View Full Version : SBR Questions

July 6, 2008, 05:37 PM
I'm seriously considering the purchase of an AR SBR, but I have a few questions about the process. First, if I purchase the complete rifle (Noveske CQB 5.56mm with 10.5" barrel) do I have to engrave the receiver? If I go a different route, say LMT, and I buy an LMT lower and then an LMT 10.5" upper, do I then have to engrave the receiver with my name and city/state since I "built" the rifle? Would the Noveske require ATF Form 4 and the LMT ATF Form 1?

With regard to law enforcement signature for the ATF forms, I live inside city limits. Can I use the chief of police of the city police or the county sherrif? Or, am I limited only to the chief of police? I appreciate any help you all can provide!

July 6, 2008, 07:54 PM
Whether or not you buy a complete rifle or the upper and lower separately, you would still be 'building' the SBR. What matters is how you buy it. In other words, you can buy a registered SBR from either of those 2 vendors. If you go that route, then you would file a Form4 because you are simply transferring an existing registered SBR. If you buy a lower or a complete rifle that is not already an existing SBR, then you would file a Form1 because you are 'making' the SBR. None of the vendors of AR parts will sell you a complete rifle that is less than 16" without going through a class 3 dealer and filing the proper forms. That all said, if you go the transfer route then you don't have to engrave anything. If you go the building route, you must engrave your name, city and state.

You use whoever would come out if you called the police. If you live inside city limits, that would be the city police.

July 6, 2008, 08:09 PM

Thanks for the help! So, if I buy the Noveske, it's a simple transfer on a form 4 and I don't have to engrave the weapon. If I buy an LMT lower and then later decide to purchase the 10.5" upper, do I use form 1 or form 4 for the upper? I assume I would have to leave the upper on that particular lower and not ever move it to another lower, correct? Would I have to engrave the receiver on the LMT? Again, thanks for the help!

July 6, 2008, 09:26 PM
If you buy the Noveske as a complete rifle it will transfer from your dealer to you on a Form4. This does not require any engraving.

If you buy the LMT as a lower only, you will have to file a Form1 to get it registered as an SBR, then engraved with your info. The lower is the registered part, the upper is not restricted in any way. You can move the upper to another SBR receiver, but never to a standard receiver.

July 7, 2008, 11:35 AM
You can order a SBR upper over the phone and have it shipped directly to your house without even an ID or adult signature. Some vendors may ask to see a stamped Form 1 but most regard it as your responsibility to already have one in hand and won't ask to see anything except a credit card number.

David Hineline
July 7, 2008, 09:45 PM
If not having form 1 markings on the gun bothers you, then options are.

Order through a C3 dealer in your state of residence a factory SBR of Brand XYZ and do the form 4 etc.

Other option if you do not have C3 dealer to work with is to buy the Title 1 version of your firearm through any FFL dealer then ship the firearm back to the original manuf. for registration as a short rifle by the manuf. who can then ship the firearm direct back to you since you are already the owner.

July 9, 2008, 10:06 AM
Just FYI for Therapydude2, but I reviewed both options also - i.e., buy an already complete SBR (upper and lower), or "build" my own from a spare non-SBR lower I had.

In my case, the existing SBR I was considering didn't really have everything I wanted on it, so I ended up going the Form 1 route (where you become the SBR's "maker" for Class 3 purposes) and "built" my own.

Don't know if it'll help therapydude, but I did a write-up on my SBR build here:


It covers the build details and my learning curve with it, has links to helpful sources of SBR/Class 3/NFA information, and relates my experiences shooting and training with it. Also has pictures (click on the images for a larger clearer view).

Going the Form 1 route entails having the gun engraved w/ the required NFA info (name, city & state) in a conspicuous location on the receiver or barrel. For that service, I used Orion Arms.

Hope this helps ...


July 9, 2008, 05:46 PM
Thanks guys! I really appreciate everyone's help on this topic.

July 9, 2008, 07:03 PM

To HELL with being photographed like a criminal

To HELL with being fingerprinted like a criminal

To HELL with asking an additional authority figure for "permission"

Make a trust.
(Quicken Willmaker is your friend)