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dajowi
February 8, 2013, 07:59 PM
I heard from a friend that a local smith ordered some firearms parts from his supplier. The supplier told him that the parts were listed as "controlled parts" and unavailable for sale. :eek:

Has anyone ever heard of such a thing?

Dfariswheel
February 8, 2013, 08:04 PM
Most gun makers will not sell critical parts because of safety and liability reasons, even to actual gunsmiths.

If as example, some Billy Bob bought a hammer for a gun and botched installation it would be dangerous. Of course, the maker would be blamed and sued if there was an "accident".
So, most key gun parts are listed as "Restricted" which means they're factory installation ONLY.

Why not sell to "real" gunsmiths?
WHAT is a "real" gunsmith?
All you have to have to be a "gunsmith" is a Federal Firearms License to be in business.
There is no standard anyone has to meet as to actual qualifications or training.
You can get a license as a gunsmith and appoint your dog as the gunsmith.
Since a gun company has no way of determining qualifications, most critical parts are sold only for factory replacement.

Gunplummer
February 9, 2013, 09:31 AM
Full Auto parts for M-16's are "Controlled" parts. I would imagine that includes other guns too. Back in the day anybody could own them, just not assemble them.

Scorch
February 10, 2013, 12:16 AM
Remington will not sell fire control parts (triggers, safeties, etc) for many of their rifles, they have to be installed at a Remington facility.

4V50 Gary
February 10, 2013, 12:24 AM
Ruger has controlled parts that must be fitted at the factory.

James K
February 10, 2013, 02:03 AM
While some parts are restricted because of laws, in most cases it is just as Dafariswheel says, parts that require training for proper installation.

Jim

Pahoo
February 10, 2013, 11:55 AM
I know for a fact that Ruger, will not sell you a trigger group.hoiusing, for a lowly 10/22. I'm sure that this would hold true for a reciever that woudl have a serial number on it. .... ;)

Be Safe !!!

Skans
February 11, 2013, 01:13 PM
Yes, Ruger will not sell most parts for their guns - this is my biggest problem with Ruger. The Mini-14 fire-control group needs no fitting to be popped into another rifle. IMHO, Ruger has too many lawyers telling it what to do.

oldgunsmith
February 11, 2013, 04:59 PM
There have always been restricted parts that are only available with factory installation. Remington used to sell them to factory authorized warranty repair stations for installation only, but they quit doing that years ago.

4V50 Gary
February 11, 2013, 09:01 PM
The Mini-14 fire-control group needs no fitting to be popped into another rifle.

Not quite.

reynolds357
February 11, 2013, 10:32 PM
Dfariswheel, you can be a gunsmith without an FFL. Just not a full time one.

Scorch
February 12, 2013, 01:39 AM
It's awful hard being a gunsmith and having your customer wait right there, or not having to keep guns overnight. If you take custody of the firearm, you need an FFL.

mrbatchelor
February 12, 2013, 02:18 AM
Even if I work on my own gun?

4V50 Gary
February 12, 2013, 07:18 AM
Scorch is right.

Mrbatchelor - you don't need a FFL to work on your own stuff. Many do but that doesn't make Joe Hobby or Buffing Bob with his Dremel a gunsmith. Like Dfariswheel said, there is no standard or certificate for gunsmiths. The training or experience varies.

Dfariswheel
February 12, 2013, 06:57 PM
It's the position of the ATF that you have to have a gunsmithing FFL if you keep a firearm overnight, or if you're "in the business", which is usually taken to mean that you're taking money for doing gun work.

You "can" do gunsmithing without an FFL if the customer stands right there while you do all the work and doesn't leave it overnight.
Even then the ATF may frown on it.

They have no different standard between a full-time gunsmith and a part timer.
That's not the standard, the standard is as above.

reynolds357
February 12, 2013, 09:19 PM
Well Scorch, I guess thats up to ATF interpretation at the field level.

4V50 Gary
February 13, 2013, 12:09 AM
They have no different standard between a full-time gunsmith and a part timer.
That's not the standard, the standard is as above.

Correct. Like others have said, if the gun leaves the owner's possession (over night), then a FFL is required. The key is possession. Once a gunsmith takes possession from the owner, then (s)he needs to have a FFL.

Scorch
February 13, 2013, 01:42 PM
Well Scorch, I guess thats up to ATF interpretation at the field level.
That may be true, but I don't intend to have the discussion over points of interpretation with a compliance officer. If they take action, they tell you that you have the right to hire an attorney.

oldgunsmith
February 15, 2013, 05:54 PM
I don't know what the latest "interpretations" are, but we used to have to document transfer of possession any time a customer left the premises even if it wasn't overnight. If his wife left it with us, she had to pick it up. If he insisted on picking it up himself, that constituted transferring possession from her to him and he had to fill out the same 4473 form as if he was buying it.

4V50 Gary
February 15, 2013, 10:53 PM
Topic has strayed too far from the original question of controlled parts. Please feel free to start a thread in the legal forum as to when or not a FFL is required.