prettier than an AR could be.

[rotten mick]

M1 without a doubt. Its a 1000 yard gun and anyone can hit a b-27 @ 500yards with it. While that basically the max effective range of the ar. Yes a well trained shooter can hit 500 yards or a little better with the ar. I can get a new shooter to tag a 500yard target in about 10 rounds and work it out to further targets quickly.
Were the ar is great at the 200 yards. The m1's battle zero IS 200yards. If you good with an AR, your going to be smoking with a M1.

[Fishbed77]

Quote:
actually we are talking about 40 cents a round questionable quality BRAND NEW remanufactured ammo VS 40 year old questionable quality military surplus.

HXP is good stuff but there is no way of telling the conditions it was stored in and that can mean the difference between ammo lasting for 75 years and lasting for 10 years. also, the garand was never designed to use HXP M2 ball, HXP made their closest approximation to what lake city was cranking out at the time.

Really talking semantics here. My original point was and still is that 30-06 can be found for not much more than brass-cased .223 these days. And you proved that.

HXP ammo is well-respected on the CMP forums as good quality (obviously non-match) ammo, and those guys know their Garands. Personally, I've shot a lot of HXP, and I've never had a failure with it. You're going out on a bit of a limb by calling it "questionable" (yes I know you should question everything). It's might not be made by Lake City, but IS M2 ball ammo, just manufactured by Pyrkal for the Greek military.

http://www.odcmp.com/Sales/ammo.htm

Think about it this way. The M1 was designed to shoot M2 Ball. But HXP was designed to shoot in M1s (in Greek military service).

Also, isn't "BRAND NEW remanufactured" a bit of an oxymon: ;)

[Fishbed77]

Fishbed77, balance and sights are ergonomic factors, but not the only ones.

Safety manipulation: AR, hands down.

Unloading and loading: AR, again.

Quickness in moving between targets: AR, yet again.

Sights: Draw, virtually identical.

Recoil: Not severe, by any means on the M1, but enough to scrape my bare elbows raw after some prone shooting one day. That has never happened with an AR.

I won't dispute any of that. And I will add that the length of pull of the AR-15 (either traditional fixed or collapsible stock) is better than the shortish Garand buttstock. Also the AR is more friendly to lefties. But I will add the following ergonomic factors:


Balance: Garand

Sight radius: Garand

Cheek weld to iron sights: Garand (admit this will vary by shooter)

Cleaner lines/less likely to snag: Garand

Sights: You call it a draw. I still find the Garand to be better in this respect than A1 or A2 sights. That's OK. Everyone is different.


Bottom line - the ergonomics of each platform are different, but both are good.

Again - I don't have a horse in this race. I own and love both AR-15s and Garands.

[tahunua001]

Really talking semantics here. My original point was and still is that 30-06 can be found for not much more than brass-cased .223 these days. And you proved that.

HXP ammo is well-respected on the CMP forums as good quality (obviously non-match) ammo, and those guys know their Garands. Personally, I've shot a lot of HXP, and I've never had a failure with it. You're going out on a bit of a limb by calling it "questionable" (yes I know you should question everything). It's might not be made by Lake City, but IS M2 ball ammo, just manufactured by Pyrkal for the Greek military.

http://www.odcmp.com/Sales/ammo.htm

Think about it this way. The M1 was designed to shoot M2 Ball. But HXP was designed to shoot in M1s (in Greek military service).

Also, isn't "BRAND NEW remanufactured" a bit of an oxymon:
not really. all surplus ammo is questionable quality. ammo can last indefinitely in a spam can but break that seal and let moisture and oxygen in and that ammo will go bad very quickly. since all of the HXP that CMP sells has been removed from spam cans there is no way of either:
1. making sure that the can your ammo was stored in for the last 40 years was intact when it got to CMP

OR
2. how long that ammo has been exposed to open atmosphere before it was shipped to you. I don't know where anniston is exactly but all of the parts of alabama I have been in have been very humid and I would not expect ammo to last very long unless they were in a Dehumidified store room.

lastly brand new remanufactured may seem like an oxymoron from the perspective that the brass is not actually brand new BUT from the stand point that the bullets, powder and primers(you know, the parts that all go bad when exposed to moisture over long periods of time) are all brand new, they haven't been stored in unverifiable circumstances for the last 40 years. and also, HXP is 'not much over 223"?

fifty cents is 25% more than 40 cents. that's the difference between buying a $40,000 ford F350 and a $50,000 Chevy 3500, would you claim that the chevy is not much more expensive than the ford?

[mxsailor803]

Currently, I have 3 AR's and 1 AK. I will probably sell my AK and a AR to get me one of the higher end M1's from CMP. Thats just a rifle that has always spoke to me. Kinda like how some people want a real Colt 1911 or S&W 29, I WILL HAVE A GARAND lol. Besides, it would look great on the wall in my gun room. And I will be shooting it more than 100 rnds a year.

