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View Full Version : Sig232 or ppk/s


turbojohn
September 1, 2007, 12:22 AM
Reliability is main concern. Gun shop says newer sig232 is better in reliability over ppk. The sig is 5 oz lighter but a bit larger for pocket carry. What the consensus...have a ppk/s which seems great except a bit sensitive to wrist lock. Gun shop says sig232 is not as sensitive as ppk to this problem. Could this be true??

michael t
September 1, 2007, 01:04 AM
I like my PPK/S I didn't care for way SIG fit my hand. I vote keep the PPK/S

hoytinak
September 1, 2007, 01:33 AM
If your PPK/S is reliable keep it. I had one and didn't care for it too much, just couldn't get it reliable enough for daily carry. I've never owned the 232 but have shot my father's many times. I love the feel of the 232 with the Hogue rubber grips plus you don't get the slide bit with the 232 either.

PSP
September 1, 2007, 06:10 AM
I have both a PPK/S and a Sig P232. The Sig is the better gun as far as I'm concerned. My Walther has had reliability issues, while the Sig has been 100% reliable. The Sig is easier to shoot, has better sights, and as mentioned, in alloy form is much lighter. I personally like the Sig grips better too, with Hogue grips this is a great pistol.

AK103K
September 1, 2007, 08:04 AM
I've owned both, now only have SIG's. I think the SIG is the better overall gun.

The PPK's are nice when they work, but I dont trust the US guns, as mine wasnt reliable. My German gun was 100%

Even without the Houge grip, the SIG's dont bite, they have a much nicer feel in the hand, and their triggers, especially in DA, are much nicer than the PPK's.

IMTHDUKE
September 1, 2007, 08:39 AM
I had this same delima. Was going to buy either a Sig 232 or PPK for my daughter. I did some research on this forum and by far there were more PPK issues than Sig 232. I too liked the less weight of the Sig. Bought the Sig, shot it, have the Hogue grips, love it with no regrets.

chewie
September 1, 2007, 09:04 AM
I have two German made PPK/Ss. Both have been extremely reliable. Although the SIG is a great weapon the Walther just felt better in my hand and is a bit more concealable. I don't have very big hands so have not had any "biting" problems.

Lunker
September 1, 2007, 09:34 AM
I know that I am diverging a little from the original question, but if you are looking for a small fixed barrel semiautomatic pistol, check out the HK P7 series. A ton of refurbished P7 PSP's have been sent over from Germany. From what I have read they are in excellent condition, and can be had for around $600. I bought a new P7M8 back before the PSP's arrived. It is super reliable and is my most accurate pistol. Now back to your regularly scheduled programming...

Dourdave
September 1, 2007, 06:56 PM
Well, now that you mention it-----consider the Beretta Cheetah in .380. I have a PPK/S-1 that I love, but it is not for everyone. Neither is the Cheetah, but at least you have a choice other than the Walther "clones".

Life is good.

David the Gnome
September 1, 2007, 07:53 PM
I bought a PPK/S and a P230 SL. I sold the Sig and still have the Walther. :)

turbojohn
September 2, 2007, 12:06 AM
What your reason behind keeping the smaller PPK and letting the lighter, but larger Sig 232 go?:confused:

David the Gnome
September 2, 2007, 08:52 AM
The Sig is too large for a 380 in my opinion. They're great shooters but the advantage of a 380 is its small size. You can't really pocket carry the Sig very easily. It's too large, too long, and has too many sharp snaggy bits on it. You have to have very deep pockets for it to work (especially if you want to carry in your back pocket). I liked my Sig just fine but for me it wasn't practical to carry over the Walther.

http://img380.imageshack.us/img380/6240/sigp23001po0.jpg

http://img380.imageshack.us/img380/879/ppksphotoshopiw5.jpg

http://img380.imageshack.us/img380/7280/ppks02smci1.jpg

AK103K
September 2, 2007, 12:18 PM
I'm not the pocket carry type, and I agree, the SIG is a little longer than the PPK for that type carry, but I dont understand the "too many sharp snaggy bits" thing, especially since the new PPK's have that silly beavertail on them now. It is nice to see that they have rounded of the back of the slide though.

