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JackieNeil
December 20, 2010, 12:33 AM
After buying your first AR guns, how many started to feel compelled to buy all the AR accessories - extra mags, lights/lasers, Mollie vests, bipods, tactical gear, etc. . Am I the only one suffering from Black Gun disease ?

10mmAuto
December 20, 2010, 12:37 AM
I'm picking up a stripped lower tomorrow...

Dave R
December 20, 2010, 12:41 AM
I resisted buying an AR for almost a decade.

When I bought one, I had to buy a second upper.

Then I had to buy a lower kit for the upper.

I'll get a few accessories this christmas.

So I think the disease is controlled. Sorta...

Achilles11B
December 20, 2010, 12:59 AM
I've owned my AR for about six months now. I only have a few accessories that I think are actually practical, like a light and a red-dot sight. Most AR accessories are either impractical for what I use it for or just complete garbage. Being on a budget but still appreciating the levels of performance from quality manufacturers also helps limit what I 'need' vs. what I actually need.

As for pouches, vests, and whatnot...well, I just finished eight years as an 11B in the Army, and I'll leave it at that.

Chinny33
December 20, 2010, 01:56 AM
well, you WANT to buy all the "tacti-cool" gear, but you end up doing the math and all the "gear" is as expensive as another gun, so what did i do?
I bought another gun instead!

yes, later on i did buy the tacticool stuff, new buttstock, trigger, BUIS, scopes, mounts, camo jobs, slings, bi-pods....

HKFan9
December 20, 2010, 02:10 AM
I say first comes first get a GOOD optic for what you want to do with it. My only AR at the moment, I wanted to be what it is... a short distance carbine. I for some reason cannot stand the EOtech reticle. I ended up ordering a Trijicon Reflex RX01NSN (it says this is the model designed for US special forces for the M4A1:rolleyes:) I chose it for the simple fact it was the only one with the smaller 4.5MoA dot.

I can honestly say I love my Reflex. It is nice looking imo, and lightweight on the gun. The 4.5MoA Amber dot is perfect for the distances I wanted the rifle for, and I can even Co-Witness the flip up iron sights (that I got for free from a buddy) through it if it ever was broken.

The best part is it does not require batteries, just uses Tritium and Fiber Optics. I read reports of the Amber dot washing out in bright light... that is not an issue with the polarizer that came with my unit. You can actually adjust the lens to be almost pitch black. When you shoot with both eyes open your brain still sees the amber dot projected on your target, even though your dominant eye is looking at that dot through a nearly black lens.

After the optic, I would say get the parts you feel you NEED, not look cool. I bought my current rifle used from another member here... and I was lucky enough to get a great deal. The rifle came with a Troy industries quad rail, Magpul CTR Stock, and a Falcon Ergo grip.... all in Flat Dark Earth (desert tan). At first I thought I didn't care what color it was it was a good deal.... I can honestly say the FDE grew on me, and I am glad my "black rifle" is not all Black!

Keeping with the theme... and wanting to cover the rail... I got 2 sides of Magpul rail covers in FDE, and the Magpul Angeled Front Grip. I suggest you try the AFG first before just ordering one. It is something you either love or you hate it seems. I happen to HATE vertical grips... but for whatever odd reason I find the AFG very comfortable.

Other than that I just spend my money on mags. I exclusively run Magpul Pmags in my AR's so naturally for this rifle I got a few Pmags in FDE to keep with the theme of the rifle. One of these days I will snap some pics.:D

The only other things I plan on doing to it in the future is getting the same 25$ muzzle break my one co-worker bought. This will make it noisier but it does tame the "recoil" if you can call it that, fairly nice on an AR, really it just makes the optic move a little less on target :rolleyes:, and I need to add some sling attachments for a decent sling.

WeedWacker
December 20, 2010, 02:33 AM
@HKFan9

Burnsed loop by DD is light and will fit any home made single point sling job or allow a condensed 3 point rig (I've tried both and the 3 point is really clumsy... but it's more stable). Very good quality, as always from DD

Here's a link to an ambi model.
http://www.blackbearhardware.com/ddcabuloam.html


Only thing I don't like about the single point is the floppy-ness when moving and holding something else. I like my AK 2 point sling setup, doesn't flop as much. But the 2 point on my Ar-15 carbine is not suited for such carry. Same thing with transition to sidearm, single point moves out of the way faster but flops alot if you move (that and I need to figure out where to put the flashlight, keeps bouncing and jabbing tender places if I don't tuck it off to the side which can get in the way of a sidearm transition...)

NWPilgrim
December 20, 2010, 03:11 AM
NOPE, not into doodads. I would rather have more quality firearms, optics and ammo/components.

I have bought a few AR15s in the last three years. Most are basic configuration with BUIS and two point sling. The most useful accessory is an optic. I like a 1-4x20 scope for out to a couple of hundred yards or so. A higher powered one is better for shooting groups for testing handloads accuracy. I might add one of those tactical latches that are easier to operate with the left hard.