[kraigwy]

I have both, I wouldn't sell either (or any other gun) but if I was in the OPs position, the M1 would stay, not question about it.

This rifle was made in 1941, over 70 years ago, no telling how many rounds were put in it before I got it in the early '80s, I know I've fired thousands through it.

Shot the Wyoming CMP Games in Cody yesterday and it still shoots (though the TE and ME gages say it shouldn't). I sighted in when I got it, the zero hasn't chanced in 30 some odd years.

Yes Sir, I'd go the M1 Route. Like others said, later on you may be in a position you can have both, but good CMP M1s wont be around at the prices we see today.

http://photos.imageevent.com/kraigwy/3gunwkrag/websize/IMG_01261.JPG

[Revoltella]

Nobody anywhere ever called any version of an AR "the greatest battle implement ever devised".

[tahunua001]

Nobody anywhere ever called any version of an AR "the greatest battle implement ever devised".
the only person that ever claimed that was george patton who is arguably one of the most mentally unstable and opinionated generals in american military history.

also, though it may be paraphrased a little I do recall one, LT GEN James Mattis(USMC) making that very claim about the M4/16. it is a general's job to inspire his men and claiming that they have the best tools, training, and weapons is all part of the job even if they aren't. propaganda, that's all that patton's quote ever was.

[SHE3PDOG]

Honestly, I'd choose the M1 Garand if I could only keep one, but if you sell your M9 and some of that 223 that you've only shot 300 rounds of in a year, you should be able to afford to keep both. Just a thought.

[9mmfan]

both
I have both. I will not sell my garand.
CMP will run out.
This is where I am on the subject. M1s are only going to get harder to find and more expensive. If you really want one, moving sooner rather than later would be the way to go.

I also am more of a handgun shooter, but really enjoy both. While the AR is fun, and I do love mine, the M1 is more of a "warm and fuzzy" type attachment. The respect of the history, speculating on where it might have been (sources indicate my receiver was made January of '42), how it might have served. Feeling peaceful, ironically enough, just thinking about it.

SHE3PDOG raises a valid point as well. Does your M9 fill a slot that none of your other handguns do?

You did mention a mortgage and kids. This brings reality into the picture. I was fortunate enough to get both of mine before the mortgage, and wifey and I have no children. Obviously, family comes first. We could sit here all day going back and forth, unusual for the Internet I know, but that is a simple set in stone fact. Not that you need me to tell you that.

All that being said, if you can swing the M1, I think you should do it. Only you know the particulars of your situation, however. You got some thinkin' to do friend. You'll make the right decision, whichever route you choose.

Just to make it harder, here you go.:D
http://i414.photobucket.com/albums/pp225/9mmfan/5DCF106C-553D-4833-BA9B-47522F53CDA2-14866-00000C085FCD8E61_zps3f2866aa.jpg

[Homerboy]

Well. Seeing that M1 next to the ar just sealed it

Order went out for the M1. Won't get charged for a few months

I'll reevaluate then. As for the M9 fitting a role the others don't. No it doesn't

I like berettas and have had quite a few. But the vertec fits me better.

The M9 is more for the markings. But an
m1 has the markings too and they're real

[az_imuth]

Order went out for the M1. Won't get charged for a few months

Wise choice in my opinion.

http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr348/az_imuth/Garands/f15d9e23.jpg

[9mmfan]

Well. Seeing that M1 next to the ar just sealed it

Glad I could be of help. I was worried that posting that pic might be a punk move on my part.

Told you you'd make the right decision.:D

Now comes the hard part. The Dreaded Wait. Enjoy! Know you will.

Find you some en blocs, it will come with one, and drop an empty one on the floor over and over. PING! It's therapeutic.

[tahunua001]

congratulations. I hope you get much enjoyment out of both guns.

[Sheikyourbootie]

Congrats on the M1...I JUST got mine delivered to my front door on Friday...and I'd sell off my AR before I'd sell off mu M1. Not that I dislike my AR...I just know I can always buy another one down the road (though I might have to move out of Commifornia to do it)

[Homerboy]

Got a move to consolidate my collection and keep both:

I love S&W 3rd Gen guns, because I like the manual safety that mirrors the 92FS that I am used to, and I like the mag disconnect. My current home protection gun is a S&W 6906, and my carry gun is a Shield. My home gun is the ONLY gun with ammo in the mag, although it is locked in the safe and the round is not chambered.

If I can sell BOTH of those guns and pick up a S&W CS9 (I had a 3913, and while it's thinner than the 6906, the only real difference is the thickness of the grips), I'm ahead a few hundred bucks. Sell half the AR ammo I rarely shoot, which still leaves me with about 600 .223 rounds, I am only short 200-300 for the M1 with 400 rounds delivered. I can live with that.