If you loose the oversize Hogue grips, the P230's/232's are much easier to hide and I never found them to be difficult to shoot with the standard grips. If you need a little more, skateboard tape does wonders with no bulk or grabbiness.

I never understood the finger rest on the mags on either gun. I much preferred the flat bottomed mag on my PPK's. If your going to the trouble of going smaller, why make things bigger. Kind of like all those extended mags for the mini Glocks and other small guns. If you cant shoot them like they come, and you need to add things that make them bigger, why not go with the bigger gun in the first place?

gordo_gun_guy
September 2, 2007, 12:32 PM
Daewoo DH 380 (Walther PP clone = Sig 232 sized, but all steel).

Why pay more for the Teutonic name brands?:D

100% reliable and good finish at a Bersa Thunder pricepoint.;)

It's a shame Kimber stopped importing this line....

I always get a pinch, bite, bruise or draw blood with my Daewoo or my buddy's Walthers (I guess I'm not up to 00 agent standards). I've never shot the Sig, but after handling some in stores it feels like it may hurt less....

Seriously, I find my micro Kel-tec P3 more comfortable to shoot than the Walther types in .380; I'd interested in the Sig--although another .380 is pretty far down my wish list.

denfoote
September 2, 2007, 05:25 PM
Gun shop says newer sig232 is better in reliability over ppk.

It sounds to me like the gunshop wants to sell you a Sig, so for sure, they are going to bad mouth the Walther!!

If it ain't broken, don't fix it!!

What your reason behind keeping the smaller PPK and letting the lighter, but larger Sig 232 go?

I think you answered your own question. The Walther is smaller. Both are billed as "pocket pistols". I'd rather carry something that is going to actually fit the pocket. In fact, I do pocket carry the PPK/S. A good belt takes care of the weight.

JimK66
September 3, 2007, 03:27 PM
Boy thats a tough one except for the PPK and I sold it a long time ago because of it's lack of reliability (it was German by the way). I really like the Sig, but others just as well if not a little more:). Just to give you an idea of what I mean. I switch back and forth between my pocket guns depending on the style of pants/geans I'm wearing, where I'm going to be at any given time and the mood I'm in. :cool: My personal favorite pocket carries are: Not because they're better or more reliable, but because I really like everything about the little pistols and revolver. They are accurate (deadly up to around 35'), fun to shoot and they fit my hand great + fairly comfortable in the pocket after being there fpr a long day . The Colt SS Mustang Gov MKIV Series/80 380 ACP auto, Colt SS Pony Pocketlite 380 DAO auto, Sig P232 380 and then my little J-Frame stubby S&W 640 Centennial 38+P/357 with Crimson Trace Laser Grips.
These little guns have proven to be very trustworthy and dependable for me personally and I feel comfortable carrying any of them.
Remember, these are my choices for my carry guns that were arrived at after a lot of deliberation, trial and error, many hours of range time and not up for debate. :D
Excuse the quality of the pic's. That's the Pony Pocketlite AD in my hand.
http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i138/JimK60/MyPocketGuns.jpg http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i138/JimK60/PonyPocketlite07.jpg
Jim

turbojohn
September 3, 2007, 07:11 PM
Appreciate the photos.

Captain Bligh
September 12, 2007, 06:23 AM
"Sigs don't bite." Mine does.

KevininPa
October 11, 2007, 05:34 PM
Sig 232. High Noon Tuckable. Shorts and T-Shirt with Sam Adams Pale Ale in hand. My Summerwear.


