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View Full Version : Springfield Armory G.I. .45 question Brazil or US


Doug.38PR
September 22, 2005, 12:00 PM
I am told by everyone that these guns are made in Brazil and am shown the patent engraving on the gun that says so. I got a then new one of these last Christmas and it does NOT have this, it was made in Springfield Illinois. Would this make this gun and any with the same a potential collectors item in the future, it being made in the US?

EIGHTYDUECE
September 22, 2005, 12:55 PM
Look under the grips and you should see the word "Imbel" there.

Imbel is the company that makes them for Springfield armory in Brazil.

I beleive the early GI models came without the "made in Brazil" engraving under the dust cover, but they were still made there. Even the Milspec and others are made in Brazil but finished and assembled here in the US (I believe, but not 100%).

Alaskanmonte
September 22, 2005, 01:44 PM
EightyDuece is correct. Springers are made in Brazil, but assembled in the U.S.A .

Doug.38PR
September 22, 2005, 03:35 PM
okay, here is what it says on the right side of the gun just under the slide in front of the grips above the trigger:

Springfield Inc
Geneseo, IL USA
WW 324##

payne
September 22, 2005, 03:42 PM
Is that what it said under the grip plates?

Doug.38PR
September 22, 2005, 03:47 PM
under the grip plates?

Under the grip plates is just where the magazine goes, it's the open skeletal frame of the grips.

EIGHTYDUECE
September 22, 2005, 04:05 PM
The Geneso, Ill address is simply the adress of the company. All Springfield firearms have that address on them.

Under the grip plates, it will have Imbel stamped close to the top screw bushing, I forget which side it is on.

I don't believe, but may be wrong, that SpringField Armory even has the capabilities to forge or cast parts at there shop.

Shorts
September 22, 2005, 04:29 PM
under the grip plates?

Yeah Doug, under the grips. You can take them off you know. Either a small allen or a flathead screw driver, depending on the kind of pattern on the grip screw. Take off the grips, probably on the right side of the frame, above the 'window', it should say IMBEL. Also look on the underside of the dust cover for the same marking.

Doug.38PR
September 23, 2005, 05:18 PM
Ahhhh! Okay, IC what you mean. Yes IMBEL is there. Why then does it say Brazil on some guns and Geneco IL. on others (like mine)?

GunsnRovers
September 23, 2005, 05:26 PM
You should also see this imprinted on the bottom of the dust cover.

All Sprinfield slides and frames come from Imbel. How much finish work they do in Springfield, IL varies as you move up the price scale.

Padawan
September 23, 2005, 06:07 PM
Ahhhh! Okay, IC what you mean. Yes IMBEL is there. Why then does it say Brazil on some guns and Geneco IL. on others (like mine)?

All of them are stamped with the Springfield address. It is simply that some of them also have the Brazil markings on the dust cover while some have them under the grips.

shield20
September 23, 2005, 06:16 PM
Does Springfield still use 2 pc barrels too?

GunsnRovers
September 23, 2005, 06:22 PM
As far as I know on the GI's and Imbel assembled Milspecs.

RickB
September 23, 2005, 06:50 PM
My understanding is that all Springfiled 1911s, except the higher-end ones, like the Trophy Match, TRP, TGO, etc., are made entirely in Brazil. There have been previous threads that seem to indicate that guns with "NM" prefix serial numbers are "made" in the U.S. (they lack import stamps), but I think the Mil-Specs, G.I.s and Loaded models come off the boat as complete guns.

Boss Spearman
September 23, 2005, 09:21 PM
Regardless of where they're made, Springfields are the best 1911s I've ever owned.

Te Anau
September 23, 2005, 09:32 PM
Springfield likes to hide the fact that most of their line is made elsewhere.This makes me not want one.I don't want a gun from a company that deceives people into thinking they bought American.Its dishonest.

Topthis
September 24, 2005, 12:59 AM
As long as ANY gun is reliable, durable and is not overpriced...I will buy it. In fact, my next one to add in my meager collection, is going to be the Springfield WW II G.I., can't wait to take it out and shoot with my Kimber/HK buddies...they laughed when I brought my Ruger 345, then they cried when I outshot them all, without any jams or FTEs etc (can't say the same for the Kimbers), and no I am not saying that the Ruger is superior to the others...just that, I would rather spend the extra money on ammo. and get scary accurate with a Quality gun.

jimmy
September 24, 2005, 10:25 AM
It bothered me at first that Springfield slides and frames are forged in Brazil instead of the U.S. Kinda like it bothered me that BHP's were being assembled in Portugal instead of Belgium. But the solid quality of the guns--like my SA WWII model--prompted me to get over this. OTOH, it's also okay with me that the Imbel and/or Brazil markings are in a less than obvious location. :)

Rob96
September 25, 2005, 06:00 AM
EightyDuece is correct. Springers are made in Brazil, but assembled in the U.S.A .

The Mil-Spec and GI are indeed fully assembled in the Brazil. Not saying it is a bad thing. Don't know about final assembly point for the Loaded models.

WESHOOT2
September 25, 2005, 07:24 AM
I noticed S&W's 1911 is all-American..........

Seraph
September 25, 2005, 07:36 AM
It's very simple. A complete firearm frame, as definded by the BATFE, ready to take other parts that will make it a complete firearm, must have import marks showing its origin, in order to legally enter the US. The Imbel/Brazil marks on Springfield frames are there for that reason. Springfield pistol frames lacking any such marks came from Brazil into the US in an unfinished condition, as forged blanks, and require machining before they can be used to assemble a complete firearm. These are the facts, as they have been confirmed to me by Springfield Armory Custom Shop.

I noticed S&W's 1911 is all-American..........
...but, unfortunately, is not all 1911. :rolleyes:

WESHOOT2
September 25, 2005, 07:49 AM
Perhaps I can be educated as to what renders the S&W 1911 not a 1911?

Seraph
September 25, 2005, 08:01 AM
Just a friendly jab, WESHOOT2, and I didn't want to get into a volley of flames, but, since you asked so nicely - it's the coil spring powered external extractor that significantly diverges from JMB's design. But I'm sure you knew that. Anyway, who made your computer?

WESHOOT2
September 25, 2005, 08:59 AM
AsI understand it JMB's original design incorporated an external extractor......naturally I been wrong before.

My computers: NEC, Apple, Gateway, IBM.

My cars are Japanese Subarus (two Imprezas, mine's a 2000 2.5RS).
My microwave is Korean, my TV is ? (Toshiba), my guns are American, Vermontian, Brazilian (yep, Taurus and a Springfield), and Eyetalian.
Oh, and a Glock on the way (American framed or furren?)

I wonder wonder what country will manufacture my hip?


Yee-haw!


Oh, ALL my ammo is American-made, natch ;)

Seraph
September 26, 2005, 07:34 AM
AsI understand it JMB's original design incorporated an external extractor......naturally I been wrong before.
JMB's design included an internal extractor, which is, in itself, a leaf spring, with a little hook on the end.

Detective_Special
September 28, 2005, 02:45 PM
I hate to bring this up again but: I bought two Springfields in August of 1990 when my then boss went to the Shot Show earlier that year and bought, if I remember correctly 75 or 100 of the newly introduced Springfields. I've been following this thread and looking for signs of the Brazilian markings, on the frame, under the grip panels and under the dust cover. But there is nothing marked anywhere. The only markings are on the right side of the frame marked: SPRINGFIELD ARMORY
GENESEO IL USA
NM XXXXX