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wyohusker
September 5, 2007, 06:42 PM
Looking for a cheap ranch gun. Thought that these two would flip the bill. They will be a little abused. Mostly looking for relaibility and light weight. Looking at 9 mm easy to find ammo. They might sit in the truck in 100 degree heat or way below zero (gotta love Wyoming). Going to be used mostly for packing around the achrage for rattle snakes. If it gets broken or stolen I'm not out a Grand like my 1911's.

Which one would you chose?

nutty ned
September 5, 2007, 06:51 PM
The sigma has a horrible trigger pull, the pt-111 has a good trigger; therefor,
more accurate. IMO.

Manedwolf
September 5, 2007, 07:38 PM
The newer MilPros are flawlessly reliable, and you can get them with a stainless slide for corrosion prevention. You can put Firesights or Trijicons on them if you want to.

Plus the trigger is much, much, MUCH much much much better than the craptacular one on the Sigma.

David the Gnome
September 5, 2007, 08:47 PM
I'll second and third the previous replies. My only complaint with my PT111 was that my hands were just too big for it. My thumb kept hitting the magazine release and half-dropping the magazine out while I was shooting, causing jams. I wasn't willing to completely change the way I hold pistols in order to make the PT111 work for me.

Given the choice between the two I'd take the PT111 over the Sigma, despite the grip problems. I'd really like to find a PT145 though, the grip is slightly larger and moves my thumbs to a better position. :D

wyohusker
September 5, 2007, 10:10 PM
I tend to do shooting almost every night recently. Not a lot 10-20 rounds. How rounds will these little PT-111 put up with? How many do you have through yours???

JAXX
September 5, 2007, 10:47 PM
The Sigma is a great gun for what you want. And I can tell you from experience that they have no problem with the drastic changes in temperatures we can see even in 1 day here in Wyoming. Mine is a great gun, never failed me at all. I have no experience with the Taurus, so I won't comment on it at all.

Thunderhawk88
September 5, 2007, 11:03 PM
I do not have any Taurus semis so I can't comment on that. But I do have a S&W9VE with over 2,000 rounds through it so far, and it has been perfect. The trigger works in nicely with use, and it takes the temperatures well..we have been up to 114 this summer and 5+ last winter. Both guns have good warranties.

ActivShootr
September 5, 2007, 11:16 PM
My dad owns a Sigma 9mm and has not had a problem so far. The gun is about a year old with around 1000 rounds through it. Afriend of mine had a Taurus millenium and he did not like it.

Manedwolf
September 5, 2007, 11:20 PM
I tend to do shooting almost every night recently. Not a lot 10-20 rounds. How rounds will these little PT-111 put up with? How many do you have through your???

I personally have a PT745, which is the single-stack .45 ACP version of that. And round count? Thousands. Well into the thousands. Never a hiccup.

I know several people with other Millenium Pros, including the PT111, and they all say the same thing, and swear by them. Just make sure you get a Millenium Pro, the second generation, not an original Millenium. They were much, much improved.

Only mods I've made to it are Williams Firesights for quicker target aquisition, and a Hogue handall grip with finger grooves, which cushions the backstrap especially for a long range session. It, like my bigger SIG 220, is a pure, hardcore working gun. All business. Something you can depend on to safe your life. I like it a lot.

wyohusker
September 5, 2007, 11:46 PM
My only worry about the Sigma is the trigger. :(Just have heard stories. I am a single action guy any more but I'm sure the pull is not that bad.

Only worry on the Taurus is the durability. :(Just a little gun, which would be easy to pack around.

Tend to be leaning toward Taurus.

Keep your thoughts and advice coming!!:D

Don Lu
September 6, 2007, 12:00 AM
Ive shot and broke down both..Id say the sigma just for ease of use and maintanace..the pt111 can be tricky to reasemble...IMHO the trigger on the sigma is not great but not a factor on which to buy....and please understand I own a couple taurus and love them....but for the question posed, my vote goes to the sigma.

Qwiks draw
September 6, 2007, 12:50 AM
It's been said this is for snakes. And am assuming for even the 4 legged or two legged variety.:):rolleyes:

If snake shot is to be used there can be FTF ot FTE problems that can happen with snake loads in semi-autos.Has to be tested on a case by case basis.
Either pistol model would work well.

www.jgsales.com and www.cdnnsports.com usually have used S&W for sale.
www.budsgunshop.com would be another source for new or used Smiths.

At the Taurusarmed.net forum there are a number of S&W SIGMA owners who like the gun very much and have had very good service out of their's. Not all the bad hype on the internet is true about SIGMAs.
Here's the reasoning behind getting one or the other gun.

S&W model has the 4in. barrel. Higher bullet velocity and sighting plane over the Mil/pro. Mil/pro has the 3 in.barrel. Larger,but not by much,pistols are easier to shoot and hit with over their shorter cousins or smaller cousins.