Now just gotta find a CS9.

[FtrPilot]

I drove to the Anniston store on Friday and bought an HRA Service Grade Special. I am shipping it to my house, which saved me $75. Alabama has a 10% sales tax. It arrives on Tuesday.

I have an AR-15 and soon an M1 Garand. There is no way I would sell either.

I am glad you have found a way to consolidate and keep both of yours.

FtrPilot

[Homerboy]

How was the selection? Heard things are getting slim at the CMP. But they're still listing the HRA Service grade I ordered as available.

[SHE3PDOG]

Glad you got everything figured out. Have fun shooting that Garand when it gets there.

[tahunua001]

most of what's on their shelves is being pulled to fill internet orders. another member that recently visited recounted a tale of empty racks and only special grades to be had. they are still catching up with internet orders and in the mean time they are being diverted away from the stores.

[bcarver]

Hey Homerboy!
Just a little info, 6 million M1s were made. Just a few years ago you could get several makes in rack,field and service grades.
Now it is HandR only in service grade. Others may be available in the stores but they are not having enough to take orders.
Only 6 million people will ever own one. Many collectors have 3 or more.

[FtrPilot]

Except for a few Match Grade - $2000+ models, the only M1s on the shelves were the HRA Service Grade Special ($950). When I arrived, there were 10, when I left, there were 9. There were no HRA Service Grade ($625) on the shelves.

Per the CMP web site:

M1 Garand, Service Grade HRA (Harrington & Richardson) Special.
Allow 60-120 days for delivery.
HRA collector grade metal in excellent almost new condition. Walnut stocks and handguards and associated hardware are new manufacture. NOT original HRA manufacture.

Even if there had been some $625 models on the shelves, I would have bought the $950 model. I could not be happier. I can't wait to shoot it.

FtrPilot

[Bigbuckeye]

North store is in a sorry state.. Nothing but M1Cs and D's...

[FtrPilot]

My M1 has just arrived.

http://thefiringline.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=91716&d=1378825766

I'm keeping both

FtrPilot

[Homerboy]

Nice! Old school vs new school.

[shafter]

I would take an M1 Garand over an AR15 anyday for any purpose.

[jad0110]

I own a couple of ARs (and 2 more stripped lowers), a Garand and an M-1 carbine. Honestly, I love them all equally but for different reasons.

Order went out for the M1. Won't get charged for a few months

I'll reevaluate then.

If priorities mean selling the AR, you could always pick up a stripped lower for around $125 or less (with FFL fees, etc) and hang onto it. You can then buy individual components a little at a time (starting with 20+ round mags) as the budget allows.

[Homerboy]

Dropped the order form and documents into the mail on Thursday 9/5/13. Ordered a Service Grade HRA M1. Got a call from CMP (never got the DBU letter) on Friday, 9/13/13, asking me to call back. Called on Monday, 9/16 and spoke to Melissa at the CMP. Told me HRA's were on backorder but they could give me a Springfield Service Grade much faster. I said OK. Got an email today, 9/17/13 that my gun had shipped, and delivery will be tomorrow, 9/18! 13 days from when I mailed it, probably 10 days after they got my order, an M1 will be on my doorstep.

I figured I would see it in March. What a shocker. Ammo and en block clips I ordered won't be shipping tomorrow, though. But I can wait to shoot it. Can't wait to actually hold it! Wife will be at work tomorrow till 4. I'm gonna leave a note on the door telling fed ex to come back after 4, or else I'll be taking the day off Thursday to be here to sign for it.

[orionengnr]

I am happy that you will soon be receiving your Garand, and I'm sure you will enjoy it.
I'm not so sure it is an either/or proposition. If you can own one of each, you should....and the sooner, the better.

Probability of CMP exhausting M1 supply in next two years: high.
Probability of AR-15 ban in next two years: low.

This was posted only two days ago, and although an AR was not used in the latest (Naval shipyard) shooting, that is not in accordance with what has been reported.

I would question the assessment of an AR ban as "low"...especially in the next three years.

This is an administration that "never wants to let a serious crisis go to waste", in the words of our former White House Chief of Staff, Rahm Emmanuel....

We live in interesting times...not that we have any choice in the matter. Eternal vigilance, and all that.
Trust me, this isn't over, and will never be over.

[Ignition Override]

There are how many companies which will continue to manufacture AR-15s, in addition to the huge number already in homes?

The AR-15 never appealed to me or my middle-aged gun friends. For us, only classic military rifles have character.

I just bought my second Garand on Aug 31st (in person-Anniston). Both came from the CMP.

[Art Eatman]

Homerboy, let us know how it shoots! :)