I prefer a more streamlined rifle. I can see how a foregrip would be useful but then you have to add a railed handguard too.

Right now I have basic rifle training, and won't buy anything until I understand the purpose, advantages and disadvantages for any accessory. Perhaps if I had training with lights, foregrips, fancy slings and vests I would want them, but for my purposes of recreation and self defense I don't see the need nor have the advanced training to warrant anything else added onto it.

madcratebuilder
December 20, 2010, 06:12 AM
I'm not into the gear but spend some on parts like stocks, hand guards, two stage triggers, ambi safeties, bi pods, stuff like that. Mags and ammo take a large chunk of cash.

NWCP
December 20, 2010, 06:18 AM
I tend not to play dress up with my 2 ARs. Both are accessorized to meet their intended use. One is piston operated and scoped for hunting varmint and the other wears iron sights for personal defense. I may add a flashlight to it, but that's about all. The only other item I'm purchasing is a 6.8SPC upper for predator hunting. It will be scoped and wear a bipod, but otherwise I'll keep it as clean as possible.

rdmallory
December 20, 2010, 08:05 AM
It is almost as bad as getting an Encore.

You will need one set up for long range.
One set up as a carbine.
Then a custom one set up with all the parts you did not use on the first two.
Then you will "run" into a good deal on a lower and start all over again.


Doug

kx592
December 20, 2010, 09:49 AM
Only thing I put on my AR is a single point attachment. I refuse to put an optic on it and all that other garbage, 16" carbine with irons, Ill stick to the way its suppose to be mastered. ;)

sc928porsche
December 20, 2010, 09:58 AM
I used one occasionally in the military. I have also worked on them from time to time. I actually dislike them with a passion. To each his own.

demigod
December 20, 2010, 10:57 AM
There's a LOT OF JUNK out there, Jethro. Most of what you see goofballs hanging on their gun only serves to make retailers money.

A good light and a sling are all you NEED to have on a fighting rifle.

thesheepdog
December 20, 2010, 11:13 AM
A good light and a sling are all you NEED to have on a fighting rifle.

I second that. ++1

5RWill
December 20, 2010, 12:36 PM
I don't know about all the accessories but my first is half built and i have plans already to put a varminting AR together...

JackieNeil
December 21, 2010, 12:36 AM
Does everyone keep extra reserves of ammunition on hand for emergencies? I have 500 rounds of .308 and 1000 rds. Of .223 and 150 rounds of .45 auto . Do I need more?

NWPilgrim
December 21, 2010, 03:46 AM
Depends on what you are prepping for. If you want to get the best prices then you need to buy in 500 or 1,000 round lots. With general inflation rate you likely save money over the years than buying it piecemeal.

If you are looking to have a supply in case of future supply disruptions as we have had a couple of times since 1994, then you probably want to have a years worth of range ammo on hand, plus whatever you plan to use for self defense. If you want to be able to shoot 200 rds per month then you may want to have 2,000 rds or more on hand. If you plan to take a combat shooting class any time soon then you can go through severl hundred or more rounds per weekend or week. If you plan to shoot in competition then you need enough for monthly training plus the competitions so you could be into the thousands of rounds of ammo. This would cushion you against having to buy at panic demand prices for some time.

I shoot a lot more pistol than rifle month to month so I would want a lot more than 150 rounds of .45 ammo on hand.

But I would also ensure you have enough spare mags. Magazines are typically the weak link in the machinery of a firearm. And they always seem to fail at the worst times (thanks Mr. Murphy!). Usually I take several mags to the range. The few times I only take a couple is invariably exactly when a mag fails. I bet it would be the same during a self defense situation.

And during panic buying times mag supplies dry up too, so don't think you will always be able to just buy another mag easily and cheaply whenever one fails. Buy the best quality mags, buy enough for all your range and self defense needs and then buy some spares.

madcratebuilder
December 21, 2010, 07:30 AM
Does everyone keep extra reserves of ammunition on hand for emergencies? I have 500 rounds of .308 and 1000 rds. Of .223 and 150 rounds of .45 auto . Do I need more?

That's a good start, keep buying! I like to keep at least 2k of 5.56 and 1k of 7.62 on hand.

10mmAuto
December 21, 2010, 07:38 AM
And don't get something so nice you're afraid to really use it. More common a problem than you might think.

rdmallory
December 21, 2010, 09:00 AM
When get buying more than 1k rounds of .223 you really need to start looking at reloading.

Even with buying brass you should be able to stay under $200K

Bust price I have found on loaded .233 is about $300k

Doug

thesheepdog
December 21, 2010, 09:04 AM
Bust price I have found on loaded .233 is about $300k


Wow! Did ammo prices soar higher than gold? :rolleyes:

rdmallory
December 21, 2010, 09:17 AM
$300 a thousand rounds FMJ. :)

JackieNeil
December 21, 2010, 12:17 PM
I guess I will be buying more ammo after Attorney Gen. Holder reported today saying an alarming number of American citizens have become radicalized the past couple of years and are willing to take up arms against the government. I'm sure this report will create more demand on ammo supply.

thesheepdog
December 21, 2010, 12:32 PM
Attorney Gen. Holder

You mean that Tyrant? I bet he's a terrorist too.