Mil/pro has a lighter trigger pull and is easier to carry for CCW,even if this is car gun. Smaller size can make it more discrete.
Mil/pro can do what the S&W can for the most part except for as noted above.

Then there is which gun fits you yourself better? Which gun is easier for you personally to manipulate the controls,fire, and accurately hit the target with?

Mil/pro comes with a safety to wipe off before firing. The SIGMA does not.
Does this matter to you if the gun has a safety to manipulate or not.

There has to be a dedication of sorts to learn the DAO trigger of each type. Learning the foibles of each trigger system and staying proficient with either will take time,experimentation,and experience to acclimate to them.

If a traditional DA/SA pistol shooter this will need a whole new way of thinking to get used to DAO pistols.

While I do have a PT111 Mil/pro it is safe to assume that your needs while similar may not be mine. Thus what works for me may not work for you.
Have had excellent service out of the PT111 Mil/pro.

Have shot briefly an older SIGMA.
Both the S&W or Taurus will serve you well despite the negative hype that happens at the gun forums.

"Conventional Wisdom" is not always wise.
http://www.taurusarmed.net/forums/index.php?topic=2419.0

Take this for what it is worth.
There are a lot of things to consider.

Keep us posted as to which way you go.

For all we know you might end up with a 6,7,or 8shot revolver instead of a pistol.:)

JAXX
September 6, 2007, 07:39 AM
If all you've ever shot are high end 1911s, then yes, the Sigma trigger will feel horrible. Otherwise, it's just like a double action revolver. It's really no big deal.

Qwiks draw
September 6, 2007, 12:09 PM
Here's an off the wall idea. Since you are a 1911 user why not go with the Taurus PT1911?

Keeps things simple as you are all ready well acquainted with the controls,fit and function of 1911s.:D

Have the gun refinished when and where you want to.

Jkwas
September 6, 2007, 12:54 PM
Mine has been rock solid reliable. Over 1000rnds no issues. When I take guests shooting, it's the gun they all like shooting the best. I think that says a lot. If you're going to go S&W, just spend a little more and get the M&P. It has a very nice trigger IMO. If they were out when I got my taurus, I probably would have gone that route, but of course they are twice the money.(I paid $268 at the time) Now, I don't think the price difference is more than $150 or so between the two. When you figure how much you spend finding the right holster, range fees, ammo, etc. it's not a huge amount.

wolverine350
September 6, 2007, 01:07 PM
I'll go for the Sigma, excellent shooters and very reliable, trigger? ya get use to it, plus smith customer service is excellent , wont give ya a run around

wyohusker
September 8, 2007, 11:35 PM
Thank you all for your input on the guns I was asking about. I was really leaning toward the Sigma after reading up on them. Jaxx :cool: you had a lot infulence with being in Wyoming and knowing the weather changes here. They seem very reliable with evey ammo and the trigger seems to get better. Dry fired one when trying them on and the trigger did not seem that bad just a little heavy but crisp. Really did not like how it fit my hand and I would like a external safety.

All that said I'm glad to say that I went with Taurus instead. PT145. :D

http://taurususa.com/products/product-details.cfm?id=40&category=Pistol

Looks like this put mine has a rail. Worthless on such a small gun.

Nice little gun. $346.00 out the door. Shoots very well, and I just could not get out of the .45 mind set. Also 10 in the mag. (How do they do that??) Hard to believe they put so much punch into such a little package. Like the trigger but is going to take a little getting used to. A lot of take up before the tention.
Also found some CCI snake loads that have about 210 pellets in them. Look good on card board box anyhow. (We will see how they work on snakes later) They cycle well through the pistol also, which I was told by the guy at the shop said that shot shells make a auto pistol a single action basically. Just won't cycle well.

Very happy with my new toy!!!!:D

Thanks again for all your input.

cabbynate
September 9, 2007, 02:55 AM
Funny, I got a buddy of mine a deal on the pt111 mill pro 9mm & a sigma 40ve for $450.00 for the two from a coworker. I shot them and I like them.
I like shooting the pt111 a bit more but the sigma is a good shorter as well.
I carry a kimber cdp pro 2 & a kel tec p32 ccw so I get a lot of different trigger pull feels and while the sigma is not the kimber, it's not meant to be. For what it's made for I think it's very good and for the price he paid....... It's great.;)

Qwiks draw
September 9, 2007, 10:20 PM
That's one of the nice things about this place and the Taurus forum.

Staff and members can own Sigmas, PT111s,Kimbers, and other brands and still have handguns they can count on and like. Many own several of each type.:)

MPanova
September 10, 2007, 03:42 AM
My Wife has put over 8000 rounds through her PT111 DAO and it has been flawless. I have put about 3000 rounds through my 10 year old Sigma and it too has been perfect. If I had to give one up though .... The Sigma would have to go ;) The feel, fit, and finish are so much better on the PT111 then the Sigma IMO