Kevin in Pa

NCHornet
October 11, 2007, 07:14 PM
If you are getting slide bite from your Sig P232, install the Hogue grips and the problem will be gone. I use to always want a PPK until I bought my P232 SL with factory night sights. It is IMHO the finest 380 ever made. I would still like a German made PPK, but you can keep the S&W units, I believe S&W has truly hurt the reputation of the Walther. I would love to have a set of Nill grips for mine.

http://i132.photobucket.com/albums/q32/NCHornet/2-20-07005.jpg


Here is the same gun with a set of Nills

http://i132.photobucket.com/albums/q32/NCHornet/P232.jpg

KevininPa
October 11, 2007, 08:39 PM
Check out MarschalGrips:

http://www.marschalgrips.com/?content=SIG-models




Kevin in Pa

NCHornet
October 12, 2007, 10:52 AM
Kevin,
Do you have a set of these? They look pretty bulky near the backstrap, is this true? The Nills appear to be just thin panels which may expose the backstrap. By the photos it looks like there is quite a bit of material around the backstrap that may add to the bulk of the grip which works against CC.
If anybody has a set of these I would love some more input.
Thanks
Kevin

The Tourist
October 12, 2007, 11:05 AM
Size might be a concern, but I think this is a very complicated debate.

For example, when we say "Walther" (referring to some model of a PPK or PPK/s) we are actually speaking of pre-war Walthers, poor quality war-time automatics, post-war PPKs (which possibly are French Manhurin based pistols) and Smith & Wessons.

To be fair to Walther, this must be said.

As for the SIG, you must also be fair. Just why did the 230 become the 232? If a flat playing field is discussed in comparison to the Walther, then which model of SIG best represents that debate?

I can only speak as an individual, but then, I'm a bigger guy. I would choose the 230/232.

In a fair response, I would also choose a certain type of Walther. In that rendition, I would choose a modern, stainless SW.

Wildalaska
October 12, 2007, 11:08 AM
SIG is a bit more reliable, has a better OOTB trigger, is a bit larger and kicks less.
PPK/S kick more, are a bit smaller, have a worse OOTB trigger and are less relaible in Interarms versions

I prefer the SIG myself.

WildeasyanlysisAlaska TM

KevininPa
October 13, 2007, 01:00 PM
Kevin,
Do you have a set of these? They look pretty bulky near the backstrap, is this true? The Nills appear to be just thin panels which may expose the backstrap. By the photos it looks like there is quite a bit of material around the backstrap that may add to the bulk of the grip which works against CC.
If anybody has a set of these I would love some more input.
Thanks
Kevin
__________________
Carry ON!!
NCHornet


I don't have a set yet and I'm looking at the same thing you are. I do have a set of his grips on a CZ83 and am awaiting a set for my FEG SMC-380. His craftsman ship is great. As to the shape of the 232 grips I'm not sure if they are bulkier or whether it's a photo thing. I keep switching back and forth from pictures of his and a Nills and I can't tell for sure.


Kevin in Pa

HisSoldier
October 13, 2007, 01:19 PM
I'll have to shoot a Sig. My Walther S&W is very accurate and reliable. To me aluminum framed guns are throw away guns, not lifetime keepers, so I'd never pay for a Sig. That being said I have carried a Kel-Tec, but plenty willing to lose it somehow if it came to that. That Walther though, it would hurt to lose that.

KevininPa
October 13, 2007, 03:02 PM
"I'll have to shoot a Sig. My Walther S&W is very accurate and reliable. To me aluminum framed guns are throw away guns, not lifetime keepers, so I'd never pay for a Sig. That being said I have carried a Kel-Tec, but plenty willing to lose it somehow if it came to that. That Walther though, it would hurt to lose that."




My 232 SL is all stainless.