JackieNeil
December 21, 2010, 12:39 PM
Also, I forgot to mention that we might not be able to chat online because the FCC is going to take control of the Internet.

Wrath of Firepower
December 21, 2010, 01:23 PM
Does anyone feel that your freedoms are eroding slowly.

Just ordered a thousand rds. of .223

ethan95
December 22, 2010, 02:53 AM
Two vests, Sig light, P-mags, Countless Forends, Foward grips, Blue Force Sling, it goes on and on. But hey, it beats the flu :D

JackieNeil
December 22, 2010, 08:21 AM
I've got 6 mags. In .308 and 5 p-mags in .223; how many do you think would be enough for emergency situations?
I'm going to get 3 more p- mags. this week.

Katophract
December 22, 2010, 09:38 AM
Keep in mind that this phenomena isn't magically the sole property of AR's. During my last deployment to Iraq I got issued a red dot and freaking loved it. I came home, bought an AK and at first I wanted to keep it simple, but that allure of red dot and tac light is calling to me. Rails might be going on my baby soon. But I'd agree with others that you want to get mag carriers and such first before barbie dolling your gun.

thesheepdog
December 22, 2010, 09:40 AM
I've got 6 mags. In .308 and 5 p-mags in .223; how many do you think would be enough for emergency situations?
I'm going to get 3 more p- mags. this week.

Seriously? I think you're a little on edge.

tirod
December 22, 2010, 10:32 AM
Buying the accessories isn't Black Gun Disease, it's something else.

After you've been there, you understand what might be needed vs. the government's "prepare for every contingency" gear set. What the civilian side misses is that not all the gear goes on every mission. It would be stupid to take items you don't need.

A lot advocate certain items, but when you have actually trained and qualified to practice more than one MOS, you see differences. Slings and lights are OK for door busters, MP's, etc. You need to ID a target, you will be handling detainees, cuffing, searching, etc.

Infantry, no. You walk past their dead and made sure of it body. No sling needed, a light gets you killed. That's the problem with blanket recommendations. They won't fit someone else's reality.

Home intruder or teen coming home late? Make YOUR choice and actually train, otherwise it's bling that weighs down the gun. How many mags? When and why? Most home intrusions are less than 5 shots. Most combat loads are about 8-10 magazines. Most survivalists have a pallet of ammo in loaded mags stacked at strategic locations. A lot of LEO's have multiple handguns in every room. What someone needs is someone else's excess.

Buying a lot of gear you don't use on a weekly basis means - you don't NEED it, you want it. Don't confuse the two. Ask a patrol officer what he NEEDS on his duty belt, he'll point out more than one item they'd like to dump. But, the squad room won't have a 100% consensus. Same for a soldier.

Telling someone what they need is like recommending a light trigger pull adjustment on the Remington 700. It's obviously not a good idea for everybody, take some responsibility about it. A 6 pound pull would have been the better thing. Too bad they can't get the word now.

JackieNeil
December 23, 2010, 06:07 AM
"It is the responsibility and the God given right of every able-bodied man, to be a Rifleman; to protect his family, his property and the Constitution, from foreign and domestic threats."
Just preparing to become a Sheepdog.

Cruncher Block
December 23, 2010, 11:57 AM
I'm a believer in the "Two is one. One is none," philosophy. Obviously, it's not to be taken literally. I take it to mean any critical or potentially-critical piece of equipment should have a backup. Stuff breaks. Batteries die.

I'm also a believer in "Keep it simple, stupid". Again, not literally but anything complicated has a tendency to become confusing under stress. Anything not needed adds weight or, worse still, creates a tendency to want to use it when it's not appropriate. For example, I've spoken up before on this site as being in favor of weapon-mounted lights but NOT using them in place of normal handheld lights.

So my "Black Gun Disease" is really just equipment I've found genuinely useful and backups of that equipment when economically feasible.

I also have a loophole for myself, though -- ammo and training are essential, not optional. ;)

Duxman
December 23, 2010, 12:31 PM
I agree with HKfan9 here.

A good optic is one of best investments you can make. (One of the big three is fine: EoTEch, Aimpoint, Trijicon)

Followed by a sling and a tac light.

With those 3 mods - your AR is good to go.

The others are really a matter of personal taste more than anything else. Although some might argue than a vertical grip or the magpul grip is also very functional.

thesheepdog
December 23, 2010, 12:41 PM
JackieNeil,

PM sent.

Wrath of Firepower
December 25, 2010, 07:12 AM
Surprise from Santa
Opened Christmas present and found a Aimpoint micro T and a 5.11 Bailout bag.

Greybeard
December 25, 2010, 10:07 AM
I have thus far been able to resist THAT rifle disease. I have another new AR lower coming shortly as part of a trade and will likely get it out of the house promptly. :(