Kevin in Pa

NCHornet
October 13, 2007, 04:47 PM
Kevin,
I have emailed the company requesting some more info and photos of the backstrap. I will let you know what they say.
Kevin

KevininPa
October 13, 2007, 06:10 PM
SWEET! I was going to get around to that eventually, but for now I'm taking care of other pistols. Actually I was gonna get a set because I sent my Hogues to a gentleman in Vietnam because he's making a set of buffalo horn grips for it. Don't know if you've seen his work on other forums, his name is Kimson Vu. I'm going to be his test run for the 232. His work was posted some on The High Road Forum. Many people are satisfied. I was thinking of getting a wood set to tide me over till I get those. Right now my Sig is gripless till those come in. And I'm dying to shoot it. Haven't shot it since July.Too be fair to Kimson, he did tell me it would be awhile. Was going to get some cheap factory plastics but at their prices I might as well pay a little more and get a nice set of woods. Please let me know what you find out.



Kevin in Pa

HisSoldier
October 14, 2007, 12:14 AM
"My 232 SL is all stainless."


Now you have my interest. Looking in the auctions these are hard to find. I see one in my future possibly, though I don't like the heel mag release.

blume357
October 14, 2007, 08:49 AM
is it is heavy, according to others. I don't think it is but the specs say it is. It came (used) with the black rubber Hogue grips but I'm thinking about dressing it up now with some wood. I only carry it when I'm 'stepping out' and dressed up anyway.

Oh, I also own a Walter PPK in stainless.... I'd choose the Sig over the Walther anyday. Walther is just a little too small (Ouch!) for my taste.

KevininPa
October 14, 2007, 10:12 AM
The mag release doesn't bother me much since I don't usually carry a spare.



Kevin in Pa

NCHornet
October 15, 2007, 06:25 AM
Kevin,
I remember hearing about that guy some time ago. Do you have a link to his site? Please post some pics or email me them when you get them back. If you want I have a extra Hogue grip for my P232 I will be happy to send it to you and you can send it back when the custom ones arrive. Let me know and I will mail them out.
Take Care
Kevin

KevininPa
October 15, 2007, 07:46 AM
That what be most gentlemanly of you and I will take you up on your offer. Not only would it help me shoot, but how much do you want to bet the buffalo horns come in a week later! That's usually how life goes. PM me with your e-mail and we'll exchange info.
Here is Kimsons website:

http://www.handicraft-vn.com/shop/

Here is a thread on TheHighroadRoad.Org about his work. There are others as well:

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=298376

I'm also looking at a set of buffalo horns for my Ruger Old Army. They're the same as a Blackhawk's grips. I wanted a set of Hogue style grips in buffalo because the finger grooves will still help me maintain control, and the smooth finish will not hang up on clothing. It will also not be abrasive against skin because I use a High Noon Tuckable in the summer and sometimes my 232 is right up against me under a T-shirt. Kimson did warn me it would be awhile, so I don't know how long your grips would be in my possesion. If it takes too long, I'll order a set from Marschalgrips. I would do it now, but I just got a set for my CZ83 and ordered a set for my FEG SMC-380. This is on top of having a Limbsaver and detachable sling swivels installed on a Spartan coach gun. I don't want to push the envelope of the wife's patience too far.:eek: She's pretty good about my firearm hobby but there are limits.:D
I will gladly send you pics when the buffalo's come in and thank you for your offer. Once you PM me we'll stop hijacking this gentleman's thread.:o

Kevin in Pa

David the Gnome
October 15, 2007, 07:41 PM
Once you PM me we'll stop hijacking this gentleman's thread.

I wouldn't worry too much about it. This thread was over a month old when it got resurrected. :p

ddskehan
October 17, 2007, 10:16 AM
have them both, but the walther is a safe queen. Its pretty but bites my hand.

blume357
October 18, 2007, 04:37 AM
I'd get rid of it, but it's against my religion to sell a gun.

But then, I think the new S&W Walthers fixed the slide scrape problem.

FALshootist
October 18, 2007, 05:56 PM
My Walther was a very accurate gun with an outragiously heavy D/A trigger pull. The same goes for my cousin's SIG 230. Reliability issues made me get rid of mine (it wasn't American made either).


Personally, I think the Beretta 84/85 series is a better gun. They are just as accurate, more reliable and have a better trigger pull. The same goes for the Beretta manufactured Browning DBA 380.